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Multi-Way Conventional loudspeakers with crossovers

Is it possible to cover the whole spectrum, high spl, low distortion with a 2-way?
Is it possible to cover the whole spectrum, high spl, low distortion with a 2-way?
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Old 23rd July 2019, 06:43 AM   #1431
GM is offline GM  United States
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Yeah, 1.4" Altec/GPA is the only large format I've auditioned that can be used to 15 kHz @ > 104 dB, but at GPA's new pricing I'd rather use 2" and add a super tweeter.

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Old 23rd July 2019, 07:37 AM   #1432
phase_accurate is offline phase_accurate
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Hi Tuyen

Maybe you have given up too early with your combination. What is it about the sound that you don't like ? Keep in mind that definitely none of your drivers is a bad one. All of them are used in studio monitors, which is not a full guarantee but at least some indicator of quality.

How did you do the crossover ?

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Charles
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Old 23rd July 2019, 10:09 AM   #1433
tuyen is offline tuyen  Australia
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Sorry in advance for my very completely subjective observations.

I was expecting a more 'open' or perhaps 'bigger' sound. Still 'clean' sound but no treble sparkle either. No doubting the build quality the Beyma drivers. I read on this thread previous that if driver MMS is > 100 then highest recommended cut would be ~500hz else clarity/resolution would suffer. Which makes sense as when I tried running the woofers around 600hz to 1000hz, the clarity/detail would suffer (even though datasheet of 15G40 states it has fr upto 1500hz and fr plot is flat-ish til there).

I tried various crossover frequencies (using Najda DSP). The bass xo point be around 200-300hz (12/18/24db cutoffs). The 12" coaxial would come in then and xo between the 12" woofer and the 2" hf cd around (1400-2000hz).
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Old 23rd July 2019, 10:15 AM   #1434
phase_accurate is offline phase_accurate
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200 to 300 Hz sounds reasonable. Did you do any measurements or did you just set the x-over by ear ? What is the box volume used for the coax ?

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Charles
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Old 23rd July 2019, 10:41 AM   #1435
AllenB is online now AllenB  Australia
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tuyen View Post
but no treble sparkle either.
It's difficult to make comments on this without ascertaining what you've done with each, whether they are the same and how etc..

..but, a lack of sparkle can be the result of a fixed, high DI?
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Old 23rd July 2019, 12:08 PM   #1436
phase_accurate is offline phase_accurate
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Agreed - the missing sparkle can be caused by narrow beamwidth. It can be re-gained with a supertweeter in this case.
The tweeter part of this coax has some humps in the lower part of its frequency response. Depending on how you set the tweeter level (by ear for instance) this might also result in a lack of highs. It is therefore advised to take proper care of these humps as well.

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Charles
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Old 23rd July 2019, 02:17 PM   #1437
badman is offline badman  United States
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Originally Posted by Ro808 View Post
If the OB concept were the end to all loudspeaker concepts, it would dominate the market, I suppose.
Nearfield OBs have drawbacks that make them less than viable for general use. They would need to be given sufficient space, which doesn't align to general nearfield monitoring apps. They'd also be very poor at generating SPL for background music, or for multiple listeners.

So bad for a lot of reasons, but for an audiophile listening nearfield willing to jump through all those hoops they'll be not without their upsides too.
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Old 23rd July 2019, 02:34 PM   #1438
Ro808 is offline Ro808  Netherlands
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Originally Posted by tuyen View Post
What's special about the HF1440? It's frequency plot doesn't look that balanced compared to something like the HF10AK ?
The plot looks exceptionally balanced for a large format driver.

HF10AK is a very good 1.75" dia driver, as is the HF108(R).
It's the usual trade-off, between top-end and midrange.
You might also consider the smaller 1.4" exit drivers (HF14.. series), like the one that Charles uses, for a 'best of both worlds solution'.

People often seem to ignore developments in diaphragm/suspension material, phase plugs etc.
Some large format drivers sound better than 1" exit drivers, even in the top octave.

Last edited by Ro808; 23rd July 2019 at 02:58 PM.
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Old 23rd July 2019, 02:50 PM   #1439
phase_accurate is offline phase_accurate
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If I were him I would open a new thread dealing with improving the one he has.
While it is definitley addictive to always try new concepts it would also be interesting to get the best sound out of the cool combo that he already has. I would also modify the box for bass-reflex which is even easier with a three-way topoligy because there would not be midrange contamination from the reflex holes like large two-ways can suffer from.

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Charles
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Old 23rd July 2019, 03:27 PM   #1440
Ro808 is offline Ro808  Netherlands
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In that french thread there's an interesting notion on OBs. It's being considered as a short circuit.
The guy apparently chose OB for his basement, because it provides the best solution for some severe in-room anomalies.

Charles, completely agree with your statement on tuyen's Beyma drivers.
It would be a waste of these quality drivers to just move on to something new.


BTW, this post wears the 'magic number'

Last edited by Ro808; 23rd July 2019 at 03:45 PM.
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