Yes, it would work. The OP might not be aware that the fanes struggle a bit when driven with boosted bass (doppler distortion as mentioned previously). 2 smaller sealed boxes for the fanes and a small ported sub for < 100hz wouldn't take up much more space and would sound better, without necessarily requiring more power to drive (since the bass boost to compensate for the inefficiency at bottom end of the fanes will draw a lot more power).
Damo, I know a lot about the 15-300TC, strengths and weaknesses, if there was such a thing as a FC152 fan club, I would be the founder. I got some of the very first units, have tried them out in several ways, and they sound great as long as you have a decent DSP and all that, not disagreeing with anything you say, really, it's just pointless, sort of feels like "choir preaching to the priest" kinda thing.
Sonce, you are still missing the mark a bit, I do have the Fane 15-300TC AT HOME (well, actually now they are in storage with together with my 4 x 15" bass boxes because I am moving house, but yeah).
This is a thread for what to bring with me, in my suitcase, TO BALI. Because of so many reasons I've already posted.
Now, the debate of 12-25TC vs 15-300TC can finally be laid to rest, because my in-law thought that making a couple 250 liter boxes for the 15" was a bit much. And I understand that perfectly, most of the moving stuff around down there is done on scooters, so it's much easier to move a couple ca 120 liter boxes than the bigger ones.
The 12-250TC smaller size and cost also allow me to consider cheap but useable amps like for instance the Behringer A800, it supports both balanced and unbalanced in, and can use both speakon and regular cables on screw terminals. Not the lightest of amps, but at under 3.5kg it's not too bad. Add in a couple of grills, and things start shaping up.
I am also considering the Yamaha AG03 or AG06 as sources, since that would open up for using the setup in many different settings/scenarios. I can bring a mike or two and some cables, they have some guitars and whatnot down there, phones can be connected, and it seems the units can run without computer as a regular mini-mixer.
Sonce, you are still missing the mark a bit, I do have the Fane 15-300TC AT HOME (well, actually now they are in storage with together with my 4 x 15" bass boxes because I am moving house, but yeah).
This is a thread for what to bring with me, in my suitcase, TO BALI. Because of so many reasons I've already posted.
Now, the debate of 12-25TC vs 15-300TC can finally be laid to rest, because my in-law thought that making a couple 250 liter boxes for the 15" was a bit much. And I understand that perfectly, most of the moving stuff around down there is done on scooters, so it's much easier to move a couple ca 120 liter boxes than the bigger ones.
The 12-250TC smaller size and cost also allow me to consider cheap but useable amps like for instance the Behringer A800, it supports both balanced and unbalanced in, and can use both speakon and regular cables on screw terminals. Not the lightest of amps, but at under 3.5kg it's not too bad. Add in a couple of grills, and things start shaping up.
I am also considering the Yamaha AG03 or AG06 as sources, since that would open up for using the setup in many different settings/scenarios. I can bring a mike or two and some cables, they have some guitars and whatnot down there, phones can be connected, and it seems the units can run without computer as a regular mini-mixer.
Last edited:
... Are you *seriously* telling me to travel 1186km to the traffic hell in Jakarta, by a non-existant bus company, waste a couple of days chasing rainbows in exhaust fumes, then travel 1186km back again, on a still non-existant bus company, on roads made before the ruler was invented, in my vacation?
It will consume probably a week of my time, with all the poor roads and maintenance work, if I can get someone to drive me there!
I will have to pay for hotels and food etc.... *Does not compute*
I thought BC was where they had all the hard hitting weed, now you got me wondering what on earth are you guys smoking in Toronto?
No offense man, just sayin'.
It will consume probably a week of my time, with all the poor roads and maintenance work, if I can get someone to drive me there!
I will have to pay for hotels and food etc.... *Does not compute*
I thought BC was where they had all the hard hitting weed, now you got me wondering what on earth are you guys smoking in Toronto?
No offense man, just sayin'.
Comsider this just a real world example.
I manufacture my own speakers, I mean the real drivers, not just the cabinets as 99.999% of people, live in Argentina and regularly travel to Brazil, where my stuff is well regarded, in the Rock/Guitar amp realm.
So every time I travel there, I carry something to sell, which either offsets expenses or fully pays for my plane ticket.
I try to meet airline allowed weight and size constraints, so it´s either a couple 300W Bass heads or 4 x 12" Guitar speakers .
I do not put them "inside my bags" but they *are* my bags.
I wrap each of them in thick plastic film and thermoseal them, mainly to avoid something pushing in through frame spokes, put them face down inside each cardboard box and pack it tightly with clothes, period, which to boot protect them ... why waste space on styrofoam?
So my total luggage count in this case is 4 speaker boxes half filled with clothing plus a medium sized backpack containing essentials, including camera, notebook, chargers, etc.
Yours truly at Sao Paulo, Brazil airport, waiting for some Musician friends to pick me up.
Note the minimal and well within allowance luggage:
Not telling you that you *only* travel with cardboard boxes and nothing else, but you can pack contents from at least one suitcase in them ... plus speakers themselves and a couple power amp and smps PCBs.
Attachments
Thank you so much!
That is wonderful advice!
And you also instantly boosted the thread quality by posting a picture, and you even managed to get yourself in the frame, that is rare for us electronics people.
I have been thinking about this, but my wife wants to bring some hard to get things back to Norway as well, I will see what can be done, maybe roll a bag tight and wedge it between some gear or something.
Edit:
You got me curious, do you have any pictures of the speaker drivers?
That is wonderful advice!
And you also instantly boosted the thread quality by posting a picture, and you even managed to get yourself in the frame, that is rare for us electronics people.
I have been thinking about this, but my wife wants to bring some hard to get things back to Norway as well, I will see what can be done, maybe roll a bag tight and wedge it between some gear or something.
Edit:
You got me curious, do you have any pictures of the speaker drivers?
Well, that was not clear from your previous posts (or my English is not as good as I imagine).
So, we are back to my first advice - smaller box with 12-250TC. Maximum SPL is about the same as 15-300TC.
Yes, that will be OK.
That is why I recommend boosting only at the tuning frequency, where woofer cone is at minimum motion, so there will be no more doppler distortion than usual.
That is true, but power is not a concern.
Nevertheless, let us look at the factors involved:
The NX1000D has DSP, but it is noisy! Only balanced in and Speakon out.
The A800 has no fan = silent operation, and it has balanced + unbalanced inputs and Speakon + screw terminals for backup.
If someone manages to screw up and break stuff, I see value in the seemingly redundant connectivity options of the A800, as well as less chance of failure should something happen to the fan and some failsafe circuit on the NX1000D engages.
Nevertheless, let us look at the factors involved:
The NX1000D has DSP, but it is noisy! Only balanced in and Speakon out.
The A800 has no fan = silent operation, and it has balanced + unbalanced inputs and Speakon + screw terminals for backup.
If someone manages to screw up and break stuff, I see value in the seemingly redundant connectivity options of the A800, as well as less chance of failure should something happen to the fan and some failsafe circuit on the NX1000D engages.
small correction the nx1000D accepts balanced and unbalanced the input connector accepts both XLR and 1/4inch TR. Has anyone seen a review of the A800? I am considering a few of them for home use.
According to Fane datashets, it is just 1.8 dB less at full allowable power and only 1 dB less at all powers below 250 W.
Sensitivity of 15-300TC is about 99 dB/2.83V/1m and sensitivity of 12-250TC is about 98 dB, so the difference is only 1 dB for the same voltage input.
Max AES power handling of 15-300TC is 300 W and max power handling of 12-250TC is 250 W, so the difference from the max power is only 0.8 dB.
Kipman, I have not seen any reviews of it, but the ones that have bought it seem happy in general. If I had more money, I'd immediately jump on the img STA-400D, it has decent quality hypex modules and much better noise figures
Sonce, so you have not run any sims, and you are saying that the 12" and the 15" are equal in bass performance because they have equal sensitivity at 1khz? .....
Granted, the xmax is similar, but the area of displacement is a little bit bigger.
The 12" is content with a 120liter box but the 15" wants 225liters or more. My sim was 225 liters, I have a picture of it here on my phone, but I have some problems posting pictures from my phone, and ho.e computer is 500km away. I can transfer them to my latop later perhaps.
Sonce, so you have not run any sims, and you are saying that the 12" and the 15" are equal in bass performance because they have equal sensitivity at 1khz? .....
Granted, the xmax is similar, but the area of displacement is a little bit bigger.
The 12" is content with a 120liter box but the 15" wants 225liters or more. My sim was 225 liters, I have a picture of it here on my phone, but I have some problems posting pictures from my phone, and ho.e computer is 500km away. I can transfer them to my latop later perhaps.
No, but because of this:
In the same small box (say, 120 liters) the low end is comparable between the two. If you can manage box with double volume, go for it, the 15" will have deeper bass.
Edit: Sensitivity of 12" is 98 dB from 100 Hz to 1 kHz, sensitivity for 15" is 99 dB from 50 Hz to 1 kHz. The 12-250TC will be just 1 dB less loud than 15-300TC from 100 Hz to 1 kHz, up to 250W. 15-300TC can deliver deeper and louder bass below 100 Hz, but only in a bigger box.
Last edited:
It is not the first time I have mentioned bigger size box for the 15", it does not have the parameters to do well in 120liters, and the 12" will not give much more no matter what box. If you run a simulation you will also see the 15" has 4-5db more output overal from 200-300hz down.
But this is ridiculous, the driver will be the 12", so why are you coming with these arguments now?
Makes me think you are more interested in winning some lame argument rather than looking at facts.
But this is ridiculous, the driver will be the 12", so why are you coming with these arguments now?
Makes me think you are more interested in winning some lame argument rather than looking at facts.
Having just skimmed over this thread a few observations:
Check with your airline whether they will let you travel with those magnets in your baggage IIRC there are regulations on magnet field strengths and some airlines may just find it easier to ban passengers carrying them.
All balanced inputs can be wired as unbalanced by connecting the cold pin to the screen, ie. pin 1-3.
A larger cone with the same travel is capable of moving more air, that can be used to extend the low end response or reduce cone excursion.
Putting these 'hi q' drivers into small ported boxes will result in a hump above the tuning and reduced output at tuning, both can be compensated for with eq.
12-250tc in a 40 - 50 litre box tuned to around 55Hz - 65Hz will handle approx 250 Wrms, bigger box and you will loose power handling due to excursion, former more useful for high SPL use with more powerful amp.
Kaffiman, I take it you haven't had a go with the foam yet?
Check with your airline whether they will let you travel with those magnets in your baggage IIRC there are regulations on magnet field strengths and some airlines may just find it easier to ban passengers carrying them.
All balanced inputs can be wired as unbalanced by connecting the cold pin to the screen, ie. pin 1-3.
A larger cone with the same travel is capable of moving more air, that can be used to extend the low end response or reduce cone excursion.
Putting these 'hi q' drivers into small ported boxes will result in a hump above the tuning and reduced output at tuning, both can be compensated for with eq.
12-250tc in a 40 - 50 litre box tuned to around 55Hz - 65Hz will handle approx 250 Wrms, bigger box and you will loose power handling due to excursion, former more useful for high SPL use with more powerful amp.
Kaffiman, I take it you haven't had a go with the foam yet?
There you are
Ofcourse I was thinking of grills and ocf! perfect for this little project!
And the very first thing that came to mind was the wonderful Fane FR units, but I keep trying to find better things at the cheap end of the scale, my OCD for have to beat the Fane value for money reference at some point.
Maybe next time.
I will be sure to get the sims up and running on my laptop, maybe I have time for it ca 22:30 this evening. I remember most of the numbers so it should be quick.
Ofcourse I was thinking of grills and ocf!
perfect for this little project!And the very first thing that came to mind was the wonderful Fane FR units, but I keep trying to find better things at the cheap end of the scale, my OCD for have to beat the Fane value for money reference at some point.
Maybe next time.
I will be sure to get the sims up and running on my laptop, maybe I have time for it ca 22:30 this evening. I remember most of the numbers so it should be quick.
I was thinking perhaps the Yamaha AG03 or AG06 had HP filters, thought I read something about it, will have to check. Getting a cheap dsp like the 4*4 one from thomann is still on the table.
But then again it might be better to have an analog solution.
Undecided, will have to check the alternatives properly.
I just got gome from work 23:40 last night, gonna use today figuring stuff out and hopefully start ordering parts.
Edit:
Small note on why the w5-1611sa broke. He was impressed with the bass those little things made, and he was watching the glass in the windows vibrate.... Then I did not get any more messages, probably because he broke them.
But then again it might be better to have an analog solution.
Undecided, will have to check the alternatives properly.
I just got gome from work 23:40 last night, gonna use today figuring stuff out and hopefully start ordering parts.
Edit:
Small note on why the w5-1611sa broke. He was impressed with the bass those little things made, and he was watching the glass in the windows vibrate.... Then I did not get any more messages, probably because he broke them.
Last edited:
- Status
- This old topic is closed. If you want to reopen this topic, contact a moderator using the "Report Post" button.