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Multi-Way Conventional loudspeakers with crossovers

yamaha ns10
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Old 11th May 2016, 06:56 AM   #21
Lojzek is offline Lojzek  Croatia
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The measurements of Yamaha NS10M from Toole's "Sound Reproduction"
reveal that this speaker was designed particularly to have a flat POWER
response, which is very wrong when one puts it in open space, but there is a
rumor on the internet that the guiding idea of making such a speaker was to
counteract the fact (?) that the average loudspeaker set in a home environment
had its bass and HF region lifted up well above the midrange (loudness), so to
put things back in order, they figured the midrange should be pronounced enough
so it sounds normal again.
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Old 11th May 2016, 07:45 AM   #22
sq225917 is offline sq225917  United Kingdom
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Colin at chevron audio in the UK runs an active pair with new ring radiator tweeters, they sounded very even and well balanced with a lovely revealing midrange. Might be worth dropping him a line for some info.
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Old 11th May 2016, 08:19 AM   #23
rabbitz is offline rabbitz  Australia
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My advice would be to sell the NS10M as they are sort after for studio use. Would be a shame to take another pair out of circulation as they are now rare.

You get better bang for buck building a new speaker from an established design or design your own if you are capable.

I sold a pair of NS10M's in 2003 and fetched a price 3x what I paid in 1978. This allowed me to design and build 2 speakers, a floorstander loudspeaker and a bookshelf loudspeaker which was more suitable for home use.
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Old 11th May 2016, 12:17 PM   #24
Salas is online now Salas  Greece
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yamaha ns10
The NS10 was originally designed as a consumer bookshelf model so its alignment was allowing for being put almost flush in a bookcase. No step comp or very mild. Being closed box it also had little group delay in the bass. It had a turned paper cone with a glue shim that made it good on resonances. It was sensitive for its size too. Just because fast, one could nail the bass drum and bass guitar mix easier and also because mid forward and clean, one could hear all sorts of things sticking out badly or be aware of those missing in the mids where many instruments and the vocals compete. Not a balanced loudspeaker but one that could make you work more for a mix to sound good. If it sounded good on it it was most usually translating well on anything else. That is why they used it everywhere for decades.
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Old 11th May 2016, 01:28 PM   #25
Salas is online now Salas  Greece
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yamaha ns10
Quote:
Originally Posted by xrk971 View Post
Now we can get rid of the Kleenex.
The naked NS10M was toned down a bit by Yamaha anyway as the original consumer NS10 was meant to be listened with grilles on hence the Kleenex trick because the mix artists removed the grilles for it to look pro-cool with its unusual white cone when perched on the mixer bridge
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Old 11th May 2016, 04:58 PM   #26
sreten is offline sreten  United Kingdom
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Quote:
Originally Posted by xrk971 View Post
Thanks for doing that System7. How do you happen to have the FRD files for
these drivers already? Looks like all it needed was some padding for level
balance between bass and tweet. Now we can get rid of the Kleenex.
Hi,

No. He's still posting sims based on the wrong drivers.
Seems to think its OK to be not too far off. It is not.

rgds, sreten.

Last edited by sreten; 11th May 2016 at 05:01 PM.
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Old 11th May 2016, 05:11 PM   #27
sreten is offline sreten  United Kingdom
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 2stuffed View Post
Thanks for your thoughts, I'm going to make the larger box like
the NS10T ,I have the XO to try. I have plenty of plywood .....
Hi,

Just sell them for a silly expensive price and start
again. That is by far your best option. They are
crap for real hifi TBH and nothing you can do will
make them much better, just ruin their value.

rgds, sreten.

FWIW the myth surrounding the NS10's is they replicated
the faults of many cheap speakers, and any mix that sounded
decent on them would sound good on myriad cheap equipment.

Nothing is ever so simple, but the fact is, the NS10's are legends.
It could so easily have been the AR18S, marketed correctly.

Last edited by sreten; 11th May 2016 at 05:33 PM.
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Old 11th May 2016, 06:01 PM   #28
Charles Darwin is offline Charles Darwin  United Kingdom
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The reason NS10s became popular is because Bob Clearmountain (one of the first star mix engineers) used them, appear in many photos of him and are visually unmistakable.

Later people invented reasons that sound a bit more grown up than 'Bob uses them'.
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Old 11th May 2016, 06:07 PM   #29
Salas is online now Salas  Greece
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yamaha ns10
But there was a reason why he used them. He somehow understood they translated his mixing to consumer situations easier or he spotted them somewhere in Japan doing that to some unknown studio artist's original observation.
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Old 11th May 2016, 08:01 PM   #30
Tubelab_com is online now Tubelab_com  United States
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There are at least 3 iterations of the "NS-10" that I have heard, probably 5 or 6 made. As stated the first generation was intended for the consumer market. The NS-10M was the first version intended for studio use, and the NS-10M STUDIO was a later version with a "refined" or "new" tweeter depending on what you read. I got my NS-10M STUDIO's in the late 90's at Sam Ash Music, because they were scheduled for extinction as Yamaha, and many others were moving toward active monitors.

I went into Sam Ash with several CD's of percussive music that I had recorded myself and tried every monitor in their recording room, and the rooms at ACE Music, Guitar Center and Mars Music. The Yamahas flat nailed percussive drums, which none of the others did. They are still sitting on either side of my studio desk. Want better bass? Get a SUB, cross it at about 100Hz. I feed the sub from the same line outs from my audio interface that feeds my amps.

Part of the reason for the great "fast" percussion is the sealed box, which the woofer was designed for. Yes, that kills the response below 80Hz. Any attempt to put that woofer in a ported box will sound terrible.....How do I know this? Yamaha tried it, and it sucked, big time. It was aimed at the home theater market, but was the worst of both worlds. Loose flabby bass....ugly. There was a NS-10 PRO, but I never saw one.

Don't like the NS-10's, as already stated they are still a classic, and in demand....sell them.
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