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Old 13th December 2017, 11:52 PM   #21
planet10 is online now planet10  Canada
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zacster View Post
Tidal
I read a story today that says Tidal is losing money hand over fist and only has enuff cash to last another 6 months.

dave
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Old 14th December 2017, 12:09 AM   #22
wushuliu is offline wushuliu  United States
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What's unfortunate are the lack of decent reviews of all the new turntables that have come out in the past few years aside from the usual suspects (rega, pro-ject, vpi blah blah blah). It's a travesty. Vinyl audiophiles are some of the most dogmatic I've ever come across. They just complain about anything new and just want to talk about either expensive tables or the vintage tables you'd have to pry from their cold dead hands that they found for a $1 on a sidewalk in 1997 or whatever. There's a real gap between older vinyl knowledge and young newcomers. I Feel bad for the latter.
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Old 14th December 2017, 12:16 AM   #23
wushuliu is offline wushuliu  United States
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Originally Posted by planet10 View Post
I read a story today that says Tidal is losing money hand over fist and only has enuff cash to last another 6 months.

dave
Kind of O.T., but I'll bite: this was inevitable. We all knew this was going to happen. The trend from the outset has been clear - buy an upstart streaming service, brand it and provide added value, sell to one of the big media/tech companies for oogobs of money.

Unfortunately Jay-Z's timing was off. It was a smart play, but obviously the world... changed around the time he needed to sell. He has lost leverage and money. He'll still sell it but for much less than he hoped. Remember though he only bought it for what $50 million? I think he'll recoup that easily. Won't have Dre bragging rights though.
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Old 14th December 2017, 12:18 AM   #24
billshurv is online now billshurv  United Kingdom
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There is a small group here taking apart the older vinyl knowledge and finding what's wrong with it. There is still some optimisation to go, which is good. After all men need hobbies to stay sane...
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Old 14th December 2017, 11:50 AM   #25
Black Stuart is offline Black Stuart  France
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Kevin,
There used to be a really good forum in the UK started out 1999, then it changed when a new crowd joined, all Idler fanatics, attacked anyone who didn't agree or accept that idlers ruled. We had a forum member who helped to set the DVD a standard in the USA. He had been an industry professional in the 1970s in the UK.

He posted a list of D/Ds and stated why, technically they were superior. I had bought a Tecnics SL120 for my partner. Got rained off (construction) one day and decided to set it up. I was gobsmacked at how silent it was and with absolute speed control, realised in a moment was a load of shite the Rega decks and arms were - the Technics came with an SME arm, set up by SME at their factory up the road from where I had bought the deck s/hand.

On that list was the Kenwood KD990. If you want a top class D/D in Europe, you look to ebay.de. I bought one, surprisingly for a German seller it was badly packed and had been dropped en route. The piano finished plinth was smashed in one corner.


I decided to set it up and see what the craic was - it worked perfectly but got in touch with the seller and negotiated a big reduction in price @ Ģ120. This Kenwood does ex\ctly what a t/t should do - it plays silently with an exact speed - something that idlers and belt drives never do and what's more importantly it doesn't add or subtract anything to the sound of the LP.

If you go down the Idler route you will have to shell out for a complete new bearing set up and that's just for starters. You will never achieve a neutral sound, maybe you don't want a neutral sound, that's fine, I do. I just want to hear what the artist/s /musicians/recording engineers have put together. Oh yes and it will cost a lot of money.

I was lucky and got into D/Ds before the price rocketed, I have two Kenwood KDs. Like I said I Love my vinyl but I look to the future, I have to post a question on diy - how to digitise my music and achieve an acceptable (to me) sound.

Wushuliu,

The price of top class new t/ts is ludicrous, mostly they are obsessed with the bling factor and not function. Mostly they are belt driven, it was never a good idea. The function of a t/t is to rotate at a precise speed, without rumble and without noise. The bearing system of a good D/D is far above anything being made today - look online at the system employed by the Kenwood KD series, clean and change the Slick 50 oil every two years and it has 'an indefinite life'.

Tell me what new t/t has end of side shut down and arm lift - answer none. It's virtually impossible to scratch an LP with these two simple functions that in no way interfere with the sound quality of the deck - so why don't even the most expensive modern decks have these two simple functions - because it would interfere with their profit margins.

Had I known that Kenwood were going rip out and sell their production line for KD decks in 1990 I would have raised the capital to buy that line and the rights of production. Why can Technics sell their D/Ds today for the price they do, simple they kept that line going, thanks to DJs across the world wanting those decks.

You can still buy a functioning KD deck in Germany for around €8-900.It comes with a brilliant medium mass arm that is a doddle to set up and by using the other 3 pillars of the die cast spider you can have another 3 arms if you want, what new deck gives you that, none that I know of. Also the arm is silver wired and was the first to do so. Replace at least the PSU caps but why not go the whole hog and look at the resistors, they are all bog standard industrial types. Do this and you effectively have a new deck.

Total cost will be around €1000, now tell me how much a new deck that won't come anywhere near the quality or functionability will cost. Stuck in the past, no but I do know good value when I see it.
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Old 14th December 2017, 02:31 PM   #26
billshurv is online now billshurv  United Kingdom
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As Kevin says, he is happy with his Idlers. When you get properly analytical the drive method doesn't matter, as has been seen on the turntable speed stability thread on here. There are much more important things to worry about.

If you hunt around on here there are pictures of his man cave. It's very impressive!
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Old 14th December 2017, 02:54 PM   #27
Jakob2 is offline Jakob2  Germany
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KatieandDad View Post
Although the vinyl market is currently quite strong, mainly due to the older generation remembering true Hi-Fi. I feel that the upsurge will be short-lived as the new generation are all about convenience.
I thought the same about the age of vinyl buyers but have seen some age figures that showed indeed that a proportion of up to ~45% is younger than 35.
Another surprising fact is that (according to numbers from the UK) around 9-10% of the buyers donīt possess a turntable and another 35% have a turntable but donīt use it .....
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Old 14th December 2017, 03:06 PM   #28
wushuliu is offline wushuliu  United States
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jakob2 View Post
I thought the same about the age of vinyl buyers but have seen some age figures that showed indeed that a proportion of up to ~45% is younger than 35.
Another surprising fact is that (according to numbers from the UK) around 9-10% of the buyers donīt possess a turntable and another 35% have a turntable but donīt use it .....
I'm under 45 and got into vinyl ten years ago. For about three years I learned to do easy to moderate vintage repair and drove around Los Angeles County buying tables off Craiglist. Lot of fun. I gifted my best friend a Thorens in great condition. He LOVES music and sees live music constantly. He owns records and has gifted me records.

But he's never used the Thorens.

So yea, there is definitely a weird phenomena of people who don't actually use the tables. But then that brings me back to my earlier point that unlike other components I just don't see much outreach from the older generation to us 'young' kids about what to do, enthusiasm for affordable new tables, etc. So I think a lot of us are kind of intimidated and frankly don't really know what to do with the tables. I used to be a regular on Audiokarma and Vinylengine but the grouchiness and close-mindedness is just overwhelming.
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Old 14th December 2017, 03:24 PM   #29
scott wurcer is online now scott wurcer  United States
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jakob2 View Post
35% have a turntable but donīt use it .....
A good target market for the mag lev TT. I never noticed "power consumption - 12W", will wonders never cease (platter is 80% ABS plastic and 20% glass fiber, even better).
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Last edited by scott wurcer; 14th December 2017 at 03:35 PM.
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Old 14th December 2017, 03:50 PM   #30
Dude111 is offline Dude111
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Originally Posted by adason
This has already happened in 80ties and it was big improvement.
Well not in my opinion........ I mostly get 70s and earlier records
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