What's it with Morel drivers?

Hello,

This thread isn't because I'm considering to buy and use Morel drivers but I was just wondering around on the internet looking at different drivers for fun looking at what makes them special and potentially good. Then I bumped on Morel.
I don't really understand their drivers. They have a very special way of putting them together. Their mid woofers have this very low profile design. I have seen it elsewhere with the Dayton Audio Esoteric series. There's probably a name for this kind of design, please tell me.
At first glance they seem insane(ly good). They have in some cases huge neodymium motors with voice coils in them as big as some entire drivers which can handle mind boggling amounts of power, some of their midranges have moving masses so low that it shouldn't be possible and most of their mid woofers seem to easily accomplish frequency response graphs any other manufacturer couldn't even dream.
But then you look at the exact numbers on the spec sheets and they are pretty weird in comparison with other drivers. Then you put them in box simulation software and optimize a little enclosure and then they don't really go that low, they are already at the edge of their Xmax at just a fraction of the kilowatts they're supposed to be able to handle and then when you expect that enormous voice coil to offer the best impuls response the world has ever seen but in fact it's one of the worst you've ever seen.
Morel isn't a huge name like Scan-Speak in the driver market but they are anything but small as well, their website is nice and up to date, Dynaudio has been successfully basing their drivers on Morel's for years and Morel won't be making all of their pretty expensive drivers by this principle because it's bad.
Is there something I'm missing? What's the secret to Morel drivers to using them correctly? Because they obviously SEEM like they have ou-of-this-world potentials but I don't understand how to unleash it. I'm just curious.

Sven
 
I think you can't be able to do something good in the simple way.
I have a pair of caw638 and I have never be able to make something good with it. The efficiency is bad, power handling seems less than the specs tells. I'm agree with you. This kind of driver need a hard work to make it sound right.
 
Who knows the truth?

History of Dynaudio

..."In 1975, I (US distributor, Mikhael Shabani) was running a retail store that was selling high-end audio gear. At that time, I paid a visit to my friend and cousin, Meir Mordechai, in Israel. He showed me some speaker cabinets that he had made, which interested me a lot, since he was using high quality drivers called Dynaudio. Later, I found out that Dynaudio agreed to sell him these drivers and have him assemble a couple of models in Israel for tax benefits. "...


edit: In respect to power specs of 1,000 W and more, it says transient power 10 ms.
There is not secret to voicing Morel based loudspeakers. Some imagination and a bit of a talent.
 
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An interesting topic. I don't use Morel bass units because they just don't model well. I get exactly what I need from SEAS drivers, so, not a problem.

However, mid and treble are a different story. Currently I'm using a SEAS L18, Morel EM1308 and Morel MDT30 in a three way + sub. The midrange on this speaker is amongst the best I've heard at any price.
 

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Their mid woofers have this very low profile design. I have seen it elsewhere with the Dayton Audio Esoteric series. There's probably a name for this kind of design, please tell me.
Inset magnet. That's why the voice coil is so large, because the magnet(s) has to fit inside the coil diameter.

Unfortunately, this type of motor design seems to bring drawbacks, such as a spider which supports a significantly smaller range of motion compared to a conventional design with smaller diameter voice coil. The motors in general seem to be less linear than similarly priced conventional motors (magnet outside coil), although this may be more a critique of the products actually being sold and not the potential of the magnet arrangement per se.

The commercial success of this type of design imho is more down to marketing than engineering finesse. It's successful because it is unique, not because it is better.
 
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This is what Zaph had to say about this style of woofer with inset magnets:

RE the Morel MW166: Comments: The response is smooth enough to work with, but this driver is plagued by highish tall order distortion through the midrange. It has a huge voice coil (3") but a tiny spider supporting it. I don't recommend this driver as it's non-linear distortion of all types is pretty obvious with most music. Tested October 2005.

Re the similat HiVI D6.8: Comments: This Hi-Vi poly cone driver has a 3" voice coil with an inset magnet similar to Morel and Dynaudio woofers. The difference is that the Hi-Vi has a superior motor and outperforms them in the harmonic distortion department. If I were going to use this style of inset magnet woofer, I would choose the Hi-Vi over Morel or Dynaudio.
 
We merely get to the one point where I fundamentally disagree with Dr Geddes.

I always suspected that I very much hear and dislike non-linear distortion and with Klippels online double blind test I was able to prove it to myself.
Others may well be less able to or can choose (consciously or subconsciously) not to hear it but I do and it is very, very annoying to me.
 
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I used the Morel TSCW636 woofers in my Cecropia Supreme project, and I can say they are wonderful drivers without a doubt. These have some of the best midrange I've heard in terms of hearing the depth of mix in front of you.

I've included a comparison of the CAW634 vs TSCW636 in the 2 optimized versions of my Cecropias. You can see the HD is much lower on the TSCW vs the CAW in the system measurements.

The MDM55 is a remarkable midrange, and is in some of the best sounding designs of both commercial and DIY. The Supreme tweeters are also very good and very low HD.

I do agree that the Fs on the standard range tweeters tends to be a little higher than spec, as well as the standard range woofers needing a bit more Xmax than supplied to do well into the lower registers. However, the TSCW line is SOTA when it comes to drivers.

Later,
Wolf
 

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I cannot speak to distortion and such, but I enjoyed the tweet cat 378 with its 6db crossed 6db down @ 2khz.
80 watt onkyo receiver, no problem.

And Jeff Bagby's "solstice" morel driver kit using ticw 6.5's and cat 308 tweet, amazing.
Wrap tweeter with 1/2" F10 felt for even more improvement.
 
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In my opinion Morel drivers seem to elicit extreme responses. Some people love them and some people hate them. I probably never would have bought mine if the datasheet looked like my drivers actually measured (and I suspect that a lot of the people who hate them have never heard them in a good design).

However I persevered with my ragged MW144's and eventually got something that sounds pretty good to my ears (and my wifes, and pretty much anyone who cares to listen to them). They measure reasonably well too.

I will also echo what others have said, there is something special about the midrange.

When I bought them 14 years ago my criteria were different to what they are today. Power handling was a big draw card, but so was the fact that the motors had virtually no stray magnetic field (which was important as they were near a CRT TV).

A lot of people will never buy morel drivers because of how they look on paper, or because of comments like zaph's. I was very frustrated with mine for a time (mainly trying to work out why their response was like it was) in the end I just worked with it and got a great (IMHO) result (though I still think it can be improved).

I have to admit I would be hesitant to buy another set of Morels without seeing some fr graphs of the actual drivers (since mine were so different to manufacturers specs) simply because I don't want to go to heroic efforts with the crossover again. But I don't regret for a second, the purchase I made back in 2004 of 4 X MW144's and 2 X DMS37's that set me back around $1000 AU at the time. A rather foolish purchase for a first "from scratch" design. but one that eventually paid off :)

Tony.