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Multi-Way Conventional loudspeakers with crossovers

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Old 30th June 2020, 03:11 PM   #2501
mabat is offline mabat  Czech Republic
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Originally Posted by Ro808 View Post
Same entrance angle for both drivers?
Of course not, these drivers are quite different. Changing the entry angle is only a small modification in the process, takes very little effort to change it to any value. All other dimensions stay exactly the same.

The price will depend on how good they turn out to be
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Old 30th June 2020, 04:57 PM   #2502
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Some more eye-candy: Tritonia Waveguide (renders)
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Old 30th June 2020, 05:31 PM   #2503
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Originally Posted by mabat View Post
Of course not, these drivers are quite different. Changing the entry angle is only a small modification in the process, takes very little effort to change it to any value. All other dimensions stay exactly the same.

The price will depend on how good they turn out to be

It would be interesting to see the plots of both drivers with swapped waveguides.
I wouldn't be surprised if the differences prove to be marginal.
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Old 30th June 2020, 05:40 PM   #2504
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Well, I would be surprised if there wasn't an appreciable difference. Maybe not on both but the BMS 4554 has about 27 exit angle. Connecting this to 9 of the ND3T should be noticeable and detrimental, IMHO. I'm only not sure it will be possible to try.
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Old 30th June 2020, 05:57 PM   #2505
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Originally Posted by tnargs View Post
T
But IMO the audibility of horn distortion is relevant to the goal of this 'design project' thread. Do the designers ignore it as being unimportant (Dr Geddes), or do they set a target and meet it
I just want to clear up this misinformation before it gets propagated. I know that I have said this many times, but I still read things like this so there is obviously a great deal of misunderstanding.

1) nonlinearity does matter, but not all nonlinearity are equally audible. We need to understand what actually matters and what doesn't. So setting a target is fine as long as it is meaningful.

2) THD and IMD are NOT meaningful because they do not correlate with perception. Of course one can always find cases where they are but there are just as many where they are not. How does one know which one we have? If one set of THD and IMD measures can be shown to be wrong, then the whole idea of them is wrong.

3) good metrics do exist and according to those, nonlinearity in most loudspeakers played within their design constraints is NOT an appreciable problem. They can be in electronics as crossover distortion shows.
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Old 30th June 2020, 06:04 PM   #2506
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Sorry, it was talked few posts above, but not sure I understood there are real conclusions about that :



Are enclosure and mouth edges difractions irrevelant with horns > 400 mm, please ? Or is it still prudent to make something smoother at mouth edges, sides or top, for the mouth not seing a 90 angle ? - no round bump on the low side of the mouth because bafle transition with another horn or a dynamic driver.


Phrased diferently: better a cabinet a little less width that these horns if flat transition not a problem: better to see recessed cabinet than a flat plan on sides ?
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Old 30th June 2020, 06:30 PM   #2507
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I don't know the answer myself. If you wait a while, it will be possible to simulate this easily - with Gmsh library it's a matter of a few lines of code to put a waveguide in a (rounded) box or even a sphere.
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Old 30th June 2020, 06:41 PM   #2508
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It's more a theorical question, frankly : no hurge at all, as a perpetual noob - but for listening music- I'm traveling light between theories, personal else's hifi listening, trade offs with the rooms and more - and always balancing between trade offs and choices for the main loudspeaker system I could resume like that : sota horn(s) high dynamic system -knowing the reccordings are more and more craps on the dynamic range side- and ESL 63 or Martin Logan. Aside, sound reproduction theory, knowledge, is a real involvment... as some for cars, watches, furnitures, etc, dark your case here.


I'm admirative about your work in several domain, sound, coding, and also some of you here in the thread. Simply dream to have to choose between two good enough systems : a 2 ways with horn listenable at 3 meters-cut-off something 800 hz for a good 15" and I know 3 ways are easier here traditionally- or an ESL despite the trade offs. Really : listening rooms sucks and make choice very difficult imho.


keep the good work, really a joy to read
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Old 30th June 2020, 06:42 PM   #2509
Ro808 is online now Ro808  Netherlands
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Originally Posted by mabat View Post
Well, I would be surprised if there wasn't an appreciable difference. Maybe not on both but the BMS 4554 has about 27 exit angle. Connecting this to 9 of the ND3T should be noticeable and detrimental, IMHO. I'm only not sure it will be possible to try.
My mistake, I confused the ND3T with the ND4015 series that lack a conical exit section.
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Old 30th June 2020, 07:30 PM   #2510
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Detail of the throat for those interested (it's actually not so easy to visualize that):

-th-throat-2-jpg
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