Hello sintexne,
Im in a similar spot but HiFi-wise...
Waiting to make the order between the two.
Nine selection of drivers for a PA system. Is it for a cool place in Greece?
Hi koutrou, awesome PA your planning !
I don't think you can go wrong with either one....particularly given you plan to cross at 800Hz.
I still been working on a synergy with the dcx464, and haven't stopped to do any real comparisons, with both CDs on the same horns.
When I do get serious with comparing, I'll put them on xt1464s, with the same midranges and subs, and be able to listen fairly.
I guess the real comparison we want, especially for PA, is how clean do they stay, how loud. Neighbors are gonna love me when I finally get around to blasting REW sine sweeps outdoors, to measure harmonic distortion
One thing maybe worth mentioning, but probably not....
I'm so used to the bms and its crossing at 6300Hz between sections, that the B&C's crossover at 3k is taking a little getting used to.
My normal way of adjusting tonal balance is to have an master volume DCA controlling all the driver section's each with its own individual slider, I can alter levels slightly to make a desired tone curve.
I've been using the bms crossed at 650Hz in all my builds. The 3+ octave span to 6300Hz for the lower CD section works very well as an upper mid/HF tone control method, with VHF from 6300Hz up.
The 2+ octave span of the B&C, 650Hz to 3kHz doesn't separate HF from VHF as clearly, and has the crossover right where the ear is most sensitive.
I have to juggle both CD sections around more than I like to to get happy. But all this really only applies to my (very unusual) way of managing tonal balance.
I guess I've only mentioned all this because xover is right where ear is most sensitive, and I'm not totally sure how well that ends up working out (for me).
The HF950 is a nice horn. I've been using it in the Peter Morris boxes, and in my own modular builds. I like the sound of the xt1464 a wee bit better, but that said, the HF950 is probably a little bit smoother, and has a nicer 90 degree pattern for PA. So I do this...HF950 for public PA outdoors; xt1464 for personal listening indoors or out..
Hi koutrou, awesome PA your planning !
I don't think you can go wrong with either one....particularly given you plan to cross at 800Hz.
I still been working on a synergy with the dcx464, and haven't stopped to do any real comparisons, with both CDs on the same horns.
When I do get serious with comparing, I'll put them on xt1464s, with the same midranges and subs, and be able to listen fairly.
I guess the real comparison we want, especially for PA, is how clean do they stay, how loud. Neighbors are gonna love me when I finally get around to blasting REW sine sweeps outdoors, to measure harmonic distortion
One thing maybe worth mentioning, but probably not....
I'm so used to the bms and its crossing at 6300Hz between sections, that the B&C's crossover at 3k is taking a little getting used to.
My normal way of adjusting tonal balance is to have an master volume DCA controlling all the driver section's each with its own individual slider, I can alter levels slightly to make a desired tone curve.
I've been using the bms crossed at 650Hz in all my builds. The 3+ octave span to 6300Hz for the lower CD section works very well as an upper mid/HF tone control method, with VHF from 6300Hz up.
The 2+ octave span of the B&C, 650Hz to 3kHz doesn't separate HF from VHF as clearly, and has the crossover right where the ear is most sensitive.
I have to juggle both CD sections around more than I like to to get happy. But all this really only applies to my (very unusual) way of managing tonal balance.
I guess I've only mentioned all this because xover is right where ear is most sensitive, and I'm not totally sure how well that ends up working out (for me).
The HF950 is a nice horn. I've been using it in the Peter Morris boxes, and in my own modular builds. I like the sound of the xt1464 a wee bit better, but that said, the HF950 is probably a little bit smoother, and has a nicer 90 degree pattern for PA. So I do this...HF950 for public PA outdoors; xt1464 for personal listening indoors or out..
this make a lot of sense (even for my uneducated brain!) XO location of the BMS seems better.
May I ask your advice on 16/8Ohm? Im going to use the BMS with a 2226h in a 120L BR bass bin.
Should I go for a 16ohm or an 8ohm? It will be bi-amped but with passive XOs (no DSP at all). Flattening the Impedance will not take the ohms of the 16 close to 8 right?
I like 16 ohms because of the 3dB attentuation that comes with it (vs 8ohms).
Even at 16 ohms, the CD's sensitivity is still higher than the rest of the system and needs padding down.
Not sure what you mean by 'Flattening the Impedance will not take the ohms of the 16 close to 8 right?'
Why passive?
(just curious, don't want to start ANY kind of passive vs active talk on this thread....)
Forget the "Flattening the Impedance", I said it wrong and I also didnt understand the concept of what I was talking about correctly.
i.e I was talking about a parallel resistor to bring the Ohms down in general but I made it sound like Im talking about 'flattening' the impedance spikes with the zobel or something.
Regarding full active: I personally like the idea that the speakers a 'dummy' and can work with any amp I have or build. (also for setup simplicity as Im not single
and Im already messing a lot with the living room!)I have a AVR denon that can do bi-amp (same levels per channel!) and I have a push pull tube amp (so I would like to be able to use them a one amp speakers too).
The only semi active, down the line (like a year from now ++) might be to build a single ended tube (kt88?) + a plate amp (hypex) for the woofers.
I have measuring equipment (scope, calibrated mic etc) so I think it will be fun.
Reading other posts here plus your comment I think Ill go for the 16ohm.
Makes sense?
Hi koutrou, awesome PA your planning !
I don't think you can go wrong with either one....particularly given you plan to cross at 800Hz.
I still been working on a synergy with the dcx464, and haven't stopped to do any real comparisons, with both CDs on the same horns.
When I do get serious with comparing, I'll put them on xt1464s, with the same midranges and subs, and be able to listen fairly.
I guess the real comparison we want, especially for PA, is how clean do they stay, how loud. Neighbors are gonna love me when I finally get around to blasting REW sine sweeps outdoors, to measure harmonic distortion
One thing maybe worth mentioning, but probably not....
I'm so used to the bms and its crossing at 6300Hz between sections, that the B&C's crossover at 3k is taking a little getting used to.
My normal way of adjusting tonal balance is to have an master volume DCA controlling all the driver section's each with its own individual slider, I can alter levels slightly to make a desired tone curve.
I've been using the bms crossed at 650Hz in all my builds. The 3+ octave span to 6300Hz for the lower CD section works very well as an upper mid/HF tone control method, with VHF from 6300Hz up.
The 2+ octave span of the B&C, 650Hz to 3kHz doesn't separate HF from VHF as clearly, and has the crossover right where the ear is most sensitive.
I have to juggle both CD sections around more than I like to to get happy. But all this really only applies to my (very unusual) way of managing tonal balance.
I guess I've only mentioned all this because xover is right where ear is most sensitive, and I'm not totally sure how well that ends up working out (for me).
The HF950 is a nice horn. I've been using it in the Peter Morris boxes, and in my own modular builds. I like the sound of the xt1464 a wee bit better, but that said, the HF950 is probably a little bit smoother, and has a nicer 90 degree pattern for PA. So I do this...HF950 for public PA outdoors; xt1464 for personal listening indoors or out..
Thank you! I waiting to do your tests for more info... As your neighbors and mine loves me every day
. I have already a PA system 2 Beyma 15p80fe, 2 Beyma 21PW1400Fe, 2 Beyma CP800Ti & 2 JBL 2386 horns... If i use JBL 2386 horn with JBL 2330 adaptor or P Audio PC-90 adaptor for BMS or B&C 1.4 inch coaxial drivers do you think would be any problem in sound quality?
This is something I have been thinking about recently.
Are we saying that a 16 ohm driver will have a 3db lower noise floor than a 8 ohm driver?
I guess the question is, if we use the 16 ohm, do we still have too much output and need to pad down (attenuate).
I use very high efficiency mids and subs, and yes, I still need to attenuate the CDs.
Yes.
For instance, I generally wire a resistor in series with a compression driver to lower the noise.
But it gets better!
A resistor in series with a tweeter also extends the highs.
Here's why:
An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
If you put an 4ohm resistor in series with an 4ohm tweeter, you would think that it would attenuate the tweeter evenly.
But it doesn't.
This is because of the impedance curve. For instance, this tweeter has an impedance of approximately 4ohm across it's range. That 4ohm resistor will attenuate that tweeter by approximately 6dB. But at 10khz, it's impedance has risen to 7ohm.
Due to this, the same resistor will only attenuate the tweeter by 4ohm at 10khz.
Does that make sense? Basically the net effect is that the resistor will raise the highs by a couple dB. The resistor attenuates the tweeter, but the attenuation isn't constant, it decreases at high and low frequency.
Read more here : adding resistor in series with tweeter in active sytem
as a comparison I found a BMS 4594nd on SEOS24 (unspecified power level)
Attachments
I have BMS. Mark and Peter Morris have already written something about subjective comparison