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Multi-Way Conventional loudspeakers with crossovers

beryllium diaphragm VS titanium diaphragm
beryllium diaphragm VS titanium diaphragm
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Old 20th August 2018, 06:20 PM   #1
koutrou is offline koutrou  Greece
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Default beryllium diaphragm VS titanium diaphragm

someone says that beryllium diaphragm is better than titanium and make sound cleaner and better but i think this is marketing becase is expensive product. So after some research i found audioexpress page showing Radian 745NeoBe that 118 - 120 db produce 60 - 65 db 3ed harmonic distortion and B&C De980NT-8 WITH 118 - 120 db produce 45 - 50 db 3ed harmonic distortion and also higher frequency extension.

Also you will never see any Top brand use beryllium as L Acustics (Which has excellent sound and not even high presure levels distortion or harash sound...)
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Old 20th August 2018, 09:18 PM   #2
hottattoo is offline hottattoo  United States
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It's about Physics. Beryllium is lighter and stiffer then any of the common diaphragm materials. I have and use both beryllium and aluminums and can say beryllium is the best (but expensive ) sounding in my compression driver horn system. Titanium annoys my ears !!! My personal experience in my system and 2 cents worth.
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Old 20th August 2018, 09:49 PM   #3
ErnieM is offline ErnieM  United States
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Beryllium is technically better. Titanium gets its upper output from diaphragm breakup. Beryllium stays pistonic throughout the same range giving the impression of less extentsion when in reality it's capable of tracking the signal much more accurately when eq is applied.
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Old 20th August 2018, 10:31 PM   #4
jtgofish is offline jtgofish
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There are good and bad titanium drivers.
I own Yamaha NS75Ts speakers which use titanium mids and tweeters and have also used Yamaha NS1000s that use beryllium mids and tweeters.The NS 75Ts [titanium] sound much better.
Some of the JBL titanium tweeters also sounded excellent.
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Old 21st August 2018, 01:44 AM   #5
cyberstudio is offline cyberstudio  Canada
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Voice Coil Spotlight: The Beryllium Advantage | audioXpress
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Old 21st August 2018, 02:21 AM   #6
koutrou is offline koutrou  Greece
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this graph is old
Figure3FrequencyResponseandHarmonicDistortion.jpg

In our days mesurments shows other wach Radian 745NeoBe VS B&C De980NT-8 audioexpress Bench Test Tehnology of new titanium diaphragms are much better

Radian
Figure9-RadianAudio745NEOBe.jpg

B&C
Figure8-BnC-DE980TN-8CompressionDrvr.jpg

After 8khz B&C distrotion rised slightly but even so in top end they gonna have about same distortion & down than 10-12 KHZ lower distortion. There are many parametres for a good driver and not only diaphfragm.

Last edited by koutrou; 21st August 2018 at 02:30 AM.
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Old 21st August 2018, 03:17 AM   #7
katana1100 is offline katana1100  United States
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I was given a tour of the Harmon works back in the 90’s by the engineer who developed their titanium driver for their compression speakers . In his lab they had a beryllium cp, I think made by matsushita. He said it was outstanding and set the bar on performance. I asked why they didn’t just use beryllium and he said the lawyers wouldn’t allow it. If it shatters, it is poisonous or something like that.

Beryllium is superior because it’s lighter and stronger. When a driver moves, parts of it actually are moving backwards. On their computer, you could see this, parts zigging when they should be zagging. This causes cancellation. Of course, you could make the driver thicker to reduce that but hey, there goes response.

You can see how, when it comes to conventional speakers, berylium is the best Material .
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Old 21st August 2018, 05:12 AM   #8
jtgofish is offline jtgofish
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If you're are talking technical performance Zylon is much better than both beryllium and and titanium and to my ears sounds much better than both too-
https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=...xsMDC32_l0awrU

Last edited by jtgofish; 21st August 2018 at 05:14 AM.
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Old 21st August 2018, 09:03 AM   #9
Scottmoose is offline Scottmoose  United Kingdom
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Quote:
Originally Posted by koutrou View Post
someone says that beryllium diaphragm is better than titanium and make sound cleaner and better but i think this is marketing becase is expensive product. So after some research i found audioexpress page showing Radian 745NeoBe that 118 - 120 db produce 60 - 65 db 3ed harmonic distortion and B&C De980NT-8 WITH 118 - 120 db produce 45 - 50 db 3ed harmonic distortion and also higher frequency extension.

Also you will never see any Top brand use beryllium as L Acustics (Which has excellent sound and not even high presure levels distortion or harash sound...)
Are those drive units identical in every single respect other than the diaphragm material (including profile, thickness &c.)? If they aren't, your comparison is utterly worthless, since you have changed almost every single variable and haven't the first idea where and what causes the differences in performance.

Beryllium is technically superior to titanium for the reasons mentioned above: it has a higher stiffness / weight ratio, which when used optimally, allows a wider pistonic BW and potentially higher SPLs under otherwise identical conditions. So from that perspective, it doesn't make the slightest difference whether you think it is all marketing, because the laws of physics and engineering have rather obvious reasons for using it. Whether the implementation is of sufficient quality to exploit these potential advantages is another (separate) question: that is a matter of driver design.
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Old 21st August 2018, 09:04 AM   #10
system7 is offline system7  United Kingdom
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There are so many other factors than dome material that I find this difficult.

But here are the two 34mm BlieSMA tweeters that are exciting people. Slightly different dome profiles, the AL being more rounded.

Beryllium gains on the higher first resonance at 32kHz rather than 27kHz and 1.5dB more efficiency. The frequency response and off-axis dispersion looks more a function of dome profile.

But not the smoking gun to say expensive and toxic beryllium is a compelling buy IMO. Titanium has its uses too, it is tougher for high power applications apparently.

SB Acoustics are doing interesting things with anodised Aluminium, which they call ceramic, and diffusors and flatter profiles which look good at the price too. But really, what's not to like about the affordable 1" SB26ADC?

All three illustrations are non-ferrofluid designs, BTW.
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File Type: jpg BlieSMa_T34A-4.JPG (58.8 KB, 402 views)
File Type: jpg SB Acoustics SB26ADC.JPG (58.9 KB, 403 views)
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