I often look at the Western Electric horns. As a lover of vintage speaker systems, these are discribed as the Nirvana of speakers, an unmatched soundquality coming from a system developed in the '30s.
They are demonstrated often at high end audio shows (Munich Silbatone) with raving reports about sound - realism - dynamics.
And they are sexy as hell with those curves.
Butt...How is all of this possible? A design made in the '30s?
As we want to design a good horn speaker these days, we use computerprograms, we count in directivity - bandwidth - no folds in the hornpath - ... Are the WE horns breaking all of these laws? Or are they just a vintage hype?
They are demonstrated often at high end audio shows (Munich Silbatone) with raving reports about sound - realism - dynamics.
And they are sexy as hell with those curves.
Butt...How is all of this possible? A design made in the '30s?
As we want to design a good horn speaker these days, we use computerprograms, we count in directivity - bandwidth - no folds in the hornpath - ... Are the WE horns breaking all of these laws? Or are they just a vintage hype?
Neither, just good design/engineering of an ideal expo horn, then exactly as practical, built what they designed [the hard part]. The trade-off is excessive beaming and why they failed as cinema systems.
GM
Yeah, those I 'experienced' in my late teens had a 'lushness' like no other for lack of a better phrase that had me spending a significant amount of my active audio DIY 'career' chasing this quality on the cheap. Learned a lot about various types of damping that has only come into vogue since Dr. Geddes' research/ foam horn 'plug'.
GM
GM
hifi heroin: CES 2011 - the big Western Electric system....
It is pretty amazing that the engineers from Western Electric, Bell Labs, RCA etc. figured out how to reproduce sound using horns way back when. Even more amazing is the fact that most of mega buck systems today pale by comparison in dynamics.
I attended the CES show in 2011 and spent several hours listening to the big WE system and a smaller system they had in another room. I remember Jeffrey jackson having a hard time the first day or two getting the big system to play at its full potential. The sound by the end of the show was excellent, big, bold, dynamic. everything a large horn system should sound like. However, the cost of that big horn system (near priceless), the size, and room needed for good sonics, left me overall unimpressed. Almost all these WE horn systems no reside in S. Korea, Japan, China and are pretty much unobtainium due to crazy high collector value.
With today's modern CNC machines, molding, casting techniques, a clever DIY person could get a major portion of that WE sound for a fraction of the price. Companies like Line Magnetics, Classic audio sell field coil compression drivers, TAD drivers can be had both used and new along with other newer designed compression drivers. There are lots of horn plans on the internet and carpenters who can make them. So, don't envy WE horn systems, admire them for their engineering and sound but those DIY'ers with some room, money, skills, motivation, can get excellent WE like sound. That is what I did !!!
It is pretty amazing that the engineers from Western Electric, Bell Labs, RCA etc. figured out how to reproduce sound using horns way back when. Even more amazing is the fact that most of mega buck systems today pale by comparison in dynamics.
I attended the CES show in 2011 and spent several hours listening to the big WE system and a smaller system they had in another room. I remember Jeffrey jackson having a hard time the first day or two getting the big system to play at its full potential. The sound by the end of the show was excellent, big, bold, dynamic. everything a large horn system should sound like. However, the cost of that big horn system (near priceless), the size, and room needed for good sonics, left me overall unimpressed. Almost all these WE horn systems no reside in S. Korea, Japan, China and are pretty much unobtainium due to crazy high collector value.
With today's modern CNC machines, molding, casting techniques, a clever DIY person could get a major portion of that WE sound for a fraction of the price. Companies like Line Magnetics, Classic audio sell field coil compression drivers, TAD drivers can be had both used and new along with other newer designed compression drivers. There are lots of horn plans on the internet and carpenters who can make them. So, don't envy WE horn systems, admire them for their engineering and sound but those DIY'ers with some room, money, skills, motivation, can get excellent WE like sound. That is what I did !!!
Big time, though TTBOMK pricing wasn't an issue initially, i.e. folks were willing to pay extra for 'talkies' like we did for 'This is Cinerama' 'Earthquake', etc., roadshows, but the '29 market collapse was just around the corner, so it added a 'nitro load of fuel' to finding not just a much better performing system, but a much cheaper one to boot.
Pricing use to be on the net, but can't find it now and my links are locked up in a bad HD, but my SWAG is that if one reverse inflated Silbatone's prices it would be in the ball park.
GM
Not really when one considers the electro-mechanical-acoustical baseline they started with combined with basically unlimited funding. Apparently, their major problem was the time constraint to get it to market.
I agree and I don't, though admittedly I envy a little bit those who can do/afford such systems, just as some folks have/do envy me for some 'things' they probably can't ever afford and so goes human nature from richest to poorest.
Regardless, I wish every audio enthusiast could experience such systems as a frame of reference just to hear how good recorded music can sound. Ditto a HIFI optimized Synergy concept system, which can arguably be as good overall in a still large, but much more compact, bulk and at only a tiny fraction of the price.
GM
WE 555 horn sounds great. I was shocked that old narrow range mono speaker can make such a convincing sound. It surely made me change my vision about audio equipment.
The owner of the WE system told me about cinema system. Theaters could not buy them, because WE only leased the system with a very strict contract to protect their technological secret. Hefty penalty if someone other than WE authorized person open the equipment. I don't know if it's true, though.
The owner of the WE system told me about cinema system. Theaters could not buy them, because WE only leased the system with a very strict contract to protect their technological secret. Hefty penalty if someone other than WE authorized person open the equipment. I don't know if it's true, though.
Yeah, from very early on I was told that to design sound systems one needed a good grounding in human hearing perception, particularly in the telephone BW.
Correct and very expensive even long after they began selling systems; for instance a 31A PA horn system in 1950 was $54 [railroad pricing] = $577.30 today according to this calculator, which buys multiples for similar today: InflationData.com's Cumulative Inflation Calculator
GM
The big cinema 15A horns have an acoustical ~15 ft path-length/8 ft square mouth IIRC [~14 ft/4.7 ft square actual] for a nominally flat 100-5000 Hz [AM radio BW] response, though could have been [was?] used higher/lower as more signal BW was squeezed onto the film strip, so if you want the 'ultimate' mono speaker for that primo restored Gramophone, AM radio or early 'talkie' DVD/bluray movie playback.........
Something I forgot to note earlier is that as good as it is, the 15A needs some bracing/damping for HIFI apps; or for a bit more compact, better constructed/performing option, the 12A [first cinema horn] with a ~300-4500 Hz BW is preferred and if later you need some bass reinforcement as W.E. did, there's the add on 13A bass horn.
It's a 2" VC/1" exit AFAIK, don't know the actual dome diameter, but these folks claim to know/have all the specs: GIP-555 / 555W
GM