Test box method requires raising Fs > 50% with the pioneer's 1.56x a good number, though higher is even better according to D'Appolito.
In post #52 of that thread POOH states:
"Conclude after brief listening of the Peerless 1"driver it is a very good deal for somebody building a small 2 way system and wants to crossover below 2K to a direct radiator.It lacks dynamics and sounds compressed with good dynamic recordings and lacks real life shimmer and neutrality in the treble. If crossed over too low I hear the smearing of transients and details that I do not get with better drivers. If used with a direct radiator system and to somebody that is used to hybrid horns and cones this may not be an issue. for my system i'm Back to splitting the 600 Hz range up between two drivers."
Here the Tymphany is compared to other 1" drivers.
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Keep in mind, he is using it in a ~110db/w multi way horn system, and crossed it at 500hz in a larger horn for testing
I have read that link before, and I think it is the lack of stored energy/resonance that makes the peerless driver sound so good compared to the others. From first hand experience it goes lower and sounds better than the HF108R, even if it may have more harmonic distortion
The diameter must be specified correctly. You always have different values, sometimes also 0. DATS cannot calculate correctly with this. For this you have to measure from center to center of the treated cloth surround. With a 15 "woofer that should be about 13".
How was the woofer positioned during the measurement? Was it standing on solid ground without moving? Ideally, it should be measured in the position in which it will be installed later. But it's not easy with such large woofers.
If the woofer moves uncontrollably during measurement, this can also lead to disturbances in the impedance curve.
How was the woofer positioned during the measurement? Was it standing on solid ground without moving? Ideally, it should be measured in the position in which it will be installed later. But it's not easy with such large woofers.
If the woofer moves uncontrollably during measurement, this can also lead to disturbances in the impedance curve.
The diameter is not used to calculate free air measurements....so you can recant that statement....Diameter is used to figure Vas, and of course I've used the correct values for the 15m because they were given to me by John...and whenever I calculated Vas I displayed the driver editor screen which displays Sd....and Sd has been correct, verifying the use of the correct effective diameter amount.
Here is an overly of one driver mounted in box with the back panel off
The other sitting on solid ground....
If you understand physics enough, Having the resonances at the same place, thats is, having the resonant peaks showing an identical trend as they do...while mount is mounted to a very rigid box, facing sidways, and one free stand on a solid surface facing upwards....shows that those resonances, ~300hz and up, are not sourced from anywhere but the driver itself....
Doesn't break up show in the impedance measurement? Is it just break up?
If not...its defective, plain in simple, unless you have something else to add..
Forgive my frustration....You want a control, you've got one Here is the impedance measurement from the youtube review....it has the same trends in the curve.
My issue is not with the impedance curve....it is with the motor strength and efficiency numbers
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"Motor strength is showing as the most concerning though, Bl^2/Re for the TD15 is around 43.7. That should show the Bl of around 23Tm. What your measurements calculate out to if I enter all your parameters as is, shows 18.86 Tm." - John
My impedance looks not unlike the impedance of the youtube review....Whats wacky about it?
Why is it that I should be so forgiving of a company that takes almost a year to deliver a product purhased, if I takes approximately the same amount of time to report issues found. Maybe I'm fkin busy too...Likely more so.
Imagine you shipping out a product to someone and a year later they report shipping damage.
Thats a good point. I took measurements in different locations in the house, same trend...If you will study the impedance measurements from the youtube video you'll see same "bumps" at ~350hz, ~450hz, ~1khz, a series of smaller bumps all the way up to ~6khz where a final "bump" occurs...Mind you, my version is a 16ohm version vs the 8 ohm in the youtube video.
My issue is not to do with the impedance curve. My issue is to do with Motor strength, efficiency and QTS. My free air qts needs to be 0.33 yet I am currently reading a .66. Motor strength should be 23tm according to John and I've been getting readings of 18-19Tm
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Fortunately for me, qts, qes, and qms need no accurate input from me to be measured. I think If John is willing to fix my midrange issues I could move on. I don't have to have the 16ohm version, especially if I can't get the proper qts with it.
Ro808 do you still have the link to the website that did thiele spec measurements on the 18h+?
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We're all busy camplo. We're all busy and just trying to help.
Your measurements are whacked because Bl²/Re says so... I don't really care about the noise above 300 or the youtube showing the same hash. Maybe it's just a crappy speaker.
Maybe you are comfortable ruling out camplo error.
That leaves only two options.
Low B or low L.
The driver took a long time to be delivered and you are understandably frustrated about that. I would be as well.
Is waiting so long to report a problem really justified by the long delivery time? IMO no. Classic two wrongs not making a right.
You and John are both, presumably grownups and ought to be able to sort this out.
Good luck.
Your measurements are whacked because Bl²/Re says so... I don't really care about the noise above 300 or the youtube showing the same hash. Maybe it's just a crappy speaker.
Maybe you are comfortable ruling out camplo error.
That leaves only two options.
Low B or low L.
The driver took a long time to be delivered and you are understandably frustrated about that. I would be as well.
Is waiting so long to report a problem really justified by the long delivery time? IMO no. Classic two wrongs not making a right.
You and John are both, presumably grownups and ought to be able to sort this out.
Good luck.
What exactly do you mean by this...in that my measurements are off? Or that the woofer is wrong?
Look at my above comment...what are the chances that someone rolled the dice on shorting people on a low L based on arriving at Tm specs of the woofer at the next lower ohm version and hoping no one noticed...
Is there anything else this coincidence could point to?
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Is there any logic in that? If one were short on wire supply, they could definitely spit out more woofers by that method...is wire hard to come by? expensive? etc....
I don't think John literally makes every woofer...he has people working for him correct? I mean all communication from him, when it actually happens, comes across as forth coming and honest.
Mind you, when using relatively accurate info for the MMD method...I'm getting these BL's for both models...I also, additionally tried the added mass method for the 15m and the BL prediction is still relatively the same...
The DATs is reading the Re....which looks correct...not sure how it arrives at the B and the L
QTs of the 18H+'s reads within tolerance (~0.28 vs the spec'd 0.22)...I've not tried to break them in
QTs of the 15m reads as double what I'd expect 0.6 instead of a 0.3
I don't think John literally makes every woofer...he has people working for him correct? I mean all communication from him, when it actually happens, comes across as forth coming and honest.
Mind you, when using relatively accurate info for the MMD method...I'm getting these BL's for both models...I also, additionally tried the added mass method for the 15m and the BL prediction is still relatively the same...
The DATs is reading the Re....which looks correct...not sure how it arrives at the B and the L
QTs of the 18H+'s reads within tolerance (~0.28 vs the spec'd 0.22)...I've not tried to break them in
QTs of the 15m reads as double what I'd expect 0.6 instead of a 0.3
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