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Multi-Way Conventional loudspeakers with crossovers

DIY 2-way design for a bookshelf
DIY 2-way design for a bookshelf
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Old 21st January 2019, 04:27 AM   #11
LineSource is offline LineSource  United States
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Troels Gravensen website has excellent cabinet construction tutorials.
Look over the Illuminator and SBAcoustics 61-NAC builds.
Illuminator-Monitor

-Illuminator Monitor cabinet will need to be adapted to these drivers.
-Moving the 2" port to the front baffle will allow box placement against the rear wall.
-The front port can be plugged for Qtc=0.57 sealed Bessel(min ripple) alignment.

-Metalized film capacitors like 400V Audyn
-Air core inductors AWG 15 or AWG 16 wire
-10W non-inductive resistors
-I used standard values to avoid higher cost of combining parts

---For high frequency SPL tuning: Purchase three 1-ohm resistors which can construct: 0.5-ohm, 0.66-ohm, 1-ohm, 1.5-ohm, 2-ohm, 3-ohm

?What will these speakers + crossover parts cost in Italy?
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File Type: jpg FrontPort.jpg (108.2 KB, 296 views)
File Type: jpg SB_aluminum.jpg (181.1 KB, 289 views)
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Old 21st January 2019, 05:46 AM   #12
kokoriantz is offline kokoriantz  Lebanon
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I don't buy shoes without trying them, I don't buy speakers without listening. I advise you this small speaker that really amazed me .
YouTube
Ask him the detailers .
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Old 21st January 2019, 02:20 PM   #13
zermak is offline zermak  Italy
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@LineSource
Yes, it looks like he is a good loudspeakers' maker and I've read many of his two-ways builds by now.
Illuminator is obviously out of my budget and indeed I am orientend to his 61-NAC build but sadly the crossover section is unavalaible and I should run a simulation to figure it out somehow and I can't tell you the total parts cost without it (but I guess that for a pair I could stay under 400 euros).
And if you are wondering I have dropped the idea to make the "fast ref monitor" becasue of its limited up end.


@kokoriantz
I am not a fan of audio clips honestly and I don't see the point to listening to them considering that tons of factors are involved for a proper objective and subjective analysis. Plus I would like to have some decent bass and it seems the ProAC clone uses a 5 inch woofer (I know that it's not everything but a bigger cone surely helps, if properly tuned).
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Old 21st January 2019, 09:59 PM   #14
zermak is offline zermak  Italy
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I can't edit my message so I'll write a new post, sorry.


So I've looked up the costs for the materials with your crossover schematics (using two 22uF in parallel for the 40uF: couldn't find like a 22+18 and two 10uF in series for the woofer to have the 20uF value, or maybe I'll just opt for a single 22uF here also; all Audyn MKP QS) and for both speakers, wood excluded, I am at 425 euros with shipping.
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Old 22nd January 2019, 03:02 AM   #15
LineSource is offline LineSource  United States
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midbass C1 can be 22uF
Ideally, tweeter C2 = 33uF is best. Does your store have 33uF?
====
1) Tuning series tweeter resistor for high frequency SPL : Purchase three 1-ohm resistors which can construct: 0.5-ohm, 0.66-ohm, 1-ohm, 1.5-ohm, 2-ohm, 3-ohm
-1.5 ohms models best
2) Baffle edge diffraction increases the on-axis SPL, and also increases off-axis energy spread into the room.
-How much you angle the front baffle toward the listener changes the amount of edge diffraction SPL heard.
---After you listener+room position your speakers, you can experiment with putting 0.5 -to- 2 ohm in series with midbass C1 to change the SPL heard by the listener around the diffraction freq range.

Google "Understanding Loudspeaker Cabinet Diffraction" By Jeff Bagby
=====
If it only requires a simple cost table lookup, you can price the plastic cone SB17MFC35-8 midbass design posted earlier for comparison.
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Old 22nd January 2019, 12:11 PM   #16
kokoriantz is offline kokoriantz  Lebanon
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I understood your budget was 400euros . These scanspeak marvels cost 600$ x2 + crossover.
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Old 22nd January 2019, 01:36 PM   #17
zermak is offline zermak  Italy
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@LineSource
Yes, the store I am looking at has the 33uF 400V from Audyn (MKP QS series).
I've read about crossover tuning based on baffle dimension and so on but I will look it up for sure.
By the way I've simulated your crossover (using spl data on a "infinite baffle" from both speakers, with VituixCAD and its trace SPL tool) and it looks like the midwoofer underperform in the 1000Hz region (+-500Hz) before the cut-off frequency (which seems to be around 2000Hz).
I am just asking; have you tuned it considering the cabinet and so on?


@kokoriantz
Yes, indeed I am not considering them, he is suggesting to tune that cabinet design for SB Acoustics drivers, which he did, I suppose, listing me a possible XO build also.

With the crossover parts listed by LineSource as you can read above I am at 425 euros with shipping so I am in my budget with the SB Acoustic combo.
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Old 22nd January 2019, 02:44 PM   #18
LineSource is offline LineSource  United States
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zermak View Post
I am just asking; have you tuned it considering the cabinet and so on?
I started with the SBAcoustics 61-NAC cabinet measurements with these drivers and made small adjustments based upon simulations of the larger beveled baffle. The LR4 circuit on the SB17NAC35-4 is required to fully attenuate the 6kHz metal cone breakup. The BW3 circuit on the tweeter is adjusted to help compensate for the baffle effects.
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Old 22nd January 2019, 02:56 PM   #19
zermak is offline zermak  Italy
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Thank you for the explanations and yes I totally agree on LR4 considering the SPL of this particular midwoofer at mid-high frequencies because of the aluminium cone (the paper cone version is more flat indeed).
On tweeter side I can't say much, it looks good in both crossover versions (the optimized one with the infinite baffle SPL from my simulation and yours).
If you're curious I can show you the XO which it suggests me using available components from the store I will buy from and maybe you can run a simulation with it and tell me the response.
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Old 22nd January 2019, 08:27 PM   #20
LineSource is offline LineSource  United States
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This is a better "general use" crossover.

Reduced tweeter SPL in order to provide about 3db bass baffle step.

Try these values in your simulation to confirm. You can compare the final tweeter + midwoofer SPL slopes with Troels SBAcoustics 61-NAC to confirm a very close match.

You can compare the SPL plot for your original "against the wall" goal vs. the SPL plot for this "general use" design more commonly selected.
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