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How to model a driver in a dipole waveguide?
How to model a driver in a dipole waveguide?
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Old 27th May 2019, 08:31 AM   #1
wonderfulaudio is online now wonderfulaudio
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Default How to model a driver in a dipole waveguide?

Hi,

I want to model a 2.5" driver in a dipole waveguide, is there any way I can generate polar plots from 0 degrees to 180 degrees? Just like 2.5 TB driver in JBL waveguide like this:-

http://www.martinsson.cc/blog/images..._2386_REAR.jpg
http://www.martinsson.cc/blog/images/NB24_frontview.jpg
http://www.martinsson.cc/blog/images/NB24_sideview.jpg
http://www.martinsson.cc/blog/images/NB24_topview.jpg

All images from the blog
Martinsson's Blog

More specifically, can hornresponse do it?

Thanks and Regards.
WA
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Old 27th May 2019, 12:03 PM   #2
scottjoplin is offline scottjoplin  Wales
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What's your thinking behind this? It seems a little counter-productive to me. The polar plot is not going to be one thing or the other and seems like the worst of all possible combinations?
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Old 27th May 2019, 12:18 PM   #3
wonderfulaudio is online now wonderfulaudio
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I am checking the possibility of a Nola Brio kind of a system where the highs are handled by a small fullranger in a waveguide (dipolish). Have a 2 or 3 octave or more overlap with omni driver to handle the lows.
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Old 27th May 2019, 01:03 PM   #4
TNT is offline TNT  Sweden
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A dipole "should" look the same in both directions. This will never do that. It's a horn(wg) without a back chamber.

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Old 27th May 2019, 01:22 PM   #5
jzagaja is online now jzagaja  Poland
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How to model a driver in a dipole waveguide?
What if we point back chamber to same as front waveguide making something like Manger Diskus (that was bipole).
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Old 27th May 2019, 02:29 PM   #6
Juhazi is online now Juhazi  Finland
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Here is a pictures from the opening post, that tell the story
Click the image to open in full size.
Click the image to open in full size.

From Martinsson's blog Martinsson's Blog
The horn driver is a 2" TangBand cone driver. Bass driver are nude 18" cones - all tucked deep in the corner of the room.

This construction has actually very little to do with a dipole radiation pattern. Front and back radiation are totally different because of the horn vs. magnet making reflections/interferences, and for the bass the corner loading is huge.

I can't see any way to model/simulate these. And neither can I see any "sense" in either.
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Old 11th November 2019, 08:08 AM   #7
silverprout is offline silverprout  France
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Juhazi View Post
and for the bass the corner loading is huge
I've tested some very large corner loaded woofers, and there still a large notch in the power response on the border of the cone in the LF.
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Old 11th November 2019, 11:02 AM   #8
Juhazi is online now Juhazi  Finland
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In nearfiel few cm and 90¤? For sure yes, but total sound power at listening spot/area is what we listen to.

Boundary effects
How Do Boundaries Affect Loudspeakers?

When a dipole that makes low frequencies is pushed in the corner, the backside -sound gets 9dB boost relative to frontside + direct radiation. Sum is something less and with negative polarity and delay! The louder backwave will dominate in the measurement and perceived sound power, wild comb filtering starts then at higher freq.
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Last edited by Juhazi; 11th November 2019 at 11:21 AM.
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Old 11th November 2019, 12:56 PM   #9
silverprout is offline silverprout  France
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Juhazi View Post
In nearfiel few cm and 90¤? For sure yes, but total sound power at listening spot/area is what we listen to.

Boundary effects
How Do Boundaries Affect Loudspeakers?

When a dipole that makes low frequencies is pushed in the corner, the backside -sound gets 9dB boost relative to frontside + direct radiation. Sum is something less and with negative polarity and delay! The louder backwave will dominate in the measurement and perceived sound power, wild comb filtering starts then at higher freq.
It is a good explanation, i've bugged few seconds on the "dipole moment" because the moment signification in French is "momentum" reading a langage and think with another one is funny sometimes.
It seems to be a narrow directivity system, which is not a bad idea in a small space, but the woofers should be bigger in order to have a narrow directivity under the the horn BW, the only way to avoid reflexions is to don't create them IMHO.
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Old 12th November 2019, 04:50 PM   #10
silverprout is offline silverprout  France
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Quote:
Originally Posted by silverprout View Post
It is a good explanation, i've bugged few seconds on the "dipole moment" because the moment signification in French is "momentum" reading a langage and think with another one is funny sometimes.
I've found the traduction, it is "Moment dipolaire" should be written "dipolar moment" in English... my eyes have stopped to spin
But it must be written "dipole moment"
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