I have no listening experience of Monacor tweeters, but I have often nearly bought one.
The RBT 95 magnetostat looks interesting, and I've been toying with buying for a long time.
This looks reasonably priced and could be something similar to Audax TW025F1 which have a certain appeal to my ears:
DT-28N
Not a LOW Fs though, if that's a deal breaker.
And this one has some positive comments about its use in Cheap Trick, a budget kit/design, so may be worth a look (I prefer the 1st suggestion by graphs alone)
DTM-104/8
This ones my personally favourite:
It essentially by the looks of it, a identical copy of Fountek Neo CD3.5H (which I'm using with the Monacor mids at the moment) so I may be slightly biased.
RBT-35SR
Some of their cone tweeters look useful for a retro style build or restoration type build.
I've bought Visaton high end drivers for my main system, largely due to what was available easily, and for a reasonable budget (seas, SS, Volt and others are just out of my price bracket)
I recently bought Monacor MSH 115 midrange for a 3 way idea I have, and I was not disappointed in sound or build quality. These were €35 each. They sing, and will make really nice midranges, with the Fountek Ribbons I'm planning to use with then.
They are a stamped/pressed steel frame but not as ugly as most.
I've bought very cheap driver from both Monacor and Visaton, and in both cases the quality isn't so good, but in these cases, the drivers were €15 each at the most. (Monacor SP40 and Visaton FRS5X) Even then, they weren't bad speakers, just cheap.
The RBT 95 magnetostat looks interesting, and I've been toying with buying for a long time.
This looks reasonably priced and could be something similar to Audax TW025F1 which have a certain appeal to my ears:
DT-28N
Not a LOW Fs though, if that's a deal breaker.
And this one has some positive comments about its use in Cheap Trick, a budget kit/design, so may be worth a look (I prefer the 1st suggestion by graphs alone)
DTM-104/8
This ones my personally favourite:
It essentially by the looks of it, a identical copy of Fountek Neo CD3.5H (which I'm using with the Monacor mids at the moment) so I may be slightly biased.
RBT-35SR
Some of their cone tweeters look useful for a retro style build or restoration type build.
I've bought Visaton high end drivers for my main system, largely due to what was available easily, and for a reasonable budget (seas, SS, Volt and others are just out of my price bracket)
I recently bought Monacor MSH 115 midrange for a 3 way idea I have, and I was not disappointed in sound or build quality. These were €35 each. They sing, and will make really nice midranges, with the Fountek Ribbons I'm planning to use with then.
They are a stamped/pressed steel frame but not as ugly as most.
I've bought very cheap driver from both Monacor and Visaton, and in both cases the quality isn't so good, but in these cases, the drivers were €15 each at the most. (Monacor SP40 and Visaton FRS5X) Even then, they weren't bad speakers, just cheap.
Wavecor have good ones also
Wavecor TW022WA02 22 mm dome tweeter with fabric dome. - Audiostatus
This small one could be crossed around 1.6kHz according to measurements in HobbyHifi and would probably do well in a waveguide crossed slightly lower
Wavecor TW022WA02 22 mm dome tweeter with fabric dome. - Audiostatus
This small one could be crossed around 1.6kHz according to measurements in HobbyHifi and would probably do well in a waveguide crossed slightly lower
Indeed, it was the WA06 I was referring to. According to measurements of HobbyHifi, x-over at 1.5kHz yields under 0.3% second order distortion at 90db/1m. Third order is under 0.1%, all figures from 1-3kHz.
Add a wave guide and it will be less...
Within their limits, I think there are some interesting tweets.
The Scanspeak R2604 $65 US has a cheaper sibling in the Peerless line the XT25TG - If you don't mind (or you need) a narrow listening angle, really really nice.
These tweets have appeared in some VERY expensive commercial speakers, and rightfully so.
The Scanspeak R2604 $65 US has a cheaper sibling in the Peerless line the XT25TG - If you don't mind (or you need) a narrow listening angle, really really nice.
These tweets have appeared in some VERY expensive commercial speakers, and rightfully so.
95dB at 1 meter, with a 70uF cap attached, in the cabs I used them in is attached here. The thing is, you are supposed to measure with little xover influence from driver to driver, or there is no comparison. I only attached the 70uF cap to protect it, and that filters well below the applicable passband. What I see is -40dB on 2nd order sets in about 2.5kHz, because 55dB is -40dB from reference, and the -40dB point is the same as 1% HD. Of course with the proper xover, the HD will be lower, hence using a xover above 2.5kHz if at all possible. 22mm tweeters do not have much Xmax, and this 22mm dome already has a waveguide to help it get where it can. The numbers you suggest do not jive with my personal measurements.
Best regards,
Wolf
Attachments
Yes, if you want to compare drivers. However, I still think it's useless when implementation tells a different story.
With all due respect, regarding measurements, I rather trust a publication like HobbyHifi than random measurements on the net.
Do you call that a waveguide, hmm...?
Btw, what are the dimensions of the baffle you have on that measurement, response look way to flat?
Cheers
His measurements look absolutely fine and exactly what you'd expect for the tweeter under measurement.
With tweeters like this it's always a trade off. Heck the same is true of the wide surround scan speak drivers too at price = ridiculous. That is, generally, high second order distortion Vs narrower surround designs. They usually have very low distortion in other areas though, as is shown here.
The motors are linear down fairly low as is shown by the low higher order products but the wide surround seems to introduce nonlinearities due to its geometry. You don't usually hear 2nd order distortion until it's at much higher amounts than the tweeter above though so it can be argued that is largely irrelevant. That tweeter would be absolutely fine down to 2kHz with a 4th order acoustic slope. Then take it higher or lower depending on how loud you want it to play.
Personally I'd go with a SB26ADC/CDC. Or the DXT tweeter from SEAS. As none wave guide tweeters go the XT25s poorer high frequency dispersion sounds better to my ears do to lower amounts of early reflections in room. If it'd cross low enough and I wanted to use a naked done, I'd go with that.
With tweeters like this it's always a trade off. Heck the same is true of the wide surround scan speak drivers too at price = ridiculous. That is, generally, high second order distortion Vs narrower surround designs. They usually have very low distortion in other areas though, as is shown here.
The motors are linear down fairly low as is shown by the low higher order products but the wide surround seems to introduce nonlinearities due to its geometry. You don't usually hear 2nd order distortion until it's at much higher amounts than the tweeter above though so it can be argued that is largely irrelevant. That tweeter would be absolutely fine down to 2kHz with a 4th order acoustic slope. Then take it higher or lower depending on how loud you want it to play.
Personally I'd go with a SB26ADC/CDC. Or the DXT tweeter from SEAS. As none wave guide tweeters go the XT25s poorer high frequency dispersion sounds better to my ears do to lower amounts of early reflections in room. If it'd cross low enough and I wanted to use a naked done, I'd go with that.
Here is compilation of tweeters suggested:
Now I invite for final 5 tweeters to be shortlisted to enable make a final choice.
Reminder: The tweeters I am looking for ( 30-60 euros) must compete or behave well as compared to highly priced ones and they will be matched in a 2 way project as midbass Peerless 830875 .
SB acoustics SB26adc/cdc
SB acoustics Sb29rdc-c0004
Peerless DA25TX
Wavecor TW022WA02 or 06
Vifa tymphany XT25TG
Scanspeak R2608/91300
Scanspeak R2604/8320 or 8330
Seas Prestige 27TFFC
SEas 27TBC/G
Seas TBFC/G
Now I invite for final 5 tweeters to be shortlisted to enable make a final choice.
Reminder: The tweeters I am looking for ( 30-60 euros) must compete or behave well as compared to highly priced ones and they will be matched in a 2 way project as midbass Peerless 830875 .
SB acoustics SB26adc/cdc
SB acoustics Sb29rdc-c0004
Peerless DA25TX
Wavecor TW022WA02 or 06
Vifa tymphany XT25TG
Scanspeak R2608/91300
Scanspeak R2604/8320 or 8330
Seas Prestige 27TFFC
SEas 27TBC/G
Seas TBFC/G
If that is how you want to play it, this one should make the final 5:
Source: Zaph|Audio
As it still does quite well compared to it's high priced competition. But it's up to you if this is the tweeter you really need. It has been used in expensive commercial speakers and really is a good tweeter at that price level. Scan Speak has it's own version of it which will be very similar. Created after the split-up of Viva/Peerless and Scan Speak. It is obvious they share the same family background. Then there are 2 versions of it to choose from, well actually 3 if you count the Neo's which can't quite compare.
Wouldn't it be wiser to just pick a tweeter based on your actual needs? Things like possible crossover point and off axis performance etc. do mean something. Don't pick the best tweeter, instead pick the tweeter that does exactly what you need it to do.
If you want one that compares quite well to a more expensive version of the same type, this is it though.
Vifa XT25 ($48) - Smoothest and most extended response curve in the group, and resulting CSD is excellent. Good tall order HD above 2kHx, but average 2nd order HD. Poor HD levels of all types below 2kHz, even considering the extended low end. It may have a 500 Hz Fs, but don't think about crossing it below 2kHz LR4 or 2.5kHz LR2. Off axis response curves available. Tested January 2006.
Scan-Speak 7000 ($398) - This driver is essentially the high end version of the XT25. Performance is indeed a small step up in all areas. Build quality is top notch with a thick metal flange that will never warp. Unfortunately, the price is ridiculous and value is low. Tested March 2008.
Source: Zaph|Audio
As it still does quite well compared to it's high priced competition. But it's up to you if this is the tweeter you really need. It has been used in expensive commercial speakers and really is a good tweeter at that price level. Scan Speak has it's own version of it which will be very similar. Created after the split-up of Viva/Peerless and Scan Speak. It is obvious they share the same family background. Then there are 2 versions of it to choose from, well actually 3 if you count the Neo's which can't quite compare.
Wouldn't it be wiser to just pick a tweeter based on your actual needs? Things like possible crossover point and off axis performance etc. do mean something. Don't pick the best tweeter, instead pick the tweeter that does exactly what you need it to do.
If you want one that compares quite well to a more expensive version of the same type, this is it though.
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No, it does not look like that! In 95% of the measurements of a dome, it does not look like that. In a "normal" baffle, you would have a increase of umph decibel around 1-2.5kHz which most of dome haters would describe as spitting at them
Take that down with either DSP or filter, you have lower distortion and spit is gone
Seas 27TFFC you should avoid. I have a pair and it sounds so bad compared to 27TBC/G. Depending on your listening distance you might leave out Seas 27TBC or 27TBFC. Difference is in ferrofluid (F in TBFC) so if you are close to your speakers (<3m) you should stick with TBC/G, if further away then go for TBFC/G. With ferrofluid you loose some of low level details at low volume. Vifa XT25 is great tweeter if your room is minimalistic with lots of reflecting surfaces because of its rapidly falling off axis frequency response. Same goes for SB29RDC-C0004 since it behaves very similar to XT25. SB26ADC/CDC i haven't listened so i can't give thumb up or down. DA25TX i haven't listened also but a guy, whose opinion i respect very much, praised its sound over much more expensive and less expensive tweeters. I'm definitelly using it in my next project. From a technical point of view, i'd avoid less than 1" tweeters. Not that there is anything wrong with them but they are pretty limited on how low you can cross them. 1" tweeter leaves a place for improvement/upgrade later on. If you don't like the sound when crossed at 2.2kHz, you can move it as low as 1.8kHz without serious issues - not sure that any of the sub 1" tweeters could do it and remain in comfort zone.
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I'd take this one over most expensive dome tweeters:
SB26STAC-C000-4 :: SB Acoustics
-there is a bit more manufacturing variance to this driver though, and the better the crossover components (assuming a good filter and overall loudspeaker design) - the better the result.
www.audioexcite.com >> SB Acoustics SB26STAC-C000-4
SB26STAC-C000-4 :: SB Acoustics
-there is a bit more manufacturing variance to this driver though, and the better the crossover components (assuming a good filter and overall loudspeaker design) - the better the result.
www.audioexcite.com >> SB Acoustics SB26STAC-C000-4
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Well, there has to be at least a few down-sides to living on an astonishingly beautiful island.. right?