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Multi-Way Conventional loudspeakers with crossovers

Worlds best two way domestic loudspeaker?
Worlds best two way domestic loudspeaker?
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Old 12th January 2019, 08:25 AM   #11
planet10 is offline planet10  Canada
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Worlds best two way domestic loudspeaker?
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I have tried fast type speakers with tg9 and different woofers, very impressive at first but not so in the longer run, i thought tg9 started to sound stressed at little higher sound levels, maybe i should order 10f and try the concept again.
The TG9 is OK. But you said best.

Look at the Alpair 5.2/6.2m/7.3. We’ve used the A7.3eN in a couple different WAW with seriously good performance.

Here is another members review of his build: Alpair 7.3eN/12pw WAW build (post 52). pictures @ post #47

Click the image to open in full size.

dave
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Old 12th January 2019, 08:44 AM   #12
Fernando R is offline Fernando R  United States
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John, you are so right about the performance of large woofer 2 way systems. As one who has made quite a few revolutions around the sun, I still fondly remember the Dynaco A25 as well as the original Advent. Unfortunately the price of the drivers have skyrocketed. A Seas A26RE4, the modern version of the Dynaco driver goes for $150. I suspect an inexpensive smooth 8" paper driver may be easier to find.
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Old 12th January 2019, 04:02 PM   #13
lowmass is offline lowmass  United States
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"Funny that you mention these drivers since they are what i listen to at the moment, the scan speak version on the tweeter though. They sit in 30 litre floor standing boxes and tuned to 40hz, the motor is a bit weak and i think i need bigger boxes for more output at 40-50hz, i like it a bit peaky in that register. I like these drivers better then the satoris."


I hear ya. Yea I just mention those drivers out there as examples that are just really easy to use and to feel out where this is going.


As mentioned however no 6 inch is gona do what I think your lookin for, We need much more area to get it.


I am presently at work developing a ribbon tweeter for the sole purpose to be able to use larger woofers in 2 way designs without serious compromise on midrange perf. The idea is to get a small ribbon to goto 1 Khz allowing easy use of many larger woofers.

I have found that so long as I don't have any crossovers above about 1K things become much easier and less skill is needed in the overall design.

The even lower crossed full range as mentioned by some certainly has its advantages, but over time I too miss the advantages of a smaller driver in the upper regions.

Seems to me (at the moment anyway) that a low crossed tweeter crossed to a larger woofer is about the best overall juggling of the compromises to get where I think your going. Im not completely sure however what may be the best approach here.

On the one hand I see a larger 12-15 inch woofer with a wave guided tweeter ( usually compression driver) crossed between about 800-1.2khz . Many swear by this arraignment. Great dynamics and loudness with very good pattern control. In the future I plan to use my ribbon in such a config.

Some talk about using 10-12 inch woofers crossed as high as 2k to a standard dome and having no major issues. I cannot say for sure but seems to me we have a potential for serious off axis response issues with such an arraignment unless the cones mechanical properties are carefully tailored to smoothly become a smaller source as frequency rises??

I hear a lot about very carful tailoring of crossovers to get good sound through mids with the larger woofers but now we are back to complex crossover builds that I personally am trying to avoid.

Anyway Im rambling on about things I don't know well enough to speak authoritatively about. All I know is within the limits of skill and ability of myself and many others I find 2 ways and getting the crossover at or below at least 1 khz makes getting some magic a much easier affair, and this is made easy with a tweeter that can go low.

So far I see an 8 inch woofer with a tweeter crossed no higher than about 1.5 K . or a larger woofer (if can find one well behaved past 1 k) with a wave guided tweeter the help match the woofers dispersion through the crossover


I always wonder however about the clarity and believability of larger woofers (12-15 inch) operating in well controlled breakup modes doing much of the midrange?? Every time I go back to a large pur ribbon I am struck by how "real" it sounds dispite the lack of loudness and dynamics.


Looking forward to see more suggestions from those with more experience and where this thred ends up

Last edited by lowmass; 12th January 2019 at 04:11 PM.
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Old 12th January 2019, 04:10 PM   #14
mordikai is offline mordikai  United States
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I would probably never spend this much on a 2-way design, but seems to do everything about aswell as a 2-way can.
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Old 12th January 2019, 06:46 PM   #15
LineSource is offline LineSource  United States
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Quote:
Originally Posted by celef View Post
I know that 3 ways are the ideal loudspeaker, the midrange driver does not have to deal with bass frequencies nor high frequencies and that is a huge benefit. However, i do think my 3 ways can be overly unfriendly and complex, when going active i have cables and amps all over the place, and turning to passives it gets even worse with more cables and crossover parts all over my listening room floor, there is almost no free space to walk on, i have to climb on the furniture.
"It's all about the sound quality you experience in your room"

BEST SOUND when: Each speaker has its own room-optimized crossover, and load-optimized amplifier. Active crossovers support deep bass in a modest volume. MAYBE.. packaging a great 3-way is your main challenge.

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Old 12th January 2019, 07:07 PM   #16
planet10 is offline planet10  Canada
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Worlds best two way domestic loudspeaker?
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Seems to me (at the moment anyway) that a low crossed tweeter crossed to a larger woofer is about the best overall juggling of the compromises
How low is low? You need to approach a centre-to-centre distance of less than a quarter wavelength of the XOed frequency.

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Old 12th January 2019, 07:12 PM   #17
6L6 is offline 6L6  United States
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Old 12th January 2019, 07:15 PM   #18
KaffiMann is offline KaffiMann  Norway
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Worlds best two way domestic loudspeaker?
There are quite good 15" around that are cheaper (and better IMO) per piece than some of the popular 10", and 1 x 15" is more fun than 2 x 10".

How big is big? And how small is small?
2 x 8" can be quite fun and engaging if it's done right and you need a slim build, but I would prefer a single 12" instead.

The "modern" approach to have slim towers sometimes complicate the build nedlessly IMO, and you're stuck making compromises you'd rather avoid.

Multiway crossovers are hard, and takes a lot of time to get right.
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Old 12th January 2019, 07:30 PM   #19
cspieker is offline cspieker
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Not sure if you are into horns
Take a look at my 2 way. I'm biased but it is very good.full range, extreme dynamic capabilities, one driver 500hz on up gives a magic to voices that I've never heard elsewhere. In a small room, the directivity will help you. It is active but like you said only 2 way it's not terribly complex, especially only needing a couple of watts for the horns. World's best is impossible, best for doing certain things means other things are compromised. Pick your poison, "open" sound, less/more room intetaction, resolution/forgiving to tough recordings.... You see my point. Good luck!

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Old 12th January 2019, 08:08 PM   #20
phase is offline phase  United States
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Does an array count?
I figured thatís the way to added area without extra circuitry.
Not sure what part of more complex speakers you donít like, if itís the added crossover, or just the idea of added stuff.
My Dad had witnessed something impressive back in 1970 with a large array at Governors State University outside of Chicago in their sound lab.
I still prefer my small magnepans with the series crossovers, after trying different setups, but my next choice would probably be an array of maybe 4-5Ē drivers.
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