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Multi-Way Conventional loudspeakers with crossovers

Kairos 3-way cabinet
Kairos 3-way cabinet
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Old 21st April 2018, 06:57 PM   #21
Ita0101 is offline Ita0101  Israel
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Sorry for double post.

I prefer speaker with midrange to handle the mids instead of midwoofer.
In that case the combination of Adelphos + 12" Sealed is not ideal again.

Maybe someone can share build plans for Satori 3-way based on:
1" Satori tweeter
5" Satori midrange
9.5" Satori woofers
It is almost beyond my total budget but if something with those drivers can be achieved I will go for it.

If not the Ekta MK II is my best option.

Thanks!

Last edited by Ita0101; 21st April 2018 at 07:25 PM.
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Old 23rd April 2018, 10:34 AM   #22
jtgofish is offline jtgofish
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Richidoo View Post
Don't forget that Kairos has 6dB baffle step compensation. It would be nice to remove most of that to gain back that lost sensitivity when active woofer relieves the low frequency burden from the midwoofer. The low sensitivity of Kairos is one of the few negatives.

If you haven't built your Kairos yet, you could use the new Satori midrange drivers instead of the Kairos midwoofer.

A pair of Satori 9" per side will match the sensitivity of the new mid and the old ferrite Satori tweeter to make about 90dB sensitivity speaker. One of my future dream projects.
A bit like this kit Essenza from Selah Audio?
Essenza — Selah Audio
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Old 23rd April 2018, 01:50 PM   #23
Ita0101 is offline Ita0101  Israel
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The Essenza has 2 x 7.5' woofers and uses midwoofer and not midrange
Look really nice speaker..
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Old 24th April 2018, 06:51 PM   #24
Zonneschimmel is offline Zonneschimmel  Belgium
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ita0101 View Post
Sorry for double post.

I prefer speaker with midrange to handle the mids instead of midwoofer.
In that case the combination of Adelphos + 12" Sealed is not ideal again.

Maybe someone can share build plans for Satori 3-way based on:
1" Satori tweeter
5" Satori midrange
9.5" Satori woofers
It is almost beyond my total budget but if something with those drivers can be achieved I will go for it.

If not the Ekta MK II is my best option.

Thanks!
I recently changed my tweeter to the satori so I have that exact speaker :-). It's active though, lots of pics and measurements here:

Achilles FIR 4-way
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Old 24th April 2018, 07:24 PM   #25
Ita0101 is offline Ita0101  Israel
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Originally Posted by Zonneschimmel View Post
I recently changed my tweeter to the satori so I have that exact speaker :-). It's active though, lots of pics and measurements here:

Achilles FIR 4-way
Final results looks awesome!

I'm total newbie in loudspeakers design & build, so for the first build I'm going with the Ekta MK II by Troels.
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Old 24th April 2018, 10:28 PM   #26
LineSource is offline LineSource  United States
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ita0101 View Post
1" Satori tweeter
5" Satori midrange
9.5" Satori woofers
Satori Avalon using CAD tools

~3cuft ported woofer volume -F3 ~24Hz
--3" diameter port, 8.8" long, flared on both ends
---two "4-window" horizontal braces
---one top-to-bottom interlocking vertical brace
---absorption material

~0.15cuft sealed midrange(up to 0.25cuft is fine)
--wide at front baffle for air flow
--deep enough for easy rear air flow + brace to rear wall
--absorption material

Beveled front baffle = 3*0.75" thick
---bottom does not need bevels, except for "style"
Attached Images
File Type: jpg Satori Avalon.jpg (157.9 KB, 724 views)
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Old 25th April 2018, 10:01 PM   #27
Ita0101 is offline Ita0101  Israel
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Originally Posted by LineSource View Post
Satori Avalon using CAD tools

~3cuft ported woofer volume -F3 ~24Hz
--3" diameter port, 8.8" long, flared on both ends
---two "4-window" horizontal braces
---one top-to-bottom interlocking vertical brace
---absorption material

~0.15cuft sealed midrange(up to 0.25cuft is fine)
--wide at front baffle for air flow
--deep enough for easy rear air flow + brace to rear wall
--absorption material

Beveled front baffle = 3*0.75" thick
---bottom does not need bevels, except for "style"
Thanks!

Looks GREAT.

I consulted with a friend about the the topic and his advice to build the Ekta MK II, the reasons are that I have great subwoofer, and probably I will have 2 subs in the near future, with that case the Ekta II design with midrange and midwoofer vs. the satori-avalon with midranage + woofer - at small room it can be too boomy, and even if not he thinks I would prefer 2midranges + sub VS mid + woofer + sub
I'm familiar with SS drivers.
First build.

On the other hand, the Satori-Avalon should be awesome!
What do you think?

About the Avalon design -
How do I know where to locate exactly the 4-window braces?
Can I place it where I want?
interlocking vertical brace - Does it mean bracing top-bottom with a step for the back wall?
Similar to Ekta MK II design? link
It can be use with the Satori TW-29B-B (beryllium dome tweeter with ferrite magnet)?



Any advice is more than welcome

Last edited by Ita0101; 25th April 2018 at 10:30 PM.
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Old 1st May 2018, 09:03 PM   #28
Ita0101 is offline Ita0101  Israel
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I think to go with avalon satori 3 way.

Linesource -
Can you please share more deatils about crossover parts?
I'm total noob and could'nt understand :<

About the cabinet - I think I will figure out how to make it.

Thanks!
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Old 4th May 2018, 05:44 PM   #29
LineSource is offline LineSource  United States
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ita0101 View Post
Linesource -
Can you please share more deatils about crossover parts?
I'm total noob and could'nt understand
About the cabinet - I think I will figure out how to make it.
The rectangular cabinet volume is a standard, well braced box like Troels vertical beveled-baffle Ekta Grande, or stepped-baffle Ekta mk2. Use a 2"-2.2" thick (3*0.75") stacked baffle which allows deep top+side edge bevel cuts as used by Avalon, and the Hulgich Ella_mk2 example with dimensions H45 W13 D17

Use the attached crossover schematic component values. I made a couple changes from earlier ckts to both smooth the baffle step compensation for a modest volume room, and to select common values for the large 5mH-7mH inductors from Erse / Sledgehammer. Metalized film capacitors like the 400V Audyn family can be used. The C1=140uF midrange capacitor in the schematic should be built from one 100uf cap and two 20uF capacitors in parallel, because you may favor C1=120uF for slightly less midbass gain if the speakers are near the wall. The C8=150uF woofer capacitor can be a low cost bennic-bipolar, or built from 2-3 metalized film capacitors like the 400V Audyn family if cost is not an issue.
===============
If you decide to use a passive crossover, the modest efficiency of the single WO24P-8 woofer, especially after baffle step correction SPL reductions, requires attenuation of the midrange(ckt diagram). This can lead to selection of the lower efficiency MW13P-8 midbass with Xmax=5mm and lower sealed box -F3 frequency instead of the MR13P-8 with Xmax=3mm. Passive crossovers often favor lower component count circuits with larger Xmax demands from the modest slopes.

If you decide to use an active crossover with one amplifier per driver and steeper crossover slopes, you can consider the MR13P-8 with lower Le and Mms.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg Satori 3way Pyramid.jpg (175.7 KB, 611 views)
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Old 4th May 2018, 08:03 PM   #30
Ita0101 is offline Ita0101  Israel
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Thanks a lot!
I really appreciated your guide. Your comments all over the forum are treasures of explanations for newbie like me.

I need rethink about my plans.

Since I'm really new to speaker/xover design, in other post, other forum member advice me to build cheaper passive 2-way speaker by myself for understanding and learning.
I want to understand all about speakers/xovers design & build. And it seems that the way is to start with affordable 2-way with a lot of reading (forums, books, etc).

I might start with 2-way SB Acoutics: SB12CAC + SB21RDC.
I just purchased a Kindle copy of "Designing, Building, and Testing Your Own Speaker System with Projects".

If it goes well, I might build 3-way passive with Satori Beryllium + 5" + 9.5"

On the other hand, I have here almost a ready kit..so it is very attempting and I need a night or two to think what to do.


I will update as soon as I will make up my mind.


Last edited by Ita0101; 4th May 2018 at 08:09 PM.
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