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Multi-Way Conventional loudspeakers with crossovers

Is it possible to cover the whole spectrum, high spl, low distortion with a 2-way?
Is it possible to cover the whole spectrum, high spl, low distortion with a 2-way?
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Old 20th March 2019, 12:37 PM   #161
camplo is offline camplo
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ro808 View Post
Faitals are nice, but the RCF is one of the very few 4" diaphragm drivers capable of high output levels in PA cabs, crossed below 700Hz. It also does 20kHz without a severe drop in the top octave, or major breakup.

In Europe it's quite a bargain, but I am not sure about availability in the US.

@camplo: evidently I appreciate a proper 808 beat, like this, as well.
I was quite impressed with RCF bass drivers. Did you post a pic of a compressor and expect me to guess what driver it is?
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Old 20th March 2019, 12:51 PM   #162
Ro808 is offline Ro808  Netherlands
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I guess, I did

It's the 950 2.0.
There's also a 1.4" version, which was tested by Vance Dickason.

It seems the 2.0 is preferred by PA folks who have tested both.

RCF woofers are very nice indeed and not too expensive either.
In Europe their sub drivers are popular for diy tapped horns.

Last edited by Ro808; 20th March 2019 at 01:05 PM.
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Old 20th March 2019, 01:39 PM   #163
Ro808 is offline Ro808  Netherlands
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Recently, I checked if the MB15X301 could work in my cabs (also a 2-way).
It won't do 30Hz, but it's an interesting driver nonetheless.

Last edited by Ro808; 20th March 2019 at 01:57 PM.
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Old 20th March 2019, 02:37 PM   #164
KaffiMann is offline KaffiMann  Norway
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Is it possible to cover the whole spectrum, high spl, low distortion with a 2-way?
The CD650 also looks really nice and smooth, it's half the price of the ND950 2.0 and it should work really well to 800hz, maybe even 700hz unless you're going for deafness.
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Old 20th March 2019, 02:44 PM   #165
camplo is offline camplo
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Titanium must be an improvement over Aluminum but lesser than Beryllium.
I guess radian aint all that? And no one seems to be partial to the BMS 4590 at all....

I've been able to consecutively convince myself to stick to a compression driver vs a ribbon planar. Peoples impression along with my own, over paper specs, I'm certainly confused, judging by spectral decay, horns would not be the accurate one, but CD's are not letting on to this supposed exaggeration of color, somehow.
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Old 20th March 2019, 03:07 PM   #166
ErnieM is offline ErnieM  United States
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Radian is right up there with the best. My experience as well as others have been very positive.

The Radian diaphragm is an alloy with aluminum, titanium, and copper if I recall correctly.

Once equalized, most drivers sound very similar. Maximum clean output is the main difference. Advantage is for larger diaphragms.

Let's look at the available options from maximum clean displacement.

1. BMS 4594HE is the current best option for wide bandwidth high output designs. Downsides is it's a two way design that works best actively crossed. Need to know your stuff when it comes to crossovers.

2. Various Beryllium equipped 4" 1.4/1.5" exit compression drivers.

3. 4" diaphragms with flexible surrounds.

4. 4" diaphragms with one piece titanium dome/surround.

Upcoming options:
1. Celestion Axi2050. Long wait time for this one. Could be years.
2. B&C coaxial. DCX464. Available later this year.

Last edited by ErnieM; 20th March 2019 at 03:33 PM.
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Old 20th March 2019, 04:29 PM   #167
moray james is offline moray james  Canada
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Default BE Al then ti

Quote:
Originally Posted by camplo View Post
Titanium must be an improvement over Aluminum but lesser than Beryllium.
I guess radian aint all that? And no one seems to be partial to the BMS 4590 at all....

I've been able to consecutively convince myself to stick to a compression driver vs a ribbon planar. Peoples impression along with my own, over paper specs, I'm certainly confused, judging by spectral decay, horns would not be the accurate one, but CD's are not letting on to this supposed exaggeration of color, somehow.
Ti is popular with the pros because it does not work harden when you slap the diaphragm onto the phase plug, this means you can abuse it and not have it harden and then shatter. Ti has a lower physical structural resonance around 8KHz which drives some folks crazy fortunately not a lot of people though. Aluminum is a superior diaphragm material with a higher frequency break up mode and Be is even lighter and stiffer again pushing up the first break up mode. Aluminum is probably the very best all around diaphragm material for performance Vs cost. Some of the modern plastic diaphragms are good for lower level (home) use with lower compression ratio driver designs.
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Old 20th March 2019, 04:31 PM   #168
Cask05 is offline Cask05  United States
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Quote:
Originally Posted by camplo View Post
Titanium must be an improvement over Aluminum but lesser than Beryllium.
I guess radian aint all that? And no one seems to be partial to the BMS 4590 at all....
In general, aluminum and titanium perform about the same from the standpoint of 10-20 kHz chatter. Poly ring diaphragms can perform better--close to beryllium domes.

My experience with the BMS 4592ND is that it just needs EQing. The figure below for the midrange diaphragm output channels of 4592ND on a K-402 horn. There are three more input PEQs for the crossover interference bands:

Is it possible to cover the whole spectrum, high spl, low distortion with a 2-way?-bms4592-midrange-peqs-jpg

Chris
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File Type: jpg BMS4592 midrange PEQs.JPG (76.4 KB, 453 views)
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Old 20th March 2019, 04:36 PM   #169
camplo is offline camplo
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Thank you so much for your post ErnieM! I really appreciate you organizing the tactic, it’s all new to me, so I needed the oversight.
So for a waveguide I don’t see much going outside of the Goldwood GM-450PB 2"
I found a selenium 90x40 made of fiberglass but some complaints of quality control on demensions and I didn’t figure out of it had a diffraction slot, which I understand to undesirable. Do you have any insight to a solution?
K-402 horns are not for sale btw

Last edited by camplo; 20th March 2019 at 05:05 PM.
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Old 20th March 2019, 05:22 PM   #170
ErnieM is offline ErnieM  United States
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The seos waveguides are the easiest large waveguides to get a hold of. 24", 30", or 36" model.

Lots of success with these at the AVS forums. One guy is running Beryllium Radian 950pb's on a seos 24 down to 600hz for large format studio monitor use.

18 Sound makes well designed horns good for 800hz. XT1464 is quite popular.

For woofers. AE is the best you can easily buy. BMS woofers are very close as well and are being used in many home audio projects.

With all that said....you might also consider kits from Diysoundgroup like the "Maximus 12" or Troels "The Loudspeaker".

Last edited by ErnieM; 20th March 2019 at 05:38 PM.
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