I need a powerful high quality speaker system, with a very pleasant sound. It will be used to play jazz music and also instruments.
No, don't even think that this is a PA like...
Here in my contry, is hard to find good quality drivers, and the only one that I found good and avaliable here, is the beyma.
Well, I donloaded these datasheets:
MID BASS
10BR60
12BR70
Despite these two smells like PA thing...
12BR100
SM110N
MID HIGH
MC 115
HIGH
T2030
T2010
My big doubt is, do I need MC115 ?
I was analyzing the mid bass and tweeters response curve, and the mid bass is plain till 2khz and the tweeters are plain since (a little before) 2Khz too. So I don't need the MC 115 right?
Theoretically is okay, but is hard to imagine a 10 / 12 inch driver with a 1" tweeter, although they have the same sensivity and the response curves are matching.
What drivers are more suitable to what I want?
I feel that SM110 and 12BR100 are "too much PA". I think that 10BR60 with T2010 will be fine, and also 12BR70 with T2030.
Thaanksss !!!!
No, don't even think that this is a PA like...
Here in my contry, is hard to find good quality drivers, and the only one that I found good and avaliable here, is the beyma.
Well, I donloaded these datasheets:
MID BASS
10BR60
12BR70
Despite these two smells like PA thing...
12BR100
SM110N
MID HIGH
MC 115
HIGH
T2030
T2010
My big doubt is, do I need MC115 ?
I was analyzing the mid bass and tweeters response curve, and the mid bass is plain till 2khz and the tweeters are plain since (a little before) 2Khz too. So I don't need the MC 115 right?
Theoretically is okay, but is hard to imagine a 10 / 12 inch driver with a 1" tweeter, although they have the same sensivity and the response curves are matching.
What drivers are more suitable to what I want?
I feel that SM110 and 12BR100 are "too much PA". I think that 10BR60 with T2010 will be fine, and also 12BR70 with T2030.
Thaanksss !!!!
There is a recomended "blends" of studio-line units somewhere on Beyma sites. 10'' + 1" Doesn't look as a perfect combination in my eyes, because 10BR60 is a much more bass, than a midbass.
Maybe this link to beyma 3-way will be partially useful. Try to ask him for the xo.
Maybe this link to beyma 3-way will be partially useful. Try to ask him for the xo.
I thnik you could get inspiration from this kit made by Haut-Parleur Systemes in France with the 12B100R (top of Beyma Hifi line). You might as well consider the 10LW30, I use it in the 40-100hz with great satisfaction, clean and transparent bass!!
As for the tweeter, a lot of high grade systems use the well-known CP21F or CP22, compresion tweeters with high sensitivity cut at least at 5-6khz.
Do you have any idea how to make the crossover? This will be a hard job, unless you have acces to an active filter...
HPS sell the kit with filter 900 € / pair to give you an idea.
Dimensions h x l x p ( cm ) 90 x 36 x 40
HP Grave Beyma 12B100R
HP Médium Beyma 6MI90
HP Aigu Beyma T2030
Pente d'atténuation filtre 12 db/oct
Fréquence de coupure (Hz) 380/5000
Efficacité (db) 94
Bande passante ( +/- 3db ) 37 - 20000
Principe de charge BR
Puissance RMS 150
As for the tweeter, a lot of high grade systems use the well-known CP21F or CP22, compresion tweeters with high sensitivity cut at least at 5-6khz.
Do you have any idea how to make the crossover? This will be a hard job, unless you have acces to an active filter...
HPS sell the kit with filter 900 € / pair to give you an idea.
Dimensions h x l x p ( cm ) 90 x 36 x 40
HP Grave Beyma 12B100R
HP Médium Beyma 6MI90
HP Aigu Beyma T2030
Pente d'atténuation filtre 12 db/oct
Fréquence de coupure (Hz) 380/5000
Efficacité (db) 94
Bande passante ( +/- 3db ) 37 - 20000
Principe de charge BR
Puissance RMS 150
Attachments
The Haut-Parleur Systemes design seems very helpful for you-
the model numbers, crossover frequencies and slope
If you don't have much experience with crossover design you should stay with a 3 way , not a 4 way. A four way will drive you crazy
Maybe they would sell you just the crossover (filtre) -cheaper to ship! Then you could try to improve it later...
the model numbers, crossover frequencies and slope
If you don't have much experience with crossover design you should stay with a 3 way , not a 4 way. A four way will drive you crazy
Maybe they would sell you just the crossover (filtre) -cheaper to ship! Then you could try to improve it later...
Very useful to me that project, and I sent an email to him, but till now, no answer 
I just asked about the frequency cut of his crossover!
Maybe I'll not receive an answer, so I can't depend of this
What should I consider to cut the frequences?
I still not understanding why I can't have 10BR60 + T2010. It's strange to me too, a 10" woofer with a 1" tweeter... But, they have the same sensivity (91,5db and 92db), and the frequency range of the 10BR60 is 30 ~ 5000 Hz, and of the T2010 is 1500 ~ 20000Hz.
If I cut in 3000Hz? Then the woofer ends in 3k and the tweeter starts since 3k and goes till 20k.
Please, can you look at the frequency response graph of the datasheets?
Getting back to that 3way beyma system, I didn't understand why he used a 5" MIDBASS (datasheet says that it's suitable for small bass reflex systems, and frequency range is 50 ~ 12000hz) instead an MC115 that is designed for 3way systems and have a frequency range of 600 ~ 12500 hz.
Thanks !!
I just asked about the frequency cut of his crossover!Maybe I'll not receive an answer, so I can't depend of this
What should I consider to cut the frequences?
I still not understanding why I can't have 10BR60 + T2010. It's strange to me too, a 10" woofer with a 1" tweeter... But, they have the same sensivity (91,5db and 92db), and the frequency range of the 10BR60 is 30 ~ 5000 Hz, and of the T2010 is 1500 ~ 20000Hz.
If I cut in 3000Hz? Then the woofer ends in 3k and the tweeter starts since 3k and goes till 20k.
Please, can you look at the frequency response graph of the datasheets?
Getting back to that 3way beyma system, I didn't understand why he used a 5" MIDBASS (datasheet says that it's suitable for small bass reflex systems, and frequency range is 50 ~ 12000hz) instead an MC115 that is designed for 3way systems and have a frequency range of 600 ~ 12500 hz.
Thanks !!
I have excellent experience with 5MP60N. It fits to datasheet parameters. Regarding T2030, we made several independent measurements. Unfortunately this driver has ripple of amplitude response much higher than shown in datasheet. Regardless this fact, it sounds very good, as the ripple is mostly above 10kHz, where our ears evaluate mostly energy, not amplitude.
Cut it no lower than 3kHz.
Cut it no lower than 3kHz.
If I was restricted to Beyma alone.. I'd probably do this:
Co-axial 8BX with probably a different crossover than recomended, in a side-vented aperiodic "enslosure" similar to Amphion's midrange enclosure.
For the bass, no question there - 12 LX60 or the 112Nd/W, possibly mounted on the side of the speaker (again similar to the amphion).
Crossover between the two in the baffle step region.
Here is the amphion speaker I'm referring to:
http://www.amphion.fi/products/xenon/xenonframe5.htm
Co-axial 8BX with probably a different crossover than recomended, in a side-vented aperiodic "enslosure" similar to Amphion's midrange enclosure.
For the bass, no question there - 12 LX60 or the 112Nd/W, possibly mounted on the side of the speaker (again similar to the amphion).
Crossover between the two in the baffle step region.
Here is the amphion speaker I'm referring to:
http://www.amphion.fi/products/xenon/xenonframe5.htm
Here is a nice thread on the 8BX in an open baffle context (..which looks better than the aperiodic loading I mentioned - from a design viewpoint):
http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=61682&perpage=10&pagenumber=1
The final crossover doesn't look bad, but I'd personally try around a 30 degree off-axis listening position with the midbass run full-range and the compression tweeter high-passed with a small value cap.
http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=61682&perpage=10&pagenumber=1
The final crossover doesn't look bad, but I'd personally try around a 30 degree off-axis listening position with the midbass run full-range and the compression tweeter high-passed with a small value cap.
Beyma drivers are coming !
I ordered two 10BR60 and Two T2010.
Crossover will cut at 3500Hz !
About the enclosure, my goal will be achieve a very smooth and tight sound.
I'm opening a new topic to design the enclosure !
I don't know much about crossovers, I'll read elliot's article, any doubt I come back here !
I ordered two 10BR60 and Two T2010.
Crossover will cut at 3500Hz !
About the enclosure, my goal will be achieve a very smooth and tight sound.
I'm opening a new topic to design the enclosure !
I don't know much about crossovers, I'll read elliot's article, any doubt I come back here !
Hi Nando, what is about your project?
I want to do the same, too thinking in the 10br60v2 what is about it?
I want to do the same, too thinking in the 10br60v2 what is about it?
Beyma drivers are coming !
I ordered two 10BR60 and Two T2010.
Crossover will cut at 3500Hz !
About the enclosure, my goal will be achieve a very smooth and tight sound.
I'm opening a new topic to design the enclosure !
I don't know much about crossovers, I'll read elliot's article, any doubt I come back here !
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