Not to cast aspersions on your DATS prowess, have you followed the same process as outlined in these videos?
REVIEW - Dayton Audio DATS V3 - YouTube
A Common "HORROR" Story + A Brand New Solution - YouTube
Cross calculating the parameters as shown in the second video gives an idea if the parameters being measured are even physically possible.
The more you can do to weed out any user error would surely make it easier to get some action from the manufacturer if needed.
REVIEW - Dayton Audio DATS V3 - YouTube
A Common "HORROR" Story + A Brand New Solution - YouTube
Cross calculating the parameters as shown in the second video gives an idea if the parameters being measured are even physically possible.
The more you can do to weed out any user error would surely make it easier to get some action from the manufacturer if needed.
1€ that these will in the end come out to spec. E.g... forget measuring impedance in any sort of box. Clamp the magnet, secure the clamp to a very sturdy and none-resonant fundament and measure, to begin with, at very low excursion. Impedance measurements is like having hooked up a giant microphone to your sound card...
Did you measure Re with an ordinary ohm meter? Result acc to spec?
//
Did you measure Re with an ordinary ohm meter? Result acc to spec?
//
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This thread has grown huge in the last 2 and a bit years.. my take on this project has been idle for over a year now, it consists of a faital 15pr400 in a 200L ported corner box with a peerless 2535 compression driver and the QSC clone waveguide, with a passive crossover prototype at 1.2khz
It sounds pretty good, i may start a thread for some feedback on the crossover
Apart from that, I have just ordered a secondhand pair of jbl 2453j compression drivers, and i plan on building another set of K402 horns to use instead of the smaller 1 inch drivers above
hopefully this gives someone ideas for their build
p.s. hurry up camplo!
It sounds pretty good, i may start a thread for some feedback on the crossover
Apart from that, I have just ordered a secondhand pair of jbl 2453j compression drivers, and i plan on building another set of K402 horns to use instead of the smaller 1 inch drivers above
hopefully this gives someone ideas for their build
p.s. hurry up camplo!
Attachments
I am not entirely sure how camplo estimated the TS parameters but following the CLIO Pocket review this is at least a two step processing with free air and known volume measurement:
http://www.audiomatica.com/wp/wp-content/uploads/CLIO-Pocket-Review.pdf
http://www.audiomatica.com/wp/wp-content/uploads/CLIO-Pocket-Review.pdf
The dats does free air...then you have to add enough mass to the cone to lower fs 25%, for it to figure vas using the known added mass as an offset...I used a putty as suggested.
Wait till i get my hands on the 18H+ Group....it should provide more information about my situation
Thanks.
I have Celestion CDX1-1745 and the B52s I'm about to set up. I wondered where it was crossing best for you, as I have read there are common characteristics between the DE250 and 1745. Hoping they'll play nice in a 3 way, but may end up moving to a higher end HF section down the road depending. I was apprehensive about crossing to a 15, then started to consider it again, but came into a smaller mid I may try first.
Another HF unit that tempts me is the HF10AK and HF108R from Faital Pro. The 108 plays nice and low, and is said to sound really good, and the 10AK supposedly has amazing top end but doesn't go as low. Pricier than my budget Celestions tho.
The 10AK should go slightly lower, but needs a big (classical) horn.
It's the conical exit section that makes a difference, but depending on the horn, at the cost of a TD2001-like dip around 1500-2500 Hz.
The HF108(R) is among the best 1" drivers, together with the BMS 4550 and the 18Sound NSD1095.
Contrary to popular belief, few 1" drivers are capable of decent performance below 1000 Hz.
I've posted several measurements and links regarding this topic.
It should be noted that the average listening level is an important factor here.
Up to 90-95 dB, distortion figures of many drivers remain within acceptable limits.
It's the conical exit section that makes a difference, but depending on the horn, at the cost of a TD2001-like dip around 1500-2500 Hz.
The HF108(R) is among the best 1" drivers, together with the BMS 4550 and the 18Sound NSD1095.
Contrary to popular belief, few 1" drivers are capable of decent performance below 1000 Hz.
I've posted several measurements and links regarding this topic.
It should be noted that the average listening level is an important factor here.
Up to 90-95 dB, distortion figures of many drivers remain within acceptable limits.
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as you can see from the video, its not exactly challenging to use the datsv3...
Still no reply from Acoustic Elegance...if thats not shady, tell me what is....
I also have the HF108R, and the peerless drivers are a massive upgrade. The HF108R has problematic impedance peaks around the crossover point and sounds more coloured in the treble than the peerless. I am also not sure how well it handles the low crossover point
The peerless is way better in this case, and POOH also tested this driver and compares it to others
HLCM - Horn loaded compact monitor
As I commence an attempt to break in the one 15m....and possible one of the 18H+'s
Lets say eventually I come to the conclusion that the reported motor strengths are correctly measured...
19-21tm for the 18H+...
and 17 for the 15m..
where it should be 27tm and 23tm are the spec'd motor strengths....What should I expect Acoustic Elegance to do....what should I do in the event that Acoustic Elegance has stone walled me, given I have not heard from them in 4 days now?
Lets say eventually I come to the conclusion that the reported motor strengths are correctly measured...
19-21tm for the 18H+...
and 17 for the 15m..
where it should be 27tm and 23tm are the spec'd motor strengths....What should I expect Acoustic Elegance to do....what should I do in the event that Acoustic Elegance has stone walled me, given I have not heard from them in 4 days now?
Which is why I don't understand why there is so much noise and odd peaks in your measurements. Without a good control measurement to a driver enough other people have measured makes it impossible to rule out a measurement error.
Is it that unreasonable from a small company during a pandemic?
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Simulate boxes for them with the measured specs and see if you are happy with it.. otherwise sell them or send them back for a refund, then choose something else from a different manufacturer
There is no spec'd motor strength for a 16ohm TD15M on their website that I see.
8 and 4 ohm Bl are spec'd 17 and 11.81 respectively and their Bl²/Re are quite close to one another.
I would hope that your custom ordered 16 ohm version Bl²/Re would be in the same neighborhood.
I proposed 3 options for what could be wrong and fluid has just reiterated the 'camplo measurement error' option.
Your impedance measurements are whacked. They look awful. Something is wrong and you need to rule out error on your part.
As far as your "what should they do" question? Honestly I think you waited too long to report a problem to them and that their obligation to you is expired. They could offer to fix it but not, imho, at their expense.
8 and 4 ohm Bl are spec'd 17 and 11.81 respectively and their Bl²/Re are quite close to one another.
I would hope that your custom ordered 16 ohm version Bl²/Re would be in the same neighborhood.
I proposed 3 options for what could be wrong and fluid has just reiterated the 'camplo measurement error' option.
Your impedance measurements are whacked. They look awful. Something is wrong and you need to rule out error on your part.
As far as your "what should they do" question? Honestly I think you waited too long to report a problem to them and that their obligation to you is expired. They could offer to fix it but not, imho, at their expense.