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Multi-Way Conventional loudspeakers with crossovers

HT receivers for active speakers
HT receivers for active speakers
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Old 6th June 2018, 11:20 PM   #11
wcwc is offline wcwc  United States
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Join Date: Oct 2011
My Marantz receiver has 7.1 channel inputs. It is 5 years old. The current Marantz Models also do. Before the advent of HDMI it was a lot more prevalent in AVRs. There are a bunch of old AVRs without HDMI out there available for dirt cheap that have this capability. On my Marantz the 7.1 channel inputs get sent to the speaker outputs without any processing (too cheap to add 8 channels of ADC). There is volume control, but that is it.
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Old 7th June 2018, 06:36 AM   #12
Qts is offline Qts
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I think this is very nice way to get cheap, nice package of 4 or 6 amplifier channels. I have all equipment, but haven´t tried it jet.
Yamaha RX-V667
Minidsp 2x4
Pair of BMS 15C262

I have used 6th and 7th channels (zone2) for subwoofer.
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Old 7th June 2018, 07:16 AM   #13
jklow888 is offline jklow888  Australia
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I looked into this as well for my OB active bi-amping. There does not appear to be a receiver or pre-pro (even boutique) that would have bi-amp capabilities such that you could duplicate the left and right channel signals to a pair of unused amplified channels (or even pre-out) AND have full control to apply a high pass AND low pass to the e.g left + right for upper range frequencies and then use the spare surround left + right for low range frequencies. The newer ones definitely won't let you do this as the inbuilt EQ software would be confused. I've even considered using zone 2 where left + right you could have the receiver do a high pass and then zone 2 you could send to woofer amps which have low pass filters - the potential problem as noted by various big name brand distributors was the issue of potential time delays between zone 2 and your primary left + right channels - that might be something that works for you ?

Otherwise you are going to have to get a PLLXO or miniDSP or some line level crossover to split from your source into 4 multi-channel inputs.

Assuming you want OB for left + right and you have a HT setup to keep in the mix (like I do) you can pick up another cheap receiver to drive the left + right after the main receiver output to your analog crossover. I picked up a used AMC 2445a power amp to drive my two way OB's with 45x4 @ 4 Ohms with a miniDSP HD and after some advice from miniDSP (in HK) got the desired outcome and left my 5 channel power amp to drive my center + surrounds. The center will eventually be replaced with an OB but using a passive xover so the extra power from the 5 channel amp will help in overcoming passive losses.
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Old 7th June 2018, 08:20 AM   #14
ErikdeBest is offline ErikdeBest  Switzerland
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HT receivers for active speakers
Thanks for all the replies! Indeed, older AVRs have multichannel in - i dont know about newer ones. But the intend is to indeed use technically obsolete HT - dirt cheap - and use only Volume and the power amps.
Heading for holydays now!
Erik
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Old 7th June 2018, 08:22 AM   #15
erkki1 is offline erkki1  Germany
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My OB setup with active bi-amping:
I purchased old and cheap Denon AVR-2106 receiver, 7.1 channels.
It already has internal setup for bi-amping, by using the back surround channels in parallel with front channels. But that did not solve the cross-over thing.

So, I ended to make some re-wiring with the front and back channel inputs. I cut the power amp input lines and wired them to back panel, re-using RCA connectors from component video input. Now there is pre-out and power amp in for front and back channel amps, and MiniDSP 2x4HD for cross-over and EQ.
The receiver works completely as original, but of course only up to 5.1 mode. Well, no component video input anymore but...
Completed by couple hours soldering job.
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Old 7th June 2018, 12:57 PM   #16
hbc is offline hbc  United Kingdom
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Sony STR DB1070 has one 6.1 input that can be configured as three on the left 3 on the right. My friend has one he has been using with a 6 channel sound card for stereo 3 way.
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Old 7th June 2018, 01:17 PM   #17
AudioH is offline AudioH  United Kingdom
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Default A (HT) receiver as Amps

Hi, Yes It can be done quite simply.


I use a Marantz 7002 AV receiver in '7.1' bypass mode(i.e. all signals presented to the AV pre-ins are sent directly to the AV amp channels), driven by a pair of XKitz 2-way active crossovers. The XKitz crossovers are driven from a preamp fixed level line out from where I select the required source. Speaker treble and bass drivers use the front and surround back channels. I also have my Oppo 105 feeding the surround channels so I actually have active front and passive surrounds in a 4 channel configuration for surround sound and movies, all from the 7002. The Marantz volume control (or remote) manages all front and surround volume levels. Volume balance between front and rears is adjusted in the Oppo.
Works fine, SQ is really good.


regards
Howard
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Old 7th June 2018, 04:16 PM   #18
cph2000 is offline cph2000  Denmark
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If you have a receiver with HDMI in, you could use a minidsp nanoAVR as a DSP crossover passing the different channels to HDMI out. In this way the signal chain stays digital all the way to the amp

https://www.minidsp.com/products/ht-series/nanoavr-hd
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Old 7th June 2018, 06:14 PM   #19
chrisb is offline chrisb
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wcwc - thanks for that, I stand corrected - just never ran across it before on any of the units I've owned or set up for family members.

As I alluded above, keeping track of the constantly changing feature set and functionality of every model in all major and minor lines of AVRs/ processorss is a Sisyphean task.

jklow888 - for example, the Onkyo TX NR818 has fairly comprehensive digital crossover / bi-amp function (uses the front height pair amp channels), with 14 pre-selected XO frequencies ranging from 250 to 5000Hz. It also allows for phase inversion of tweeters, and virtual offset position of mid/woofer to tweeters in 1 in increments up to 12" . It has a total of 11 amp channels that can be assigned in a dizzying array of configurations (and this is several years "pre-Atmos") and variable line outs for all of them. No mulit-channel inputs that can directly access the amps in a bypass mode, though.

You can download the owner's manuals for most models now to read very carefully through the operations, the full functionality of which are often glossed over on the summary or even details of features on the websites, and as for finding a salesperson at most big-box stores that would have a clue what you're talking about - well good luck with that.

Have you looked into the Outlaw or Emotiva lines? The Outlaw 976 looks particularly interesting. https://www.outlawaudio.com/products/976.html
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Old 8th June 2018, 12:39 AM   #20
jklow888 is offline jklow888  Australia
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The problem is you don't get separate left + right low pass controls for your woofers (assuming you want to do a simple two way). I've read many manuals and called around to all the distributors talking to technical product managers and that is the one thing missing. The units with dual woofer output will sum the L+R which is a real shame - if you had the option to have left to left subout and right to right subout (.1 tracks would be summed to both) then you could do all of this in a receiver and just split the woofer preout to your OB and if needed to actual sub-woofer units to use those low pass filters for the final bottom end control for movies. Product managers agree this is a feature that could be easily implemented but the %tage of owners using this would be small so that is unlikely to happen.

As for hardware, I still use my Emotiva UMC-1 (yes it is still in full working order after all these years !) but with full range output for the L+R output to the miniDSP with increased output done in the UMC-1 and/or Oppo 83 to feed a high enough SNR to the miniDSP HD before the AMC 2445a which (thankfully) has input gain controls compared to my Emo XPA-5 which doesn't.

FYI - also came across this today as an alternative to miniDSP at the same price point:

Dayton Audio DSP-408 4x8 DSP Digital Signal Processor for Home and Car Audio

While no input EQ or REW EQ import integration, you can do 2-way or 3-way and bring in subs for a stereo setup. I would love to have tried this ahead of the miniDSP HD so I could opt to use my sub for < 30hz but I am all done with that part of my project ...
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