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Multi-Way Conventional loudspeakers with crossovers

Is it possible to cover the whole spectrum, high spl, low distortion with a 2-way?
Is it possible to cover the whole spectrum, high spl, low distortion with a 2-way?
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Old 19th September 2019, 12:44 AM   #3131
gedlee is offline gedlee  United States
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ro808 View Post
Diffraction is intrisic to every horn and waveguide. The amounts vary, but in my experience as well as that of others, the perceived net effect on the acoustic performance and listening experience of a properly designed complete loudspeaker system may be insignificant.

A bar of 30ppi foam, placed in the slot, further reduces typical diffraction artefacts.
I cannot disagree with you more strongly. I have done research into the perception of diffraction and I can assure you that our conclusions do not support your opinion.

Horn diffraction can range from highly diffracted to almost none. That's why horns sound so different. Diffraction, IMO, is the single most important factor to sound quality. Almost to the exclusion of all else.
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Old 19th September 2019, 12:46 AM   #3132
Ro808 is offline Ro808  Netherlands
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The first image attached to post #3164 shows the 'upgraded' SUP-T11G.
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Old 19th September 2019, 12:56 AM   #3133
camplo is offline camplo
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Originally Posted by phase_accurate View Post
Hi Earl

But wouldn't the directivity control of a 15" woofer be as bad at 400 Hz ?

Regards

Charles
Show me where a single 15” woofers dispersion varies widely from the next as far as the standard looking woofer....not gonna happen unless a waveguide or enclosure is factored in. Generally speaking 15” woofer and a horn with the same circumference is going loose directivity at the wavelength matching its size. I’m interested in the “horn loading” not being a real factor....what’s that supposed to mean

Last edited by camplo; 19th September 2019 at 01:02 AM.
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Old 19th September 2019, 01:08 AM   #3134
Ro808 is offline Ro808  Netherlands
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gedlee View Post
I cannot disagree with you more strongly. I have done research into the perception of diffraction and I can assure you that our conclusions do not support your opinion.

Horn diffraction can range from highly diffracted to almost none. That's why horns sound so different. Diffraction, IMO, is the single most important factor to sound quality. Almost to the exclusion of all else.
Of this I am fully aware. At the same time it's highly unlikely many top rated studios, as well as the Max Planck Institute would spend a considerable amount of money on monitor loudspeakers with a 'horrendous diffraction horn', unless it wouldn't adversely affect sound quality.

Last edited by Ro808; 19th September 2019 at 01:25 AM.
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Old 19th September 2019, 01:09 AM   #3135
gedlee is offline gedlee  United States
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Originally Posted by Ro808 View Post
Of this I am fully aware. At the same time it's highly unlikely many top rated studios, as well as the Max Planck Institute would spend a considerable amount of money on monitor loudspeakers with an 'inferior horn'.
Don't bet on that.
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Old 19th September 2019, 01:27 AM   #3136
Ro808 is offline Ro808  Netherlands
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No, I leave that to WHG

By the way: is there a relation between driver exit size and the depth versus the opening angle of an OSWG?

Last edited by Ro808; 19th September 2019 at 01:40 AM.
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Old 19th September 2019, 02:05 AM   #3137
Ro808 is offline Ro808  Netherlands
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A guy, who also cooperated with mabat on the STH/ATH project, reworked the throat section of a 2" Aluminum horn - similar to the ZXPC 10x18.
Driver used is an older 2" B&C.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg detail_c8045-zvukovod_1.jpg (81.9 KB, 216 views)
File Type: png RHC15mk-III-v1-62-1-5m-0-90-horizontal-directivity-non-norm.png (40.8 KB, 215 views)
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Old 19th September 2019, 02:52 AM   #3138
Ro808 is offline Ro808  Netherlands
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Quote:
Originally Posted by camplo View Post
I’m interested in the “horn loading” not being a real factor....what’s that supposed to mean
Horn loading is a key feature of 'classical horns' (Salmon family). Your own horns belong to this category as well.
As regards modern waveguide type of horns, the loading aspect is largely ignored in favor of directivity characteristics.
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Old 19th September 2019, 03:25 AM   #3139
Ro808 is offline Ro808  Netherlands
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Default G.T. Sound prices

In 2013 the GSU-D04 compression driver cost 780,000 Yen (or 5515.00 euros).

Prices for 2010 of other G.T. Sound products:

Loudspeaker systems (prices are for a pair, I think):
SRS-1A (maple wood version) 6,163,500yen (approx 49308euro)
SRV-1A (maple wood version) 8,505,000yen (approx 68040euro)
SRH-1A (maple wood version) 8,421,000yen (approx 67368euro )
SFS-2A 4,767,000yen (approx 38136eur)

Woofers - pair of GSU-W16 1,008,000yen (approx 8064euro)
Compression drivers - pair of GSU-WD04 1,428,000yen (approx 11424euro)
Ultra High - pair of GSU-UH1 1,470,000yen (approx 11760euro)
Horns - pair of GH-301A (made of laminated maple wood) 1,386,000yen (approx 11088euro)
Horns - pair of GH-301B (made of laminated birch wood) 1,008,000yen (approx 8064euro)
Horns - pair of GH-501A (made of laminated maple wood) 588,000yen (approx 4704euro)
Horns - pair of GH-501B (made of laminated birch wood) 462,000yen (approx 3696euro)
Crossovers - pair of Network for single woofer 630,000yen (approx 5040euro)
Crossovers - pair of Network for double woofer 1,115,000yen (approx 9240euro).
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Old 19th September 2019, 03:35 AM   #3140
Joel Wesseling is offline Joel Wesseling  Canada
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Ro808 qoute: Diffraction is intrisic to every horn and waveguide


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Quote:
Originally Posted by gedlee View Post
I cannot disagree with you more strongly. I have done research into the perception of diffraction and I can assure you that our conclusions do not support your opinion.

Horn diffraction can range from highly diffracted to almost none. That's why horns sound so different. Diffraction, IMO, is the single most important factor to sound quality. Almost to the exclusion of all else.
This has got me very curious as I really want to like horns - Can someone suggest a HF horn with driver that is "almost diffraction free", ready to be intigrated with a LF driver?
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