Actually I think it is the opposite, pro sound speakers systems are often 10-15db more sensitive than home audio boxes and are therefore more revealing at very low power levels. This sensitivity is something that is appreciated by a small segment of the hi-fi community that favor low power amplifiers(the first watt), these systems will often include some very large horns too.
In comparison the average home audio speaker can mask a lot of things which can sometimes make them sound better than what they really are. When I was an active DJ I found I had to audition new music on the big system as it would sometimes expose poor production or background noise that wasn't obvious on my home system.
I own a variety of modern powered PA speakers including a set of Yamaha DXR15's which I rate very highly, but my favorite is my larger passive rig. I'd rate this system as very hi-fi with relatively flat response form about 35hz to 15khz with subs. I credit much of the fidelity of this system to the 2" exit B&C compression drivers and waveguides, with these drivers handling everything from 1khz up the cohesion and detail is better than any other system I have owned. These are Yorkville boxes powered by about 6kw of Yamaha amplifiers and processed by a Behringer DCX.
Tannoy CMS1201DC ceiling speaker
Does anyone know anything about this particular loudspeaker or perhaps has heard it somewhere?
It looks like the regular PA type Tannoy with perhaps two things different.
the waveguide and the tweeter magnet being neodymium instead of ferrite.
They were introduced around 2010 but cant find any impressions on it.
Thanks and regards, Veeren
Does anyone know anything about this particular loudspeaker or perhaps has heard it somewhere?
It looks like the regular PA type Tannoy with perhaps two things different.
the waveguide and the tweeter magnet being neodymium instead of ferrite.
They were introduced around 2010 but cant find any impressions on it.
Thanks and regards, Veeren
15" 2 way speakers can't be/sound very good because of the big off axis response gap between the woofer and tweeter. A 12" with a very good (expensive) tweeter can do it, but better look for smaller woofers. With cheaper speakers the ones with the smallest woofers often sound best and get yourself a sub for the lows.
There are some reasons why I like using pa-speakers too, in my home. Ofcourse, made out of best components available for best possible SQ (I mostly design my own speakers, for "hifi" and PA-use).
Anyway, PA speaker really do better those tiny nyances and tiny details. You may hear them from hifi-speaker, but PA-speaker slams them to your face!
With hifi-speaker, you listen the music. The singer is somewhere there.
With pa-speaker, you are in it. The singer, she or he's right in front of you! Just close your eyes and forget everything else, you are part of the music now.
There is reason for this.
Let's think about some high quality 2" mid/high freq drivers. Having 4 inch lightweight titanium cone and much more motor force (BL) than any "hifi" bass driver!
These kind of speakers/drivers will precisely follow the incoming signal and plays everything from it. Transient response is so much better compared to typical hifi-speaker/driver.
Don't get me wrong, many "basic" PA-speakers on the market are pretty much crap when it comes to SQ. Like those typical cheap 1-2x15" + horn combinations. No good. Ah and those really cheap Skytec, Malone etc PA-stuff which are pretty much a really bad joke.. (why are they doing such a junk?!)
But there are PA components and speakers available having best possible quality, even at high-end or hifi standards!
I also have a pair of old JBL SR4722A's, one example of pretty good quality PA speaker. JBL 2206H + JBL 2417H drivers used and these are highly rated. JBL used to make good stuff back then.. not so sure anymore as it's mostly chinese stuff as far as I know.
hifi quality and loud? Yes it is possible. And with PA stuff, the best part is that there is no snake oil add-ons in price tags. Only thing that costs, is the real quality.
Anyway, PA speaker really do better those tiny nyances and tiny details. You may hear them from hifi-speaker, but PA-speaker slams them to your face!
With hifi-speaker, you listen the music. The singer is somewhere there.
With pa-speaker, you are in it. The singer, she or he's right in front of you! Just close your eyes and forget everything else, you are part of the music now.
There is reason for this.
Let's think about some high quality 2" mid/high freq drivers. Having 4 inch lightweight titanium cone and much more motor force (BL) than any "hifi" bass driver!
These kind of speakers/drivers will precisely follow the incoming signal and plays everything from it. Transient response is so much better compared to typical hifi-speaker/driver.
Don't get me wrong, many "basic" PA-speakers on the market are pretty much crap when it comes to SQ. Like those typical cheap 1-2x15" + horn combinations. No good. Ah and those really cheap Skytec, Malone etc PA-stuff which are pretty much a really bad joke.. (why are they doing such a junk?!)
But there are PA components and speakers available having best possible quality, even at high-end or hifi standards!
I also have a pair of old JBL SR4722A's, one example of pretty good quality PA speaker. JBL 2206H + JBL 2417H drivers used and these are highly rated. JBL used to make good stuff back then.. not so sure anymore as it's mostly chinese stuff as far as I know.
hifi quality and loud? Yes it is possible. And with PA stuff, the best part is that there is no snake oil add-ons in price tags. Only thing that costs, is the real quality.
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"hifi quality and loud? Yes it is possible. And with PA stuff, the best part is that there is no snake oil add-ons in price tags. Only thing that costs, is the real quality."
^This!
And by DIY one can build enclosures that don't look like PA!
So absolutely, PA speakers at home are great if there is enough space for relatively large speakers. Low distortion and great dynamics are addictive, gotta listen 24/7
^This!
And by DIY one can build enclosures that don't look like PA!
So absolutely, PA speakers at home are great if there is enough space for relatively large speakers. Low distortion and great dynamics are addictive, gotta listen 24/7
Thank you for all your answers! At the moment I am happy with my JBL studio 530 loudspeakers that use the JBL2414H CD. The same CD is also used in the cheaper JBL pro lines.
Here in Portugal it is very difficult to find any good second hand PA speakers. They advertise as being in very good condition and when you look at them that is not the case at all.
Anybody know anything about the D.A.S audio 15BCX coaxial loudspeaker?
Best regards,
Veeren
Here in Portugal it is very difficult to find any good second hand PA speakers. They advertise as being in very good condition and when you look at them that is not the case at all.
Anybody know anything about the D.A.S audio 15BCX coaxial loudspeaker?
Best regards,
Veeren
That is EXACTLY what I have been experiencing since I switched to PA speakers.
Here is my "rant" for PA speakers. Mainly pros:
They use larger cones and more accoustical loading. That has something to do with fidelity and dispersion. For the same SPL with smaller cone, hi-fi speakr has to do more excursion. In fact, that means greater speed of the cone to accomplish the cycle moving at greater speed. That means more input power most of the time, power compression, distortion due to the nonlinearities of the suspension system, more energy wasted on braking already large moving mass moving at great speed with not very strong motor, doppler issues and more. Dispersion, distortion and dynamics suffer unless one goes equally big, for which PA is punished for home hi-fi.
A lot of modern speakers really came to an existence after some applied science. One never knows if this is the case with hi-fi. There is not much of "white papers" release for new thing in hi-fi.
Modern PA speakers with great motor force have double the advantage of the motor force. Not only there is more sensitivity and less power compression, and more dynamic range, but as the force per Watt increases, influence of the mechanical issues and nonlinearities like Mms and Cms DECREASES. You can see that partly on Qes/Qts ratio. The more you get to 1, the less important the Qms and Mms is.
On the other hand, PA is still made for SPL, and there are disadvantages. I haven't heard a lot of PA systems off the shelf which I would like to have for home hi-fi. And I'm not completely sure about those I would like, because of listening circumstances.
I fell in love with EAW KF394NT though.
Other than that, I regularly build my audio from PA components with success.
Hi-fi obviously has its place. It is just easier and cheaper for me to get good results from PA drivers...
They use larger cones and more accoustical loading. That has something to do with fidelity and dispersion. For the same SPL with smaller cone, hi-fi speakr has to do more excursion. In fact, that means greater speed of the cone to accomplish the cycle moving at greater speed. That means more input power most of the time, power compression, distortion due to the nonlinearities of the suspension system, more energy wasted on braking already large moving mass moving at great speed with not very strong motor, doppler issues and more. Dispersion, distortion and dynamics suffer unless one goes equally big, for which PA is punished for home hi-fi.
A lot of modern speakers really came to an existence after some applied science. One never knows if this is the case with hi-fi. There is not much of "white papers" release for new thing in hi-fi.
Modern PA speakers with great motor force have double the advantage of the motor force. Not only there is more sensitivity and less power compression, and more dynamic range, but as the force per Watt increases, influence of the mechanical issues and nonlinearities like Mms and Cms DECREASES. You can see that partly on Qes/Qts ratio. The more you get to 1, the less important the Qms and Mms is.
On the other hand, PA is still made for SPL, and there are disadvantages. I haven't heard a lot of PA systems off the shelf which I would like to have for home hi-fi. And I'm not completely sure about those I would like, because of listening circumstances.
I fell in love with EAW KF394NT though.
Other than that, I regularly build my audio from PA components with success.
Hi-fi obviously has its place. It is just easier and cheaper for me to get good results from PA drivers...
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Once there was a rather big two-way JBL speaker with a 15" woofer and a horn that resembled an a**. It's frontal aspect was rather square than rectanguar, and the woofer was arranged asymetrically. Rumours went that it sounded really fine, and had a high efficiency, too. Unfortunately I don't recall it's denomination ...
Does anyone else out there remember? Are it's drivers still available? Are there any construction drawings?
Best regards!
Edit: Found it. I think it was the 4430.
...Does anyone else out there remember? Are it's drivers still available? Are there any construction drawings?
Best regards!
Edit: Found it. I think it was the 4430.
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My PA system is Peavey SP2G's with EV 18" band pass subs, I love setting up early in a club and listening to it at low volumes.
Quite often I'll get requests to play someones favorite song.
I think it rivals any home systems I have heard, too big for inside my house unless I had a 20x40 room.
Quite often I'll get requests to play someones favorite song.
I think it rivals any home systems I have heard, too big for inside my house unless I had a 20x40 room.
JBL MRX 515 for home HiFi use?
Dear all,
I am considering buying a pair of JBL MRX 515 loudspeakers for about €500,-
My only concern is if they will play well at lower levels like up to 90db and not loose low level detail and dynamics.
Any information about this would be highly appreciated so thanks in advance!
Dear all,
I am considering buying a pair of JBL MRX 515 loudspeakers for about €500,-
My only concern is if they will play well at lower levels like up to 90db and not loose low level detail and dynamics.
Any information about this would be highly appreciated so thanks in advance!
It can be done. Pi Speakers, run by Wayne Parham, have been making finished speakers for Hi Fi using pro drivers as well a selling kits for a long time. I have a pair of his model 3 with upgraded drivers,a B and C horn driver and Eminence Definimax 4012 woofer. The HF horn used was developed by Wayne.
I built the boxes using a lot of bracing and built the crossovers from good quality parts. I built them as an experiment after getting fed up with the sound of most moderately priced tall narrow tower speakers. The sound was much better than I had expected and I have been using them for 5 years now. Dynamics are a big improvement over what I had and they play loud and clean without strain. The directivity is fairly constant with the horn and the 12” woofer in a wide enclosure having close to the same coverage at crossover. These are the first speakers I have owned that I don’t have to worry about blowing drivers when I turn it up. High efficiency + high power handling = piece of mind when playing it loud.
Worth looking into if you are interested in DIY.
I built the boxes using a lot of bracing and built the crossovers from good quality parts. I built them as an experiment after getting fed up with the sound of most moderately priced tall narrow tower speakers. The sound was much better than I had expected and I have been using them for 5 years now. Dynamics are a big improvement over what I had and they play loud and clean without strain. The directivity is fairly constant with the horn and the 12” woofer in a wide enclosure having close to the same coverage at crossover. These are the first speakers I have owned that I don’t have to worry about blowing drivers when I turn it up. High efficiency + high power handling = piece of mind when playing it loud.
Worth looking into if you are interested in DIY.
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