Because they're trapped in the box by the throat's high impedance and can't reflect back through the diaphragm since it's sealed off in back.
GM
best fullrange driver for talkbox
I don't know if it is the right place to post this cuz I'm new here, wellcome all enthusiastic and collaborative members of this comunity...
I wanted to know if it's better to search for an appropiate fullrange driver for my talkbox project (AKA vocoder) (I'm currently using a dismantled siren driver to attach the hose) , or find here the best design to print my own personalized optimus performance - weight - size - price - diaphragm and or driver which seems to be the fun and best option which came into my mind when I saw such a lot of info and such talented knowledge members here. So I thank a lot in advance any advice ideas etc. you can throw this way, you can reach me at my mail pauloandes in gmail, facebook/concienciauniversal, whatsapp +573006230050. Again thanks a million for yor time and collab.
PD: Uploaded an image I found on internet which is the way it is supossed to be connected if the driver is one of those PA horns which has a high range and need the bass or low sounds to be attenuated by a circuit.
I don't know if it is the right place to post this cuz I'm new here, wellcome all enthusiastic and collaborative members of this comunity...
I wanted to know if it's better to search for an appropiate fullrange driver for my talkbox project (AKA vocoder) (I'm currently using a dismantled siren driver to attach the hose) , or find here the best design to print my own personalized optimus performance - weight - size - price - diaphragm and or driver which seems to be the fun and best option which came into my mind when I saw such a lot of info and such talented knowledge members here. So I thank a lot in advance any advice ideas etc. you can throw this way, you can reach me at my mail pauloandes in gmail, facebook/concienciauniversal, whatsapp +573006230050. Again thanks a million for yor time and collab.
PD: Uploaded an image I found on internet which is the way it is supossed to be connected if the driver is one of those PA horns which has a high range and need the bass or low sounds to be attenuated by a circuit.
Attachments
1) The Instruments and Amps Forum (Everything that makes music, Especially including instrument amps) would be a more appropriate place to post your question, but since your here:
2) A phenolic diaphragm thread on PA or siren driver is still the best choice for a "talk box". Depending on the source material, volume desired, and low frequency capability of the driver, a highpass filter and attenuation may be required. That said, a 10 watt amp can rattle your fillings out without causing any harm to a 30 watt siren driver directly connected.
Attempting to create a better driver for the purpose would cost far more than what commercially has already proven to work great since 1969.
Talk boxes put the loudspeaker's output into a person's mouth through a tube, where it is modulated by the entire vocal tract, then picked up by a microphone for recording or live sound. A vocorder is a completely different device, using a synthesizer that produces sounds from an analysis of speech input, processing both the carrier and the modulator signal integrally, producing the output as a separate electric signal.
Art
change driver or amp?
I am so glad... amazed, to see such a fast response. Thanks a lot for your advaice about the correct place for my post,and the correction about talkbox and vocoder, next time I'll google it a lil more, and thanks a lot for also give advice about the driver I am using, so I will throw a last cuestion: I was using an old FirstAct M2A-04 which uses a 110v/14V AC/dc with this specs:
Power (Watts/Ohms): 4 / 4
Speaker Configuration: (1) 6.5"
And the driver is a 20w siren, which I took the alarm sounds board module apart.
I am bypassing the amps Loudspeaker by disconecting its red wire and conecting a "crocodile" (that's the local name for that metal gripping piece attached or soldered to a cable) to the center pole of a 3 pole switch (see image), and one of the outer poles to reach one of the driver's poles. And keeping the black wire of de loudspeaker in its place, i put another croc grip to reach the other pole of de siren's driver.
Do you suggest I use a 15Watt amp or a lower wattage siren driver??
I am so glad... amazed, to see such a fast response. Thanks a lot for your advaice about the correct place for my post,and the correction about talkbox and vocoder, next time I'll google it a lil more, and thanks a lot for also give advice about the driver I am using, so I will throw a last cuestion: I was using an old FirstAct M2A-04 which uses a 110v/14V AC/dc with this specs:
Power (Watts/Ohms): 4 / 4
Speaker Configuration: (1) 6.5"
And the driver is a 20w siren, which I took the alarm sounds board module apart.
I am bypassing the amps Loudspeaker by disconecting its red wire and conecting a "crocodile" (that's the local name for that metal gripping piece attached or soldered to a cable) to the center pole of a 3 pole switch (see image), and one of the outer poles to reach one of the driver's poles. And keeping the black wire of de loudspeaker in its place, i put another croc grip to reach the other pole of de siren's driver.
Do you suggest I use a 15Watt amp or a lower wattage siren driver??
Neither.
You are connecting your siren driver to what amounts to a plane wave tube, one end of which will be inserted somewhere in your mouth or throat.
Even at the low E note of a guitar (81Hz) most screw on siren drivers are capable of over 120dB into a plane wave tube with just 1 watt, mid band (1kHz-4kHz) it may exceed 140 dB in your mouth, which may be well above your pain threshold, and can cause hearing damage in short order if you stick the tube near your ear.
Your FirstAct M2A-04 may do around 90dB SPL (sound pressure level) at one meter.
A 10 dB increase in level sounds twice as loud. Each doubling of distance imparts a 6dB loss in level, but not in a tube- what goes in comes out nearly the same level.
You don't mention the siren driver impedance, it could be from 2-16 ohms.
Your 4 watt/4 ohm amp probably delivers 2 watts into 8 ohms, or 1 watt into 16 ohms, still likely more than enough to be as loud as you would ever sing.
I attenuate the output of my Valve Junior practice amp to under a watt when using my current (70 year old) Jensen Hypex talk box driver.
Tape your tube to the driver, clip lead the driver to amp output, play around like Peter Frampton, Joe Walsh, or Roger Troutman, funky keyboard players groove on talk boxes too.
Art
How about using a hard surface drive a comp’s phase plug instead of adjusting
- a phase plug to make up for soft diaphragm modes
- tricking around with adding mass to soft dome centres in order to compensate for wave travel time from coil contact to other areas of membrane?
Both of the above are prone to loose „tuning“ once the soft diaphraghm changes strength due to ageing in stressed or even all parts of surface.
Ralph
- a phase plug to make up for soft diaphragm modes
- tricking around with adding mass to soft dome centres in order to compensate for wave travel time from coil contact to other areas of membrane?
Both of the above are prone to loose „tuning“ once the soft diaphraghm changes strength due to ageing in stressed or even all parts of surface.
Ralph
Patrick (John?) do you remember how destructive a process it was to remove the phase plugs and throat from the B&C DE5's? Is it just a matter of removing screws or do pieces need to be cut or adhesive removed? Also, are the phase plugs part of the magnetic circuit of these compression drivers or are they just an acoustic extension here? If just acoustic, I'm hoping that resin 3d printed replacements might be a possibility. I see from some of your posts after this thread you've soured on the idea of designing your own phase plugs but I've got some ideas.....
Dan
I have a set of DE7s and the phase plug is made from FG loaded nylon, at least that's what it appears to be. The other verification was that it wouldn't hold any cyano adhesive.
I actually took apart a celestion 1430 CD and found they use no dampening in the pole piece, so I added some melamine sponge discs, which cleaned up the primary resonance a little. This driver uses FF so I had to make sure it wouldn't wick and soak into the sponge material.
The DE7 sounds nice in a small WG made from 3 layers of BB stacked and routed with a conical 60 degree bit and rounded at the mouth. It plays to past 17k.
I actually took apart a celestion 1430 CD and found they use no dampening in the pole piece, so I added some melamine sponge discs, which cleaned up the primary resonance a little. This driver uses FF so I had to make sure it wouldn't wick and soak into the sponge material.
The DE7 sounds nice in a small WG made from 3 layers of BB stacked and routed with a conical 60 degree bit and rounded at the mouth. It plays to past 17k.