Again, having an speaker for store was just an idea not the goal, i have no idea how the store works, but i can imaging carrying such 3 way speaker kit require some large storage area and of course serious investment, that i m not sure if our store is up to task, again I HAVE NO IDEA how diy store works.
The goal was to come up with a well documented design, unique, that deserve the DIYAUDIO label on it and since there a lot of different preferences we have polls.
The goal was to come up with a well documented design, unique, that deserve the DIYAUDIO label on it and since there a lot of different preferences we have polls.
This thread exist for the same reason most of the threads here exist- to interact and share with others of similar interest. Simple.
This forum desperately needs some new varieties of speaker projects. For obvious reasons there are very few large 3 way hifi focused speakers around here, or on other forums for that matter. I'm surprised there are people suggesting an econowave or fullrange project as there are literally dozens well represented here.
I say let's move forward with driver selections and a build.
This forum desperately needs some new varieties of speaker projects. For obvious reasons there are very few large 3 way hifi focused speakers around here, or on other forums for that matter. I'm surprised there are people suggesting an econowave or fullrange project as there are literally dozens well represented here.
I say let's move forward with driver selections and a build.
Hi mordikai,
By large 3 way hifi what do you mean, speakers like Troels SBA10, The Tarkus or Astor :
SBAcoustics 10
Tarkus - undefinition
Astor
Or something bigger ?
I think that the combo 10"+ 6.5"+1" is the biger speaker you can put in conventional living rooms 25m2.
I would pleased be involved in such a project
.
By large 3 way hifi what do you mean, speakers like Troels SBA10, The Tarkus or Astor :
SBAcoustics 10
Tarkus - undefinition
Astor
Or something bigger ?
I think that the combo 10"+ 6.5"+1" is the biger speaker you can put in conventional living rooms 25m2.
I would pleased be involved in such a project
.
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A range of suggestions are coming forward for the type of 3 way. This is probably progress but we will have to get behind one or two later and this will mean people dropping out because it is not within their field of interest. It might be wise to avoid a design by committee where nobody remains sufficiently motivated to build the speaker. I would suggest this needs a theme that one or two can get a bit passionate about.
I think the op should possibly be editted to make clear this is a collaborative diyaudio design-and-make project (or possibly just design) and not a venture on behalf of the store. Unless the consensus is otherwise of course.
So what type of speaker? I suggested earlier a 3 way using standard range drivers and conventional good design practice to create a high fidelity speaker that is good value for money. Not particularly exciting but it is something that gets asked for and the current designs I am aware of are a bit quirky in one or two respects. Total budget including cabinet of under $1k. The theme could be something like the best technical performance for $1k in an acceptable package for the living room.
Charlie has put forward a suggestion of 3/4 of a 4 way with the theme presumably being small size. This could be developed in terms of budget, maximum size, minimum acceptable performance.
Planet10 possibly favours wideband drivers with subwoofer and supertweeter support. I don't know how to develop a target spec for such speakers but others presumably can.
Someone mentioned a monitor-type speaker earlier with a single large woofer. This could be developed into a spec.
What else?
I think the op should possibly be editted to make clear this is a collaborative diyaudio design-and-make project (or possibly just design) and not a venture on behalf of the store. Unless the consensus is otherwise of course.
So what type of speaker? I suggested earlier a 3 way using standard range drivers and conventional good design practice to create a high fidelity speaker that is good value for money. Not particularly exciting but it is something that gets asked for and the current designs I am aware of are a bit quirky in one or two respects. Total budget including cabinet of under $1k. The theme could be something like the best technical performance for $1k in an acceptable package for the living room.
Charlie has put forward a suggestion of 3/4 of a 4 way with the theme presumably being small size. This could be developed in terms of budget, maximum size, minimum acceptable performance.
Planet10 possibly favours wideband drivers with subwoofer and supertweeter support. I don't know how to develop a target spec for such speakers but others presumably can.
Someone mentioned a monitor-type speaker earlier with a single large woofer. This could be developed into a spec.
What else?
Wouldn't it be more interesting to poll about what compromises people prefer than how many drivers a speaker has? To find the optimal compromise speaker and design over that
- high waf / i decide the looks
- cheapish / i got money
- small / bigger is better
- analog / dsp crossover
- normal listening level / proper spl capability
- drop one: high spl / low extension / small size
- i've got space and time to listen in a sweetspot / what is a sweetspot?
- all genre / "hifi" taste
etc.
- high waf / i decide the looks
- cheapish / i got money
- small / bigger is better
- analog / dsp crossover
- normal listening level / proper spl capability
- drop one: high spl / low extension / small size
- i've got space and time to listen in a sweetspot / what is a sweetspot?
- all genre / "hifi" taste
etc.
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A typical English classic speaker looks attractive to me, the Harbeth, Spendor style...
The cabinet is easy to make, they mostly have a rectengular shape.
A three way with 8, 5 and 1 inch drivers or 10, 7 and 1 inch,...there are a lot of combinations possible.
Floorstander of monitor type on foot.
The idea to make a 3-way speaker on a foot, with the option to replace the foot by an extra woofer cabinet to make it 4-way or even a second woofer cabinet on top to make a powerful 4-way stays interesting for me.
You can start with the 3-way and upgrade it to a more powerful 4-way with 1 or 2 extra woofers.
These are just ideas from my side.
Paul
The cabinet is easy to make, they mostly have a rectengular shape.
A three way with 8, 5 and 1 inch drivers or 10, 7 and 1 inch,...there are a lot of combinations possible.
Floorstander of monitor type on foot.
The idea to make a 3-way speaker on a foot, with the option to replace the foot by an extra woofer cabinet to make it 4-way or even a second woofer cabinet on top to make a powerful 4-way stays interesting for me.
You can start with the 3-way and upgrade it to a more powerful 4-way with 1 or 2 extra woofers.
These are just ideas from my side.
Paul
Attachments
Then it won't be a 3 way. You will need the supertweeter even if it is not connected or perhaps a sub-sub woofer?
The trade off between low frequency extension, size and sensitivity would indeed be a topic for discussion if it doesn't follow naturally from the kind of 3 way speaker that is adopted. Unless something unexpected happens with the poll the capabilities of 2 ways would seem irrelevant since the design looks to be a 3 way.
I get that, but there is no reason to go for a 3 way unless you want much higher sensitivity, but then you'd have to choose between size and low frequency extension again. Adding more drivers introduce more issues than it's worth IMO. And if this is supposed to be a cost-effective design meant for everyone it sort of defeats the purpose if it's overly complicated and humongous.
But it's entirely possible to make a good, decent sized 3 way that is still relatively simple and not too pricey. Just wondering if people have these thoughts lurking around behind their ears somewhere. Please understand that this comment is intended with a modicum of humour.
But it's entirely possible to make a good, decent sized 3 way that is still relatively simple and not too pricey. Just wondering if people have these thoughts lurking around behind their ears somewhere. Please understand that this comment is intended with a modicum of humour.
Hi mordikai,
By large 3 way hifi what do you mean, speakers like Troels SBA10, The Tarkus or Astor :
SBAcoustics 10
Tarkus - undefinition
Astor
Or something bigger ?
I think that the combo 10"+ 6.5"+1" is the biger speaker you can put in conventional living rooms 25m2.
I would pleased be involved in such a project
I'm personally more interested in a larger speaker 12-15" woofer. I have the space and figure it's easier to get the combination of sensitivity and extension (90db+, 30-35hz) with a larger woofer. I realize this may limit interest.
I do have a pair of Kairos so I do find the sba 10 interesting because I could just ad the woofer and change the crossover, but I really want a little more sensitivity for my small amps.
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i thought about this waking up this morning...why not have a multitude of poll with only 2 voting option at a time, so that the disucussion can be focused on and constructive, and leave no place to interpretation.
A thread/poll on design goal could be great also first of all. (best speaker possible? best value? build by most people? etc)
I personnaly think the absolute key/goal/raison d'être to building a good successful speaker here on a FORUM is having as many people involved as possible. So we should no skimp on how we are going to select parts/designs. Lots of people will just be put off by a bad process, not the outcome.
A thread/poll on design goal could be great also first of all. (best speaker possible? best value? build by most people? etc)
I personnaly think the absolute key/goal/raison d'être to building a good successful speaker here on a FORUM is having as many people involved as possible. So we should no skimp on how we are going to select parts/designs. Lots of people will just be put off by a bad process, not the outcome.
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This is a common situation...design by committee basically never works. There's always an architect that has a vision and takes the ball and goes in his/her own direction--which is what I typically recommend at this point. Attempts at homogenization of design/product goals usually throws the baby out with the bathwater.
I'd strongly recommend picking something that interests you and that is informed by what you've already seen in the polling and the "discussions" that have ensued. Egos always get in the way, and the kitchen only needs one cook.
In terms of recommendations for how to proceed, usually there is some approach that's unique and enticing that the architect sees in a set of design characteristics to pursue (and virtually no one else usually does until the product is finished and working). These usually are near-and-dear to the heart of the architect, and it something that they are going to do anyway at some point in their life. I recommend going in that direction--and don't follow what everyone else has done or what they think that they want (and it's also been my experience these others usually don't want a product the exact way that they say that they do). They want something that they can't have. Find something that they haven't articulated, but they won't be able to live without once you articulate your vision. I'd actually keep that vision to yourself (more or less) until you've refined it a bit, and even then I'd be careful about discussing it--wanting "feedback". You'll always get someone or even a group of people that wants to talk you out of what you really want to do...it's basic human nature, it seems. Do your own thing, and keep it quiet for a while until you begin to see the design falling into place. (You can always ask technical questions about tradeoffs going one way or the other, but I'd keep those to pretty generic discussions and don't tip your hand.)
...and all the above is free of charge, of course...
Chris
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Ok, here's a target for discussion -
How about a three-way with an 21cm woofer (8"), 11-13cm (4-5") midrange and 25mm (1") tweeter. (I.E., an 8" monkey coffin)
Crossover points 500 and 5000 (as a nice starting target)
Cabinet approximately 30x35x60cm for ~63L (11 3/4 x 13 3/4 x 23 1/2, 2.2ft3) before mid chamber or stuffing, port, bracing, etc...
Vented or sealed as will best accommodate the woofer
How about a three-way with an 21cm woofer (8"), 11-13cm (4-5") midrange and 25mm (1") tweeter. (I.E., an 8" monkey coffin)
Crossover points 500 and 5000 (as a nice starting target)
Cabinet approximately 30x35x60cm for ~63L (11 3/4 x 13 3/4 x 23 1/2, 2.2ft3) before mid chamber or stuffing, port, bracing, etc...
Vented or sealed as will best accommodate the woofer
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