House curve for electronic music

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When EQ'ing a system for electronic music with a lot of sustained bass content what kind of curve would you aim for?

In a quick test listening to music with the sub xover set by ear everyone was very pleased with the output but the amplifier was limiting (inuke6000). I imagine that the subs were set very hot compared to the mains during this test.
However I didn't have time to get my mic out. What I'm aiming for is to see what other people are doing in terms of overall EQ, as I have been advised that everyone is running their system non flat in the bass range.

*venue is large loft style place probably quite lossy (wooden roof and floor) ~ 100 person capacity, high ceilings and soft furnishings.
 
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When EQ'ing a system for electronic music with a lot of sustained bass content what kind of curve would you aim for?

In a quick test listening to music with the sub xover set by ear everyone was very pleased with the output but the amplifier was limiting (inuke6000). I imagine that the subs were set very hot compared to the mains during this test.
However I didn't have time to get my mic out. What I'm aiming for is to see what other people are doing in terms of overall EQ, as I have been advised that everyone is running their system non flat in the bass range.

*venue is large loft style place probably quite lossy (wooden roof and floor) ~ 100 person capacity, high ceilings and soft furnishings.
I suspect your subs will have an exciting buy very short life.
Just sayin' :eek:
 
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I suspect your subs will have an exciting buy very short life.
Just sayin' :eek:

the power is divided between 12*15" drivers so short term thermals are fine. I may have issues with overheating boxes but I didn't notice a temperature rise after 30 mins. Boxes are sealed so long term power handling is a concern but I have used them before near capacity with no issue. Boxes are designed not to just reach xmax under full amplifier power and a 4th order low pass f-3dB 20Hz is used. I'm considering running only flat to 30Hz or 35Hz if I start having issues/need more volume but would prefer -3dB@20Hz because no one else can do that and it sounds great.
 
You might spot a familiar name here: Flat Or Tilted? A Variety Of Approaches To The System Tuning Process - ProSoundWeb

At the end of the day, if it sounds good then it is good.

With regards to your low-frequency cutoff, 20Hz is cool but if you're hitting the limiters all the time it might be worth having 20Hz as -10dB, or having a shallow rolloff starting higher up. You'll still have way more LF extension than most operators (myself included).

Chris
 
Running mine the other week and blasting out a lot of tech house and minimal with some very deep kick drums. 24db HP filter set at 35hz. It didn't need to be any lower than that. These kind of tracks are very bass heavy though, i.e. they look flat in a spectral analyser set at 4db per octave (rather than the standard 3). For the longevity of your equipment if this is the kind of music being played it would be worth dialing the subs down 1 or even 2db to compensate. The audience probably wont notice and it might save your equipment from being ragged.
 
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Well as a post event report this is what actually happened:
Set flat at desired volume level, sounded like it needed more bass. Set +4dB @ 20 Hz to -4dB @20 kHz curve, this sounded better. But then it turned out the music was less bass heavy than expected and the DJ position had much more bass than the rest of the room so the subs were not even used to capacity. I did find out that drum and bass has a very high peak to average ratio on the treble though as my tweeter amp was occasionally clipping (180W peak into 100dB/1W).

*the void tips and actually metering the SPL levels looks to be what I need. A well setup void system sounds phenomenal.
 
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ICG

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Set flat at desired volume level, sounded like it needed more bass. Set +4dB @ 20 Hz to -4dB @20 kHz curve, this sounded better.

20Hz is way too deep to boost except if you've got 2-way bass with extreme infras. Hardly any music contains that. But bad recordings of amateur producers do contain noises and turntable rumble (also from samples). The subs have to do huge excursions and the VC often hits the back poleplate. That's the best reciepe to kill your subs mechanically.

Don't forget your lowcut at or very close to the tuning frequency of your subs. You get a lot more headroom and your subs live a lot, lot longer!

But then it turned out the music was less bass heavy than expected and the DJ position had much more bass than the rest of the room so the subs were not even used to capacity. I did find out that drum and bass has a very high peak to average ratio on the treble though as my tweeter amp was occasionally clipping (180W peak into 100dB/1W).

Guess, what monitors are for.. ;) The DJ should not control the EQing anyway.
 
Well as a post event report this is what actually happened:
Set flat at desired volume level, sounded like it needed more bass. Set +4dB @ 20 Hz to -4dB @20 kHz curve, this sounded better. But then it turned out the music was less bass heavy than expected and the DJ position had much more bass than the rest of the room so the subs were not even used to capacity. I did find out that drum and bass has a very high peak to average ratio on the treble though as my tweeter amp was occasionally clipping (180W peak into 100dB/1W).

*the void tips and actually metering the SPL levels looks to be what I need. A well setup void system sounds phenomenal.

Most likely it was the snare drums inducing the limiter. Depending on the sub-genre of DnB some of them have very loud / hard hitting snares. The same is true of breaks / nuschool breaks, a genre that was popular around 10 years ago but not so much now but is still going.

My system was used at a party last weekend which was mainly DnB. Listening to one of the Djs playing during testing prior to the party I could hear some of the tracks were using C1 bass notes (32.7hz). I didnt have a subsonic HP filter switched on and was actually quite impressed with how my subs reproduced the bass that deep, considering they are just 15s in pretty compact boxes. That said the system wasn't being ragged and I suspect it may have not been quite so happy if pushed to the limit.
 
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20Hz is way too deep to boost except if you've got 2-way bass with extreme infras. Hardly any music contains that. But bad recordings of amateur producers do contain noises and turntable rumble (also from samples). The subs have to do huge excursions and the VC often hits the back poleplate. That's the best reciepe to kill your subs mechanically.

Don't forget your lowcut at or very close to the tuning frequency of your subs. You get a lot more headroom and your subs live a lot, lot longer!



Guess, what monitors are for.. ;) The DJ should not control the EQing anyway.

Subs are sealed and cannot be pushed into over excursion by the amplifier so in this circumstance its OK. I did have a high pass at 25Hz so the actual boost at 20Hz was not +4dB the EQ curve was just an overall spectrum tilt.

I did have DJ monitors; however the DJ was also next to the subs (only possible placement) so using the full capacity of the subs was tricky as eyeball vibration made it hard to see. Decks have basic EQ but it may also be that the genres of music been played had less bass than I expected as it was not what I usually listen to.
 

ICG

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Subs are sealed and cannot be pushed into over excursion by the amplifier so in this circumstance its OK. I did have a high pass at 25Hz so the actual boost at 20Hz was not +4dB the EQ curve was just an overall spectrum tilt.

Sealed subs cannot be pushed into exceeding the xmax? Dude, that's quite a misconception you've got there.

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I did have DJ monitors; however the DJ was also next to the subs (only possible placement) so using the full capacity of the subs was tricky as eyeball vibration made it hard to see.

You know that these levels will cause permanent hearing damage? Aside from that, the DJ is still not the one who controls the EQ, especally not if he's placed in such a location.

Decks have basic EQ but it may also be that the genres of music been played had less bass than I expected as it was not what I usually listen to.

Yes, different music genres do have different frequency ranges. But.. See, if that happens it's the biggest sign your EQing is way off. If you can't eq it from ear, it's a good idea to measure it. Use white noise (low to medium level is enough) and for measuring take your tablet/cell etc if you don't have anything else and work from that.
 
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Chris is correct in that the amplifier maximum output only just exceeds xmax. I'm redesigning the sub system at the moment for more output and smaller box size (but more boxes).

At the levels I hit hearing damage is not an issue for sub bass frequencies. It is an issue on the dance floor but often these levels are what people want and expect. I personally wear hearing protection and limit my exposure if levels are high. Ear plugs are always provided for other people as well.

I set up using a calibrated measurement mic, get everything flat over the dance floor then apply eq.
 

ICG

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Oh, sorry, I got that wrong. Anyway, it's seriously wrong to EQ below the lowcut. It's worth looking at a spectrum analyzer, where the bass 'happens'. You can do that in advance with the music material/genre played, if you don't have the means at the location.
 
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I have converted the void recommended EQ curves in .FRD files so that they can be used as the house curve in REW. The recommendation has 30dB of boost (compared to midrange) at 20Hz so I have also included versions with less extreme boost.
 

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