Is it possible to cover the whole spectrum, high SPL, low distortion with a 2-way?

I have a suggestion for you. Simply provide an appropriate STL file that fulfills camplos LF obejctives (can be crossed-over at 300-400Hz) and which has CD character. Then we will simulate it as a free-standing horn. Come on, show us that we all fail.

If I was drinking coffee while reading this, I might of choked on it lol!
Is it possible to cover the whole spectrum, high spl, low distortion with a 2-way? -that horn has plenty of directivity control and it beams like crazy. A sacrifice I'll have to pay for what I want since there is no CD horns that exist, that plays down to 200hz first off all.

I am trying to find the best performing horn that correctly loads 200hz, has the best polar, and is within ~35" long and ~30"wide. I am quite surprised that the Jericho 45 is only 20" wide. I am interested to see an ellipse horn that has a length like the Jericho.

I see an iWata horn that I've never seen before
IWATA-200 - Horns by Auto-Tech


My main desire is to find the best horn that can allow me a 200hz xover, based off principle, so far the Jericho 45 is the first horn we've seen that can do so.
 
It shouldn't be too difficult to develop a Constant (Controlled, Uniform) Directivity (Coverage) horn that also provides acoustic loading <500Hz. The EV HR9040 can serve as an example.
Such a horn would be a hybrid, i.e. composed of (a smooth transition between) 2 or more sections each with a different contour.
The entire compound of these sections could approximate a spherical, hyperbolic, tractrix, or similar horn flare.
By increasing the mouth height (compared to the HR9040) the directivity in the vertical plane could be improved.
Such a horn would require 3D printing or CNC.
 
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Anyone tried compound loading? Back with WE/Sato horn and front with waveguide? Bottom of Sato cut for SB34NRX75-16.
 

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I am trying to find the best performing horn that correctly loads 200hz, has the best polar, and is within ~35" long and ~30"wide. I am quite surprised that the Jericho 45 is only 20" wide. I am interested to see an ellipse horn that has a length like the Jericho.

Have you looked hear? These are CD and close to what you seem to require and they sound good too. 2360/65 meets the dimensions 2366 bit long! 2360 loads to 350Hz or 2366 to 200Hz

Rob :)

2360 Series
 
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Thanks for sharing, I these horns last high on the diffraction list, we’ve been avoiding designs like that but I have been wondering what a 160hz biradial similar to the Tad biradial would look like, size wise and polar. Joseph’s horns seem to have a wider polar than salmon horns of the same fc. Someone made to the comment that they’ve heard both and that they preferred the salmon horns better so I never really thought twice about it.

The Axi is scheduled to be here soon. Still waiting on the phase plugs for the 18’s.
 
Loading is an aspect of flare/contour and axial length vs. coverage angle(s) > narrow coverage requires a deeper horn.
The JBL 2356 that POOH posted is an example .
A conical (straight walled) horn won't provide much loading below 1000Hz, even if it's infinitely long.


Illustrated by David McBean:

A conical horn does not have a specific theoretical cutoff frequency.


The normalised throat acoustical impedance of an 'infinite' exponential horn having a cutoff frequency of 100 hertz. Notice how the resistance (black trace) falls abruptly to zero at 100 hertz:

237335d1314343038-easy-build-classic-horn-exp1-png



The normalised throat acoustical impedance of an equivalent 'infinite' conical horn. In this case there is no sharp reduction (or cutoff) in resistance at a particular frequency:

237336d1314343038-easy-build-classic-horn-con1-png




In the previous post I referred to the width of the custom horns in order to get an idea of what a large biradial horn would look like.
 
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Loading is an aspect of length, has nothing to do with horn width at the mouth...right? Riiiight.

I am no expert but it can't be simply a matter of length if so how do you explain the "loading" in shallow waveguides like the PT's or M2? They are only a couples of inches deep. 3.25" for a PTH1010. With a large format driver you can get a very usable 800-900Hz crossover point.


Thanks for sharing, I these horns last high on the diffraction list, we’ve been avoiding designs like that but I have been wondering what a 160hz biradial similar to the Tad biradial would look like, size wise and polar.

Well the size is what you would expect and as far a diffraction slot I wouldn't discount them without listening to them first. Not all horns with DS sound "bad".

Rob:)
 
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I am no expert but it can't be simply a matter of length if so how do you explain the "loading" in shallow waveguides like the PT's or M2?

Because they lie. They take advantage of the fact that for non pa, loading isn't usually a factor. Loading "should" be a length of 1/2WL or better, but you'll see products going 1/4th and smaller. Kinda like posting measurements for an amp thats 1000watts without specifying if its rms or max or in what ohms. They also sell the 8" woofer to 1" tweeter two way.
 
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I am no expert but it can't be simply a matter of length if so how do you explain the "loading" in shallow waveguides like the PT's or M2? They are only a couples of inches deep. 3.25" for a PTH1010. With a large format driver you can get a very usable 800-900Hz crossover point.

Rob:)

It's still is a matter of axial length, even for the M2 waveguide.
Charles Prinkle came up with some clever solutions to 'mimic' a deeper horn in a shallow waveguide.
The function of the M2's knuckles is somewhat similar to the mumps in the Klipsch K510 shown previously.
The M2 WG relies on a diffraction aperture to push the wavefront across the (flattened/brought down) curvy mouth section.

I guess it's best illustrated in this drawing:

OGt4JPg.png
 
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Loading is an aspect of flare/contour and axial length vs. coverage angle(s) > narrow coverage requires a deeper horn.


So what I said was true bet yet an over simplification. From what I'm gathering, generally speaking you are not going to escape a direct tie between length and loading, if flare/contour is of the same nature between two horns. So after you've chose a type, say JMLC and chosen a flare rate which I believe is T, length is the governing aspect directly resulting in a Fc

If I understand some what, the M2 creates a deeper horn without the appearance of such or at least, creates acoustical impedance in the throat.
 
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So now, we can create a horn that ends in the desired length and with the complying contour and flare rate, we truncate the mouth flare....we are almost at the Jericho 45....and this comes with the punishment of turbulence in the frequency response, some where in the polar if not on axis? The Jericho 45 is pretty smooth given that its mouth termination is on the abrupt side.
Ro808, what are your personal thoughts on the Last Jericho, Jericho 45 we'll call it. It beams, its a sacrifice...but looking at the impedance chart, is that what I want to see?
 
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@camplo

Here is a small video Don prepared during our evaluation or call it proof of concept phase. This is a spherical wave horn with T=1, stretch factor of 1.5 and stereophic projection applied. I am quite sure that this horn would work nicely.

So, if you choose a constant T factor this is similar to the spherical wave horn properties and we know that these horns work as several Klangfilm cinema speakers used this horn type.

View attachment 795315

Watching this animation immediately made me think of when someone was describing how it sounded on a horn that was crossed too low, as if the sound was coming from some where inside the throat. If you look at this animation you can see the sound pressure front initiate inside the throat and eventually make its way out.
The Jericho 45 does not have this issue at 200hz. Me so happy.
 
A diffraction slot is an effective means to shorten the horn's axial length (and increasing coverage angles).

If you look at JBL's 2380 Bi-Radial series, you'll find the narrow beamwidth 2360a (practically) omits a slot.
The 2380a's usable low frequency limit of 350 Hz is only 50Hz below the limit of its slotted brothers, but its depth is 35.9cm vs. 23.6cm for the 2380a/2382a.
 
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