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Multi-Way Conventional loudspeakers with crossovers

SBA 741 vs. SBA 761 for Classical Music
SBA 741 vs. SBA 761 for Classical Music
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Old 11th September 2019, 07:48 AM   #51
classicalfan is offline classicalfan  United States
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Note to LineSource, 5th element, and Pano,

If just one of you was insisting that I consider using wave guides for a small room, I could possibly ignore it. But with all three of you ganging up on me , I'm going to have to look at it.

My initial reaction is that there is more of a downside than upside, but I could be mistaken. I'll spend some time researching it and let you know if I think it would be good for me. Thanks.

Last edited by classicalfan; 11th September 2019 at 07:56 AM.
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Old 11th September 2019, 11:21 AM   #52
Juhazi is offline Juhazi  Finland
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Thumb up for a shallow waveguide!
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Old 11th September 2019, 11:41 AM   #53
Pida is offline Pida  Czech Republic
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Definitely +1 for waveguides like WG148R or something from Augerpro etc.
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Old 11th September 2019, 12:45 PM   #54
sebbyp is offline sebbyp  United Kingdom
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If you go for a waveguide, an interesting project to look at is the Jeff Bagby Helios.

Sb Satori BE tweeter in a waveguide + 9.5" Satori with a SB29NRX passive radiator. A really interesting design.

Click the image to open in full size.

Last edited by sebbyp; 11th September 2019 at 12:52 PM.
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Old 11th September 2019, 01:33 PM   #55
pkitt is offline pkitt  United States
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First, I should have also stated that it's necessary to use quality components (drivers and crossover parts) but not necessarily uber-expensive ones. I wasn't implying you were listening too loudly, but that all speakers have limitations; if they are properly designed and built then operated within there capabilities, it shouldn't matter what type of music is played and not be limited to sounding good with only one or two types of music. I also firmly agree that the price isn't necessarily indicative of quality. I'm a speaker-DIYer, too, BTW.

Originally Posted by classicalfan View Post

I'm not exactly sure what point you're trying to make. If it's that I was trying to audition the speakers by playing them far too loud in the store, I don't believe that was the case.

As I recall they were a Monitor Audio model called the Gold, but their current Gold model is different so I can't compare it to the one I heard several years ago. I'm sure though that the woofer was larger than 5". Their new Gold model has 2 - 8" woofers.

There are reports from what I believe are reliable individuals that the price of commercial speakers does not always equate to sound quality. So the fact that a $5,000 per pair set of speakers doesn't sound good should not really be surprising. At least it's not to me. Ergo, DIY.

Last edited by pkitt; 11th September 2019 at 01:36 PM.
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Old 11th September 2019, 04:27 PM   #56
drewan is offline drewan  United Kingdom
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Been following this thread, and very interested. As a result I found this thread

benefits and drawbacks of waveguides

lots to think about there with your difficult room
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Old 11th September 2019, 05:58 PM   #57
5th element is offline 5th element  United Kingdom
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Originally Posted by Juhazi View Post
I took a quick look at Stereophile, and Monitor Audio speakers mostly use LR4 xo. The distortion you heard was propably phase distortion (Group delay).

I was surprised how much better piano, violin etc. instruments sounded with LR2 instead LR4 in mid-tweeter xo. (it was an easy test with minidsp when responses were eq'd flat before settin xo.) First order might be even better, as they say, but even harder to achieve without stressing the tweeter way too much (low end distortion)
I did exactly the same thing and couldn't hear any difference at all. Well aside from slight tonal balance changes due to the differing vertical off axis behaviour.
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Last edited by 5th element; 11th September 2019 at 06:01 PM.
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Old 11th September 2019, 10:06 PM   #58
classicalfan is offline classicalfan  United States
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Is it possible that some people hear various types of distortion differently than others hear it?

As I posted above, I seem to hear distortions when others listening to exactly the same thing claim to not hear any distortion at all.

A very interesting topic for Psychoacoustics. Have to see what Toole says about it in his book.
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Old 11th September 2019, 10:17 PM   #59
peterbrorsson is offline peterbrorsson  Sweden
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Maybe you have a hearing deficiency...
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Old 11th September 2019, 10:37 PM   #60
geotone is offline geotone  Europe
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There are level-dependent distortions caused by the shape of our ears - inner and outer. Obviously those differ, hence different perceptions.

Not sure how much serious impact that really has, outliers excepted.

I have a feeling though that it is a speaker‘s ability to avoid triggering such distortions that make it play classical nicely - Bartok crescendi, distorted, are rather less enjoyable than guitar solos, slightly more distorted than already on the recording.
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