Hi everybody
I am currently working on a portable speaker system consisting of 2 speakers. Each speaker will be loaded with a light 12" speaker along with an ASD1001 horndriver.
Now before going any further with the details and my questions. You have to know exactly what I am heading for.
Next year I'm moving into an apartment far away from my current location. I won't be having much space, nor a car to transport heavy speakers. So I'd like to make a system, that I can take to the streets or to other people's apartments or gardens to fire up some tunes. This will therefore require LOW WEIGHT.
Obviously I'd like a nice sounding speaker - But it will primarily be used for wild partying. So high SPL is more important, and since these will be used WITHOUT subs at all time, the driver must be able to produce a decent amount of low-end. When the speakers are used, they'll be lying on the ground like monitors, pointing slightly upwards at the crowd (like the speaker on the picture below - pointing a bit more downwards though. This way I can get more bass, than if they we're on a stand. When indoors they're gonne be placed on the ground up against a wall (in the corners if possible) to achieve maximum bass response.
This leaves me with 3 priorities (in this order): High SPL, portability and sound quality.
http://www.eighteensound.com/Portals/0/EnclosuresKits/18_Sound_12_2_Ways_v1.pdf
I think I'll use the speaker design from the link above as a template and change it to my needs. I think I'll change the shape a bit, but the height is pretty good. If the total height of two speakers stacked is about 120cm, that would be great. Then I can just add a handle at the end of the top speaker.
The two speakers I'm building will be identical, except one will be slightly bigger to allow me to install a batterypack, amp and DSP inside the speaker. This will make the bigger speaker the "mother" speaker. To ease transportation, I'll put wheels on the mother speaker, and make them stackable, so I can drag then along with me (Like a suitcase).
SOOOO the questions!
1. Which of the following drivers would you recommend me using. I wan't both high xmax, good efficiency and low weight. (They're 4 ohm, neodymium drivers)
- Faital Pro 12PR300 (low xmax, very low weight)
- Faital Pro 12FH500 (high xmax, high weight)
- B&C 12CL76 (decent xmax, decent weight)
I think the last is my favorite, but which one do you reckon would go well with the 1" ASD1001 horndriver.
2. What do you think of the cabinet design?
3. How big (liters) would you recommend the cabinet should be for this driver?
4. Can I build it with high-quality 12mm birch plywood and extra bracing to lower weight? Or does it have to be 15mm?
5. If you have any suggestions to how I could improve this build. I'm open to hear them!
I'll update you guys about my progress!
NOTE:
The amplifier, battery and dsp is already decided. I'm building a batterypack using 18650 cells and a SURE 2x300w module to drive it. I'll be using a miniDSP to EQ, high-pass, limit and to adjust volume (The miniDSP allows me to add a potentiometer).
I am currently working on a portable speaker system consisting of 2 speakers. Each speaker will be loaded with a light 12" speaker along with an ASD1001 horndriver.
Now before going any further with the details and my questions. You have to know exactly what I am heading for.
Next year I'm moving into an apartment far away from my current location. I won't be having much space, nor a car to transport heavy speakers. So I'd like to make a system, that I can take to the streets or to other people's apartments or gardens to fire up some tunes. This will therefore require LOW WEIGHT.
Obviously I'd like a nice sounding speaker - But it will primarily be used for wild partying. So high SPL is more important, and since these will be used WITHOUT subs at all time, the driver must be able to produce a decent amount of low-end. When the speakers are used, they'll be lying on the ground like monitors, pointing slightly upwards at the crowd (like the speaker on the picture below - pointing a bit more downwards though. This way I can get more bass, than if they we're on a stand. When indoors they're gonne be placed on the ground up against a wall (in the corners if possible) to achieve maximum bass response.
This leaves me with 3 priorities (in this order): High SPL, portability and sound quality.
http://www.eighteensound.com/Portals/0/EnclosuresKits/18_Sound_12_2_Ways_v1.pdf
I think I'll use the speaker design from the link above as a template and change it to my needs. I think I'll change the shape a bit, but the height is pretty good. If the total height of two speakers stacked is about 120cm, that would be great. Then I can just add a handle at the end of the top speaker.
The two speakers I'm building will be identical, except one will be slightly bigger to allow me to install a batterypack, amp and DSP inside the speaker. This will make the bigger speaker the "mother" speaker. To ease transportation, I'll put wheels on the mother speaker, and make them stackable, so I can drag then along with me (Like a suitcase).
SOOOO the questions!
1. Which of the following drivers would you recommend me using. I wan't both high xmax, good efficiency and low weight. (They're 4 ohm, neodymium drivers)
- Faital Pro 12PR300 (low xmax, very low weight)
- Faital Pro 12FH500 (high xmax, high weight)
- B&C 12CL76 (decent xmax, decent weight)
I think the last is my favorite, but which one do you reckon would go well with the 1" ASD1001 horndriver.
2. What do you think of the cabinet design?
3. How big (liters) would you recommend the cabinet should be for this driver?
4. Can I build it with high-quality 12mm birch plywood and extra bracing to lower weight? Or does it have to be 15mm?
5. If you have any suggestions to how I could improve this build. I'm open to hear them!
I'll update you guys about my progress!
NOTE:
The amplifier, battery and dsp is already decided. I'm building a batterypack using 18650 cells and a SURE 2x300w module to drive it. I'll be using a miniDSP to EQ, high-pass, limit and to adjust volume (The miniDSP allows me to add a potentiometer).
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Are you good with driver parameters? Cause all I really know is xmax, xlim and watts-rating. When you look at them, I'd like to hear how they compare, and how they would sound different from eachother? Presumably in a cabinet alike the one i posted about. Perhaps 40-45 liters (Not sure yet)
Cabinet design I'll be using as a template (Which I'll change in size etc. to fit my needs)
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There are more knowledgeable members than I when it comes to dealing with T/S parameters.
Just thought I'd start off the replies to your thread. You'd maybe get more replies over on the multiway speaker forum.
Corners usually excite room modes. Corners are only good if the room does not resonate, like if proper bass traps are installed. Nothing is for free.
What is the intended tuning frequency? What crossover frequency?
I would go for the most SPL per watt on the driver, giving up some x-max. Those class D amp modules really don’t put out that much power - since the peak voltage cannot exceed the Battery voltage. Even in bridge mode a 48 volt battery pack nets you 144 watts into each 8 ohm driver. Less voltage even less power. How much x-Max could you possibly use, maybe 4 or 5 mm? You won’t be going down crazy deep in a 2 cubic foot box, 60 hz may be a good compromise. And not all the power goes into the lowest frequency so you could get by with less excursion. Neo driver may be a good idea - there are a few out there that can do 98 or 99 dB/W and still take all the power you would be throwing at them.
Also don’t try to get by too cheap on the tweeter. Those little 1 inch coil units may have nice top end sparkle, but you will be blowing them out often. At last get something with a 1.75 inch VC and you’ll only be buying them once. They can be had for $40.
Also don’t try to get by too cheap on the tweeter. Those little 1 inch coil units may have nice top end sparkle, but you will be blowing them out often. At last get something with a 1.75 inch VC and you’ll only be buying them once. They can be had for $40.
Choose the woofer to as well as possible match the power of your amping.
If the woofer is good at taking 5 x as much power, it will most likely have lower efficiency while you won' t be utilizing it' s power capabilities. If the woofer cannot take what the amp is able to give it, you may have to replace it from time to time.
If the woofer is good at taking 5 x as much power, it will most likely have lower efficiency while you won' t be utilizing it' s power capabilities. If the woofer cannot take what the amp is able to give it, you may have to replace it from time to time.
Yea - But don't you think I'll run out of xmax before the power rating? Usually in subs (which is the only type of cabinets I've built) that is what we're looking at.
And in terms of efficiency. When it comes to subs, the numbers posted by the manufacturer. Are they in any way reliable? Will I get more dB from a driver that says 100dB vs 98dB or are these numbers different once put in the cabinet I'm going to use?
I'm 22 years old when I move to my university across my country and basically these speakers are gonna be used for uni-parties. It doesn't have to sound GOOD. It just have to be loud. I'm still gonna use my microphone to calibrate the speaker and do what I can to still keep up the quality. But since this is for bass-music. I'll take advantage of room modes.
Well. Tbh I'd like to know what tuning frequency and crossover you suggest. I guess it depends on my selection of driver. You can see in my earlier post that I linked to a cabinet, which I'll change to my needs. Probably something similar in size. I'm guessing 40-45 liters will do
Thank you very much for the reponse.
Good thoughts. I've found a selection of different 4 ohm neo-drivers. This gives me 288w to each driver. With this in mind. Won't it be a good idea to go for decent xmax?
And I have the tweeters already. I could go for a couple of new tweeters, but that wouldn't make sense for me. These are very light and that is exactly what I need
I'll have a limiter on everything. Maybe I'll get a second amp for the horn-drivers. And then cross with my DSP.
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Reproducing bassy music, 45 L cabinet volume and high efficiency do not go together. You have to compromise on something. I would compromise on bass extension and EQ it back (only) when high SPL isn't necessary. This can be implemented with a dynamic EQ.
Using an exciter like the MaxBass algorithm can further increase perceived bass. If I remember correctly the SoundBoks uses this trick.
Using an exciter like the MaxBass algorithm can further increase perceived bass. If I remember correctly the SoundBoks uses this trick.
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Now that you've settled on the 12CL76 driver, why not go with its recommended enclosure volume of 40 litres and reflex port tuning frequency of 60Hz?
This should be more than adequate for your application - sometimes you can overthink these things!
If you need help with the reflex port dimensions, then just ask.
Note that 40 litres will be the internal volume of the enclosure.
Looks like we're back to the original thread in the PA Systems forum!
May I suggest that you ask members to concentrate on a cabinet design for the 12CL76 driver?
The application which you mention (portable speaker system), although interesting, may distract contributors from the main issue.
May I suggest that you ask members to concentrate on a cabinet design for the 12CL76 driver?
The application which you mention (portable speaker system), although interesting, may distract contributors from the main issue.
You are obsessed with X Max
useful somewhere else, forget about it in a small box (which will limit cone movement anyway) relatively low power system.
Check actual curves , the "single number" SPL rating is *misleading*, check and you´ll see that the "98dB" woofer actually meets that .... from 200 to 1000Hz that is , but NOT at 40/60 Hz , you will also see that you heavily pay for extended X Max with greatly reduced output "everywhere else", meaning all low/mid/high mids where most of your acoustic content will be anyway.
Just a small detail: the "1 inch" driver spec refers to throat diameter, actual voice coil is larger: 33mm (1.3").
Of course, a 4400 (1.75") VC is way larger and presumably better.
In any case I would add a series protection lightbulb (if crossover does not already include it) ...... given the "wild Party" spec that is
useful somewhere else, forget about it in a small box (which will limit cone movement anyway) relatively low power system.
Check actual curves , the "single number" SPL rating is *misleading*, check and you´ll see that the "98dB" woofer actually meets that .... from 200 to 1000Hz that is
, but NOT at 40/60 Hz , you will also see that you heavily pay for extended X Max with greatly reduced output "everywhere else", meaning all low/mid/high mids where most of your acoustic content will be anyway.Just a small detail: the "1 inch" driver spec refers to throat diameter, actual voice coil is larger: 33mm (1.3").
Of course, a 4400 (1.75") VC is way larger and presumably better.
In any case I would add a series protection lightbulb (if crossover does not already include it) ...... given the "wild Party" spec that is
Thank you for your input. And yea. This project may be a bit of a mouthful for people trying to understand my problem. And I won't be letting go of the "portable speaker". Because that is something that cannot be ignored. If this system weights too much, I'll end up not using it. It must be portable. And also. I think I'll play around with some ideas and then post them here on the forum.
I'll design a speaker that fits my needs and then listen for feedback. But before I begin. What difference will the size of the cabinet make? I'll go with 40 liters and then calculate the port-tuning myself. There are simple apps on the internet for that stuff
And also. I'm not entirely sure if I should go for plastic ports or make them out of wood... I can build triangles down the bottom, If I use wood
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