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Multi-Way Conventional loudspeakers with crossovers

Smallest Footprint Horn and Driver that can reach 500hz
Smallest Footprint Horn and Driver that can reach 500hz
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Old 23rd September 2018, 07:24 PM   #181
EarlK is offline EarlK  Canada
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ro808 View Post
@EarlK, which DDS horn is in front of the 802D?
Hi,

It's this DDS CFD1-100 pdf

I'm listening to it , oriented in the vertical ( like Bear used to recommend ).

This is not a constant coverage horn ( by my definition ) / though it still sounds nice.

It's very shallow at 5" ( like many wave-guides this size ) / so it does have that going for it.
- Still, it's not a hip horn to own or talk about .



PS; FYI, I believe DDS is pretty dormant these days.
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Old 23rd September 2018, 07:45 PM   #182
EarlK is offline EarlK  Canada
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Originally Posted by Pano View Post
Thanks for that Earl. I also tried the splash tweeters and found them to be OK. I usually ended up playing them straight ahead, tho, out of guilt or embarrassment something.

I suspect that different people hear things differently. I don't get much, if any, spacial benefit from tweeters, more of a tonality benefit. Like warmth on strings.
These Fostex are bullet type tweeters so I feel it's necessary to point them away from me ( no matter what! ).

I do agree that the tweeter "splash" detracts some from the "front-to-back" imaging ( if that is what you implied ).
- Keeping that in mind I'll be working to reduce the tweeters measurable effects ( from say 5K to 10K ).

Here's an REW wavelet showing the relative strength of this tweeter ( relating to the Altec 802 ) and it's shortish time signature/echo ( it's only 18" from the back wall ) .

Click the image to open in full size.

One thing I'll say is that this is the first time one of these Fostex has remained hooked up longer than 15 minutes ( now, going on about 7 days > so that's a record ).

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Old 23rd September 2018, 07:55 PM   #183
Ro808 is offline Ro808  Netherlands
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EarlK View Post
Hi,

It's this DDS CFD1-100 pdf

I'm listening to it , oriented in the vertical ( like Bear used to recommend ).

This is not a constant coverage horn ( by my definition ) / though it still sounds nice.

It's very shallow at 5" ( like many wave-guides this size ) / so it does have that going for it.
- Still, it's not a hip horn to own or talk about .



PS; FYI, I believe DDS is pretty dormant these days.

Just for fun: try the Celestion with this horn, if you haven't done this before.
It won't play as low as the Altec, but the results may surprise you.


On the other hand, it would be interesting to see the Altec behind this (very cheap) Celestion horn:

Click the image to open in full size.

Click the image to open in full size.

Last edited by Ro808; 23rd September 2018 at 08:21 PM.
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Old 23rd September 2018, 07:58 PM   #184
Ro808 is offline Ro808  Netherlands
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Originally Posted by Ro808 View Post
My experience with oldskool drivers is limited, but experiments by other diy-ers have shown these often don't go well with waveguides.
For this reason it's quite surprising the Faital Pro's appear to be an exception, as they have a conical adaptation horn. I suspect the phase-plug design is a key factor here.
Addition:
The shape (length and flare-rate) of the conical exit part also plays a role.
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Old 23rd September 2018, 08:29 PM   #185
EarlK is offline EarlK  Canada
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ro808 View Post
Just for fun: try the Celestion with this horn, if you haven't done this before.
It won't play as low as the Altec, but the results may surprise you.
I guess you want a pic ( right? )

Here it is;

Smallest Footprint Horn and Driver that can reach 500hz-celestion-cdx1-1747-dds-cfd1-100-vertical-orientation-png

This is a Celestion CDX1-1747 which very closely traces the CDX1-1745.

These 2 models are just about interchangeable ( from a trace perspective ).

See ( the raw, unEQed curves on the PRV, 152i clone waveguide );

Click the image to open in full size.

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Old 23rd September 2018, 08:33 PM   #186
Pano is online now Pano  United States
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Smallest Footprint Horn and Driver that can reach 500hz
Thanks for the graph Earl. Very clear.
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Old 23rd September 2018, 08:46 PM   #187
EarlK is offline EarlK  Canada
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Click the image to open in full size.

Worldwide, everyone seems to make that horn.

I bought it under the Sammi ( Korean ) banner 20 years back.

It offers nice ( on axis ) flat response with good lower end loading.

Altec compression drivers ( IME, being ancient designs ) respond best to horns with exponential curves ( like this horn ).

This is a horn ( perhaps ) best listened to in the vertical orientation ( a la Bear ) > I wouldn't use it in the horizontal orientation.

Here's an ancient trace;

Click the image to open in full size.

This was done with an non-calibrated test mic / so the HF above @ 9K is about 3db too hot.




Last edited by EarlK; 23rd September 2018 at 09:01 PM.
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Old 23rd September 2018, 09:41 PM   #188
Ro808 is offline Ro808  Netherlands
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Originally Posted by EarlK View Post

It offers nice ( on axis ) flat response with good lower end loading.

Altec compression drivers ( IME, being ancient designs ) respond best to horns with exponential curves ( like this horn ).
This confirms my expectations

Thank you for the plots!


The DDS is certainly not bad, the slightly rough top octave is probably caused by anomalies at the throat.

The original QSC 152i waveguide was designed to work with Celestion drivers. Your measurements confirm it.
The main difference between the Celestion CDX1-1747 and the CDX1-1745 is in the suspension/damping of the diaphragm.

Last edited by Ro808; 23rd September 2018 at 09:58 PM.
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Old 23rd September 2018, 10:26 PM   #189
Cask05 is offline Cask05  United States
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hornwannabe View Post
Hey Guys got some bad news.

I got scammed by the ones selling the Klipsch K510 horns...Getting a bit disheartened with this project but iíll pursue it when funds become available again.

Have you recovered yet? Did you ever see anything on your K-510s?



Chris
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Old 23rd September 2018, 11:26 PM   #190
Pano is online now Pano  United States
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Smallest Footprint Horn and Driver that can reach 500hz
I think I have a pair of horns like that, bought on close-out from Parts Express. I was going to use them the Peerless compression drivers, but never got around to it. Still sitting on a shelf somewhere. Nice to see measurements with other drivers.
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