I'm terrible at the speaker modeling/crossover design game, so I'd appreciate getting some direction at building a BIG single speaker for mono audio. I can use a room corner for bass reinforcement. By "BIG," a refrigerator-sized box would be the maximum size I'm thinking about. The listening room is about 18 feet by 23 feet, with an 8-foot ceiling on one side and v-slope on the other side that maxes out about 12 feet high. I don't need high SPL's, but I'd like low and mid-bass that sounds "effortless" and quick. I listen to a lot of classical (small scale and large), jazz, reggae, alt-rock. Music only, no HT action. Budget for drivers < $1000.
My primary amp is a 3/4 watt per channel 1646 Darling. I'm looking for sensitivity, a slightly warm tonal character, and dynamics. I'll build a bigger SET amp if necessary. The little Darling works great with my Omega Super Alnicos.
A folded bass horn would be cool, as long as I can handle doing it in 3/4" plywood (no CNC). By the same token, I'd rather take on a project that uses 90-degree angles, though I could stretch the limits of my skills with more complex angles. A BR design for the woofer is okay if it's more practical or sounds better, but I'd like to try a folded horn woofer. I absolutely want a horn for the upper-midrange on up.
No doubt there are a million likely possibilities, and I've seen a few I like, but I've come to the conclusion I ought to ask first. I think something like a Klipsch Jubilee would be good.
My primary amp is a 3/4 watt per channel 1646 Darling. I'm looking for sensitivity, a slightly warm tonal character, and dynamics. I'll build a bigger SET amp if necessary. The little Darling works great with my Omega Super Alnicos.
A folded bass horn would be cool, as long as I can handle doing it in 3/4" plywood (no CNC). By the same token, I'd rather take on a project that uses 90-degree angles, though I could stretch the limits of my skills with more complex angles. A BR design for the woofer is okay if it's more practical or sounds better, but I'd like to try a folded horn woofer. I absolutely want a horn for the upper-midrange on up.
No doubt there are a million likely possibilities, and I've seen a few I like, but I've come to the conclusion I ought to ask first. I think something like a Klipsch Jubilee would be good.
Member
Joined 2009
Paid Member
Maybe you need a clean natural response. By this I mean affected by few outside factors. Apart from that you ask a big question, almost don't know where to start.
I think you're right, the components are available and the plans may still be on-line, though doubt it will meet budget unless you DIY a WG clone of sorts of the huge 402.
As you start scaling back to meet budget you wind up with a scaled up [lower tuned] La Scala and below this point a large MLTL loaded with one or more modern versions of vintage spec 12-15" low Fs, Qts, high Vas wide range horn drivers and the largest horn/driver combo the budget allows to get the XO down to around 500 Hz.
Long thread on your mostly lower budget options: Is it possible to cover the whole spectrum, high spl, low distortion with a 2-way?
GM
This may be some inspiration for the bass part: Something about Jealvox speakers
It is in Danish, but the plans are understandable.
It is in Danish, but the plans are understandable.
Intriguing. I wonder how they ship them? More pertinently, I wonder if I could make something like that? That would require a form, probably, and a lot of experimentation with different papers. I would try making a medium weight watercolor paper, cold pressed, first. And then lots of coats of 2 pound cut shellac? Sheer fantasy, of course!
Thanks, I'll check that thread out. I've read many of your posts and respect your deep knowledge in the Altec/JBL world. That budget I set was optimistic, though I still want to do all the woodworking myself, so I reckon by far the greatest percentage of outlay will be devoted to the drivers.
You're right, and I have that now with my stereo setup. I want a flat tonal response, possibly "erring" on the warm side with low distortion. That's the character I enjoy with my Omegas already. But for mono, I would like even more sensitivity and wide dispersion in addition to the other qualities already listed. Not knowing where to start is part of the fishing expedition. I know I need to set limitations, but I'm casting a wide net first to see if there's anything out there that might surprise me.
I'm listening to Poinciana by the Gypsy Trio and wonder if I really need anything more. I don't, but I love to experiment.
Last edited:
What an incredible project! It's all very much up my alley, so thank you for alerting me to it. That mid-upper horn is a real work of art. Inspiring. Hmm. Could I make one of them?
So you say you want wide dispersion. I can see there are two ways to have mono. One is clean and dry, for an accurate result. The other is to mix it up with the room to add spaciousness, to compensate for the lack of stereo.
One warrants careful inspection of room interaction to keep it tamed and minimal. The other warrants careful inspection of room interaction to make it inclusive and thorough.
When you say wide dispersion I assume you want the latter option. Sensitivity may potentially get dissolved into the reverberant field somewhat, but you also open options such as a ring of woofers. A 360 degree radial horn is a common starting point for an omnidirectional speaker.
One warrants careful inspection of room interaction to keep it tamed and minimal. The other warrants careful inspection of room interaction to make it inclusive and thorough.
When you say wide dispersion I assume you want the latter option. Sensitivity may potentially get dissolved into the reverberant field somewhat, but you also open options such as a ring of woofers. A 360 degree radial horn is a common starting point for an omnidirectional speaker.
The speaker will be in a corner, pointed to the center of the room. I'm not really all that concerned with the need to emulate the spaciousness of stereo sound, to the contrary, I want a relatively neutral presentation. I already have three other stereo systems, so I'm not particularly interested in trying to mimic that sound. So I guess I tend toward wanting accuracy, tempered with the sound of SET.
The speaker will be projecting into the room over the back of a couch about six feet away, so you can see I'm not worried about the usual stereo sweet spot positioning. I just want to load the room with beautiful mono! Maybe my need for "wide dispersion" is misplaced? Perhaps a typical dispersion pattern is fine for what I'm trying to do? I was just assuming I'd need more dispersion. I could definitely be wrong about that.
Right now, I'm gravitating towards something "simple" like an Altec A7 copy. I suppose I might need to build a tapped horn subwoofer too. I heard Joe Roberts' big VOTTs in Austin years ago with their custom monster-sized inductors. Unfortunately it was pearls before swine because I didn't realize how special his system was back then. What a moron I was (am???). He bought a ham transceiver from me and we were doing the radio thing, mostly, though I recognized he had a killer stereo.
After considering all you wrote, I could see you enjoying a corner system. The simplest of which would be quarter spacing your baffles to work with the room walls. A challenge, to be sure, but rewarding. Once you go into the corner, you have to play by corner rules.
Fitting an expanding horn into a corner can be a little more complex. Blending with the existing walls, but allowing for free expansion to continue into the room.
If you bring an expanding horn out into the room, however, It becomes big really quickly.
Fitting an expanding horn into a corner can be a little more complex. Blending with the existing walls, but allowing for free expansion to continue into the room.
If you bring an expanding horn out into the room, however, It becomes big really quickly.
I use a mono system in my garage, Altec 288c/1505 with 4x eminence alpha 15a's open baffle for lf.
Open baffle lf may not work as well loaded into a corner, though I don't know for certain tbh. You could always try some of JC Morrison's designs for lf:
race for the bottom – lab jc
You could approximate some of those designs very easily, with some fairly basic woodworking. Then you could iterate somewhat inexpensively to get a design nailed down.
I enjoy listening in mono, summed with a UTC A-20 ala JE Labs.
Open baffle lf may not work as well loaded into a corner, though I don't know for certain tbh. You could always try some of JC Morrison's designs for lf:
race for the bottom – lab jc
You could approximate some of those designs very easily, with some fairly basic woodworking. Then you could iterate somewhat inexpensively to get a design nailed down.
I enjoy listening in mono, summed with a UTC A-20 ala JE Labs.
Attachments
Sincere thanks for taking the time to imagine what I'd like, based on what I've said so far. I think keeping it in the corner might be the most pragmatic way to go about this. I did say I wanted a big speaker, but, yeah, there are limits.
I have looked into Pi's, and have admired them for years. I even made a set of Econowaves--Zilch used the Pis as his inspiration, I believe: a pair of Large Advents with Dayton polyimide CDs. I actually rotated them into the main stereo again recently. Problem is, the Pis I like best are too expensive for me, even if I got just one.
Small world: I live in souf' Austin and my folks used to live in Cibolo.
Something like you're using: horn/bass bin 2-way (1505s, though, wow!) or something in the corner is what I'm gravitating to now.
A friend just gave me a spare Edcor stereo to mono coupling transformer, so now I just need to buy an Ortofon 78 cartridge, which apparently will work fine with my Ortofon 2M Black (Shibata) stylus. I have a ton of mono classical records I acquired a few years ago and haven't heard yet.
- Status
- This old topic is closed. If you want to reopen this topic, contact a moderator using the "Report Post" button.