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Multi-Way Conventional loudspeakers with crossovers

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Old 4th January 2017, 07:20 AM   #11
Matyam is offline Matyam  United Kingdom
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Thanks for the advice appreciated, first up from what I could find the crossover from the cvs woofer is at 500hz with 102db 400watt sensitivity and the midrange at 3000 hz 94db 60 watt. Now what I like about the cvs is there low 20s hz extension presumably because of the 18X18X36" box with two 4" ports which is tamed with a yamaha digital equalizer .I found the audax pr170 which is 100 watt 100db sensitivity ,now as any mod I do will be compared with the other original speaker what difference could I expect like for like ? and also what improvement per se could I expect from say the eminence woofer,is the cv driver really that crap sorry if I sound like a simpleton .I could buy a econowave kit I know but unless I can keep the low 20 s hz extension it's a step back and I have a empty box which can be modified to whatever.
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Old 4th January 2017, 10:11 AM   #12
EarlK is offline EarlK  Canada
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Since you like your current woofer, the obvious route is to continue to use it.

Assemble one of the smaller Econowave designs ( like the Delite10 ) and then use your CV only as a sub-woofer.

If you aren't quite up to DIYing ( for HT ) at this time ( that's alright ) go buy something ( from the pro-sound world ) that has a suitably sized ( 8 or 10") woofer with an @ 95db sensitivity.

The plastic boxed Mackie C200 does a very credible job ( in the home HT category ) for easy money.

If you don't like them ( or eventually think you can build better ) they'll actually have some resale value.

Click the image to open in full size.Improve Cerwin Vega E715-mackie_celestion_driver-jpeg

That's clearly a Celestion compression driver ( very good quality ).

Read this thread at AVS for a good overview on this speaker.

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Old 4th January 2017, 04:48 PM   #13
Matyam is offline Matyam  United Kingdom
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It's not so much that I like this woofer but it does the job especially when equed,mine do not sound like boom boxes at all.On the sub woofer front I already have a b&w asw 750 to reach lower down so I'd prefer to make what I have better by whatever means so I can directly compare with the old speaker.Going back to the mid range audax driver being 6 db more sensitive then existing driver what will that mean realistically ?
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Old 4th January 2017, 05:29 PM   #14
EarlK is offline EarlK  Canada
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Matyam View Post
It's not so much that I like this woofer but it does the job especially when equed,mine do not sound like boom boxes at all.On the sub woofer front I already have a b&w asw 750 to reach lower down so I'd prefer to make what I have better by whatever means so I can directly compare with the old speaker.Going back to the mid range audax driver being 6 db more sensitive then existing driver what will that mean realistically ?
The PR170 only has a useful ( averaged ) sensitivity of @ 95-96db. ( measured from 400hz to 3000hz ).

See the pic;

Click the image to open in full size.

You're (re)quoting from ( Audaxs own lit ) of that 100db figure is a typical mistake.

FWIW, you'll never find a studio monitor that states its system sensitivity as more than 95db ( if they use one of these mids ).

FYI, even if it actually was 100db / that's what variable Lpads are meant to accomodate ( component balancing ).


Last edited by EarlK; 4th January 2017 at 05:40 PM.
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Old 4th January 2017, 06:57 PM   #15
EarlK is offline EarlK  Canada
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Before going any further you should document the existing crossover .

Take pictures of it in place ( if possible ), make notes of which wires connect to what, then completely remove one and draw out it's schematic .

Take pictures and measurements of the existing mids and tweeters ( show front & backs so that people can get an idea of their Q-factor.

Measurements of the existing midrange dog-house are necessary.

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Old 12th January 2019, 05:41 PM   #16
Matyam is offline Matyam  United Kingdom
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Finally got around to pulling them apart,bought some audax pro 170 mid range and ordered some audax TWO25A26 tweeters,can someone recommend where they need to crossover and a made up crossover or has anyone got a schematic for certain vega crossover CXS -GN2050 ,also can anyone suggest a alternative 15" woofer for these 6.75 cufoot boxes thanks in anticipation.
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Old 13th January 2019, 12:02 AM   #17
EarlK is offline EarlK  Canada
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IMHO, you need to hook up with a local pro who can provide realist advice for your refurbishment.

From what I can gather there is no mid-range sub-enclosure in your e175's .

If true, that right there would help explain lack of clarity you first mentioned 2 years back ( ie; the mid is being modulated by the internal sound-waves/pressure produced by the woofer ).

You now have some real nice drivers coming (with those Audax ).

Don't squander the opportunity to make something nice sounding by trying to do this without professional help.

You'll need a custom network designed for the drivers you have on hand.

This pic is returned by a Google search for your woofer type ( & I assume its yours ).
It seems to show no midrange sub-enclosure ( which needs to be rectified ).

Click the image to open in full size.

If you intend to use the existing enclosure you will need to find a way to retrofit a separate sub-enclosure into that cabinet.


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Old 13th January 2019, 05:18 AM   #18
Moondog55 is offline Moondog55  Australia
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If that is the CV speaker I think it is then I see no problem in keeping the woofer and using a plastic can as the mid range speaker enclosure in the short term.
But I did think that these speakers were better with the port stuffed tightly with foam. If these were a mates speakers that is, so many cheap CV boxes out there with good loud R&R bass and iffy midrange and top.
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Old 13th January 2019, 07:26 AM   #19
Matyam is offline Matyam  United Kingdom
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Thanks for the replies guys,first off the mid range did have a small plastic enclosure with stuffing and as the audaxs are bigger i have ordered some 6" cardboard tube from your previous advice,i can't recall where but I read they need a .2 cubic foot enclosure which suggests a 14" tube would this sound about right ? The lack of clarity as well is my bloody tinnitus so any improvement would be great.These speakers do indeed sound better with ports foamed which limit output to above 40Hz and when removed for ht.Previously with the drivers i made up a baffle with a view to copy jamo 909 the sound was more open but because of my room limitations ie small UK room there close to wall,I've read they would not work welcome to wall.Anyway i digress these speakers will be hopefully a learning curve to making some proper ones but this is the first step, with a view to the crossover have you any idiots guide as there is soo much glue on these crossovers i fear i will break them trying to disassemble them and would i be right the crossover would benefit from being higher with these pro 170s.Also on these E715s they have 2 way switching on mid range and tweeter circuits ,should i just bypass them ?.
Anyways any advice greatly appreciated to make these convinced sound like focal utopias .
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Old 13th January 2019, 11:57 AM   #20
EarlK is offline EarlK  Canada
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Matyam,

Thanks for the assurance that there's a separate enclosure for the mid-range.

Typical mid-enclosures are .2 to .3 cu ft ( IME with JBL stuff ).

Your Audax components are going to require a new/custom crossover.

I guarantee that the existing one is not applicable.

I think your best approach is to hire someone local ( maybe Falcon ) to design a custom network for your drivers.

Cross-over points ? @ 350hz ( for woofer to midrange ) + @ 3Khz ( midrange to tweeter )



Last edited by EarlK; 13th January 2019 at 12:02 PM.
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