http://www.troelsgravesen.dk/PMS.htm
I did search and found no specific thread on this design. If I missed it, please let me know and I'll delete this. Would it be better if I simply added this to the following?
http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=86890&highlight=troels
I just wanted to start a thread in here so that it might come up in someones' search if they had any experience with this speaker.
I am extremely interested in this design. It fits the bill of quite a few of the needs that are often described here at diyaudio, and would not be too difficult for the first time builder. Only drawback is that its aesthetic may not match the currrent trend toward slim baffles. Perhaps it only appeals to a few, but I'm definitely one of them. Every aspect about it's description encourages me.
I did search and found no specific thread on this design. If I missed it, please let me know and I'll delete this. Would it be better if I simply added this to the following?
http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=86890&highlight=troels
I just wanted to start a thread in here so that it might come up in someones' search if they had any experience with this speaker.
I am extremely interested in this design. It fits the bill of quite a few of the needs that are often described here at diyaudio, and would not be too difficult for the first time builder. Only drawback is that its aesthetic may not match the currrent trend toward slim baffles. Perhaps it only appeals to a few, but I'm definitely one of them. Every aspect about it's description encourages me.
It intrigues me also. In fact, I may build a "really poor man's strad" with Dayton Reference mid/woofers and a Seas 27TDFC or 27TBFC tweeter. I've had an idea floating around for a while with these drivers, and I may experiment with a conventional baffle and a wide baffle version to see if there are noticable audible differences.
Of course, who knows when I'll actually get around to it.
Of course, who knows when I'll actually get around to it.
Castlesteve - that's great. I wish I were strarting sooner than later. It's going to be a winter project for me for sure. I may start compiling a list of resources for the best buys and equivalents for the crossover parts.
I hope you and Jim85IROC and others will post occasional progress in here.
I hope you and Jim85IROC and others will post occasional progress in here.
I thought all of the final dimensions had been posted. I did notice that there is no description of the edge construction where the two "wings" come together. What's missing looks easy enough to extrapolate. Zaph describes a bend in MDF similarly. The PMS plans don't seem to indicate exactly how deep to make the slots for the bend. I imagine you could simply cut many more of them and then cut the tops and bottoms with the curve you wish them to conform to.
Do you know if Troels has indicated that more explicit plans will be posted?
Do you know if Troels has indicated that more explicit plans will be posted?
PMS
I've got all the parts in. Will build a smooth radius, though. Troels indicated to me that this will be in his final version. Interesting what he says about "... wonder if he should stop building speakers here..."
I suppose we'll find out. If it sounds that good, Who knows, perhaps we can do a group buy of CNC cab parts?
Will post back. Good call on the thread.
I've got all the parts in. Will build a smooth radius, though. Troels indicated to me that this will be in his final version. Interesting what he says about "... wonder if he should stop building speakers here..."
I suppose we'll find out. If it sounds that good, Who knows, perhaps we can do a group buy of CNC cab parts?
Will post back. Good call on the thread.
Yes. I'm at a finicky stage in my speakerbuilding education. I've built a few now, but am as yet unskilled and underconfident enought to start measuring and tweaking crossovers on my own. I want to get some experience with a few interesting and relatively simple designs before I invest in good measuring equipment and strike out more on my own. Unfortunately, with so many really excellent designs posted out there, I get spoiled and don't know where to rein in my expectations.
I was getting very close to ordering parts for Zaphs' Waveguide (I love what this waveguide seems capable of doing!) until I came across the PMS (I love what this baffle seems capable of doing!). Then I went a little further and found Troels' version of a waveguide - this time in a D'Appolito arrangement, with many of the same positive final attributes described as Zaph mentions.
Wow. Troels corrects the driver spacing problems by routering the woofer rebating in overlaps onto the waveguide. Brilliant. If only I could get Zaphs' drivers into this arrangement and integrate them into the PMS cabinet... But alas, these are the foolish thoughts of a relative neophyte. Eventually, I might branch out. For now, the PMS is an inestimable gift to the likes of me.
I cannot say enought in thanks and admiration for efforts such as those of John Krutke, Troels Gravesen and others. I know this is an arguable point, but at this point I'd rather learn by my successes, than by too many expensive mistakes. Even when (with luck) I become much more accomplished at this art/hobby, I expect that I'll still be attracted to and building the designs of others, and perhaps throwing in one or two worthwhile ones myself.
I was getting very close to ordering parts for Zaphs' Waveguide (I love what this waveguide seems capable of doing!) until I came across the PMS (I love what this baffle seems capable of doing!). Then I went a little further and found Troels' version of a waveguide - this time in a D'Appolito arrangement, with many of the same positive final attributes described as Zaph mentions.
Wow. Troels corrects the driver spacing problems by routering the woofer rebating in overlaps onto the waveguide. Brilliant. If only I could get Zaphs' drivers into this arrangement and integrate them into the PMS cabinet... But alas, these are the foolish thoughts of a relative neophyte. Eventually, I might branch out. For now, the PMS is an inestimable gift to the likes of me.
I cannot say enought in thanks and admiration for efforts such as those of John Krutke, Troels Gravesen and others. I know this is an arguable point, but at this point I'd rather learn by my successes, than by too many expensive mistakes. Even when (with luck) I become much more accomplished at this art/hobby, I expect that I'll still be attracted to and building the designs of others, and perhaps throwing in one or two worthwhile ones myself.
Banned
Joined 2002
http://www.troelsgravesen.dk/PMS.htm..
Very good looking design. I like it, my only question would be is there any bass ? as the box is open at both ends or is this box closed ?
Very good looking design. I like it, my only question would be is there any bass ? as the box is open at both ends or is this box closed ?
The PMS is a vented cab' of appx 42 litres and a vent tuning of 38 Hz, SBB4 I think....
The drawing is still concidered a temporary drawing, and the end sections are not scetched, but most certainly there..
I am tinkering with the drawings, trying to make a sort of semi universal cab that can also be used with the Thor MLTL.....
The drawing is still concidered a temporary drawing, and the end sections are not scetched, but most certainly there..
I am tinkering with the drawings, trying to make a sort of semi universal cab that can also be used with the Thor MLTL.....
Yes, I too am very interested in building the PMS'...
I started a thread maybe about 4-5 weeks ago regarding Troels' designs... Many users commented and guided me towards the PMS project...
http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=86890&perpage=10&highlight=&pagenumber=1
However, as many people in this thread have hinted on, I think I will wait for the final cab plans to be published before I begin construction of my system...
I am looking to create the speakers to closely match the actual strads...
http://www.sonusfaber.com
I was looking forward to starting a thread on my build once I began, but you beat me to it...
I am anxious to see what other come up with in the meantime...
Good luck to all!!!
Mark
I started a thread maybe about 4-5 weeks ago regarding Troels' designs... Many users commented and guided me towards the PMS project...
http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=86890&perpage=10&highlight=&pagenumber=1
However, as many people in this thread have hinted on, I think I will wait for the final cab plans to be published before I begin construction of my system...
I am looking to create the speakers to closely match the actual strads...
http://www.sonusfaber.com
I was looking forward to starting a thread on my build once I began, but you beat me to it...
I am anxious to see what other come up with in the meantime...
Good luck to all!!!
Mark
I don't want to make too much of this. These are only one instance of trying to buy parts.
I sent a parts list off to Madisound, PartsExpress, and Meniscus.
All appear to stock the bulk of necessary components except for SEAS units from PartExpress. I left those out of the email to them.
Six hours later I had a complete answer from Madisound. They had everything for me, and even offered to build the boards to spec for twenty dollars each.
Next day PartsExpress mailed to say that they only had a very limited amount of the crossover components, the remainder would have to be sent along to their special orders dept and they would be in touch. Two days after that, special orders contacted me to say that the balance of parts would be special delivery from Jantzen and to expect four to six week wait.
More than a week later.. Meniscus still hasn't responded to my email.
.. again, this might just be an anomaly at Partsexpress, although they advertise that they are an official Jantzen distributor. It may just be that Meniscus didn't recieve my email for some reason. I'll try again. But I'll probably be going with Madisound.
I sent a parts list off to Madisound, PartsExpress, and Meniscus.
All appear to stock the bulk of necessary components except for SEAS units from PartExpress. I left those out of the email to them.
Six hours later I had a complete answer from Madisound. They had everything for me, and even offered to build the boards to spec for twenty dollars each.
Next day PartsExpress mailed to say that they only had a very limited amount of the crossover components, the remainder would have to be sent along to their special orders dept and they would be in touch. Two days after that, special orders contacted me to say that the balance of parts would be special delivery from Jantzen and to expect four to six week wait.
More than a week later.. Meniscus still hasn't responded to my email.
.. again, this might just be an anomaly at Partsexpress, although they advertise that they are an official Jantzen distributor. It may just be that Meniscus didn't recieve my email for some reason. I'll try again. But I'll probably be going with Madisound.
Hi everyone,
I know this thread might be a bit old, but I too really want to build the PMS...well an approximation to it! I have some old (but still good) Vifa P25WO 10 inch woofers that I would like to use with the MCA's and 27TFFC's. So I'm wondering if it would be possible to enlarge the boxes to 65, maybe 75 litres to suit these woofers? Maybe a 3" extension (or thereabouts?) of the 'back-side' would do the trick?
Also please, would anyone have the final PMS plans? I can't find the updates on Troels site. The mid port detail also seems unclear. many thanks, grant
I know this thread might be a bit old, but I too really want to build the PMS...well an approximation to it! I have some old (but still good) Vifa P25WO 10 inch woofers that I would like to use with the MCA's and 27TFFC's. So I'm wondering if it would be possible to enlarge the boxes to 65, maybe 75 litres to suit these woofers? Maybe a 3" extension (or thereabouts?) of the 'back-side' would do the trick?
Also please, would anyone have the final PMS plans? I can't find the updates on Troels site. The mid port detail also seems unclear. many thanks, grant
I cannot answer your questions on using the different woofer or anything like that...
But, I can tell you that I just spoke to Troels about a week or two ago via e-mail and he told me that what is on the web site is the final design...
I agree that there are certain things that are a bit vague... Like the rear port...
If you have any luck finding other details, let me know as well... I would appreciate it...
Good luck,
Mark
But, I can tell you that I just spoke to Troels about a week or two ago via e-mail and he told me that what is on the web site is the final design...
I agree that there are certain things that are a bit vague... Like the rear port...
If you have any luck finding other details, let me know as well... I would appreciate it...
Good luck,
Mark
Hi Grant,
if you are really serious about building thse I can give you some pointers.
The design is not finalised, but presumably its gone as far as Troels will take it.
Note that if you are rebuilding your cabinets and only reusing
your bass units there are far simpler build options available.
/sreten.
if you are really serious about building thse I can give you some pointers.
The design is not finalised, but presumably its gone as far as Troels will take it.
Note that if you are rebuilding your cabinets and only reusing
your bass units there are far simpler build options available.
/sreten.Hi Mark,
Thanks! I should mention that a modified PMS enclosure would be my 'back-up' plan, if its remotely possible that these drivers don't sound good in my existing boxes. A 'fall-back' option , if you will.
Thats not to say that I wouldn't like to build the 'real thing', I just hope (if necessary) my woodworking skills are up to the the task. This would be a problem for me if the plans were not detailed enough. 'Aku's' 3d drawings on Troels site look good, but still no mid-port detail.
Troels PMS seems to be his 'flagship' design, (he says he can't do much better?) and to me he is the best designer on the web. So I can't understand why there are no more explicit construction details provided? Its a bit late to be worrying about commercial plagiarisation, perhaps. Although thats not my intention, of course!
Strictly Diy home use here!
Aurora said the boxes might be SBB4, I wonder if smaller QB3 would do? Just interested, thats all. Oops, sorry, you said you can't answer that.
Have you built your PMS, Mark? If so, how do they sound please? I'm really interested in your experience with it! Thanks, grant
Thanks! I should mention that a modified PMS enclosure would be my 'back-up' plan, if its remotely possible that these drivers don't sound good in my existing boxes. A 'fall-back' option , if you will.
Thats not to say that I wouldn't like to build the 'real thing', I just hope (if necessary) my woodworking skills are up to the the task. This would be a problem for me if the plans were not detailed enough. 'Aku's' 3d drawings on Troels site look good, but still no mid-port detail.
Troels PMS seems to be his 'flagship' design, (he says he can't do much better?) and to me he is the best designer on the web. So I can't understand why there are no more explicit construction details provided? Its a bit late to be worrying about commercial plagiarisation, perhaps. Although thats not my intention, of course!
Strictly Diy home use here!
Aurora said the boxes might be SBB4, I wonder if smaller QB3 would do? Just interested, thats all. Oops, sorry, you said you can't answer that.
Have you built your PMS, Mark? If so, how do they sound please? I'm really interested in your experience with it! Thanks, grant
Sreten,
If you could share your pointers with everyone reading this thread, it would be greatly appreciated...
I am in the planning phase of building the PMS speakers...
Anxious to get my bathroom remodel completed so that I can move on to the speakers!!!
Any insight or pointers that you have for the PMS project would be excellent...
Thanks,
Mark
If you could share your pointers with everyone reading this thread, it would be greatly appreciated...
I am in the planning phase of building the PMS speakers...
Anxious to get my bathroom remodel completed so that I can move on to the speakers!!!
Any insight or pointers that you have for the PMS project would be excellent...
Thanks,
Mark
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