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Multi-Way Conventional loudspeakers with crossovers

rePhase, a loudspeaker phase linearization, EQ and FIR filtering tool
rePhase, a loudspeaker phase linearization, EQ and FIR filtering tool
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Old 26th July 2019, 04:27 PM   #2731
Oabeieo is offline Oabeieo  United States
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Pic of “can” in question . 8”2118 and a horn

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Old 28th July 2019, 08:52 PM   #2732
camplo is offline camplo
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Is there a freeware prog that will do, auto linearization of phase reults? Something where we could transfer the results into RePhase. That would be most pleasant.

ps - ooommmggg pppllllllleeaaase add auto linerization of magnitude and phase lmao!!!

Last edited by camplo; 28th July 2019 at 08:54 PM.
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Old 28th July 2019, 10:50 PM   #2733
mark100 is offline mark100  United States
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Quote:
Originally Posted by camplo View Post
Is there a freeware prog that will do, auto linearization of phase reults? Something where we could transfer the results into RePhase. That would be most pleasant.

ps - ooommmggg pppllllllleeaaase add auto linerization of magnitude and phase lmao!!!

Uhmm, I think auto linearization of phase, if alone, would be really bad,
as in REALLY bad

Auto magnitude, more OK.
Just in case you don't know, rePhase will import REW's auto EQs.

IMHO, the beauty of rePhase, apart from being donate-ware, is that it IS manual...makes us learn what we are doing and be responsible for our corrections ......before maybe moving on to more auto type adjustments.
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Old 29th July 2019, 12:25 AM   #2734
Oabeieo is offline Oabeieo  United States
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Dirac , (which is “auto”) mainly If auto is what you want maybe.

I prefer rephase is I had to pick one over the other

I’ve have excellent results with Dirac and rephase together , using rephase to do my crossovers and any horn related issues , and Dirac to do my left and right matching
And than a fine tune with rephase.

Soon I’m getting off the Dirac and going strictly rephase.

I’m waiting for parts from mini to do a pair of opendrc 2x2 s into a pair of 2x4hds.


I used a Dirac as a aid to teach me what fir can sound like
But actually once I started just making trial and error measurements and filters in rephase I could learn what is happening enough to limp around.

I get stumped sometimes , it’s learning progressions , I just this week had a really big advancement in my learning. I was doing something wrong for a while , now that I got it under control I had to re do every fir but it’s excellent now.



On another note

I added a 2” speaker in my kick pod, playing it in reverse and sealed the basket with 100 layers of electrical tape and a 25w 47ohm resistor on the 2” to lower the power quite a bit

Put the mic in the pod took some measurements of the 8 and the 2

Got the 2” to cancel the ringing and horn loading fairly good now. I just tryed matching the difference of the 8 in and out of the pod. And reversed it in polarity , all done in rephase! Worked so good. I can’t believe. Had to make a few filters till I felt it was nailed down

The 8 measurements are soooooo much better now.

The 8 is a tiny bit quieter but it should be , the ringing is gone. Lot better

Better depth , it’s working. Now to prefect this.
This is a very good idea. I am so surprised how well it works
That hollow sound is gone the echoing at 800 is reduced so much.


Extremely pleased. Thank you guys for the help



You can see the 2” at the bottom inside the kick pod

Click the image to open in full size.

Last edited by Oabeieo; 29th July 2019 at 12:29 AM.
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Old 4th August 2019, 05:21 PM   #2735
nc535 is online now nc535
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Import of settings from REW auto eq is only a partial workaround for lack of the feature in rephase for several reasons. REW refuses to fill any dip below the target line then complains when you set the target low enough that it doesn't need to. REW lacks flexibility in target generation - its only aimed at room eq, not XO generation. Rew limits resources applied to the eq and seems aimed at IIR filters rather than FIR.

That target line is REWs major benefit re' filters. But if I'm going to have to go into rephase and manually correct for REW's short comings as well as to linearize the phase, then why not do it all in rephase to begin with?

Thus my feature request: can you give us the ability to import a target response (in addition to the existing ability to import a measurement) that acts as a visual aid during manual equalization?
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Old 4th August 2019, 06:50 PM   #2736
JohnPM is offline JohnPM  United Kingdom
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nc535 View Post
REW refuses to fill any dip below the target line
Filling of dips depends on your settings for individual and overall filter boost. Generally a bad idea nonetheless.
Quote:
then complains when you set the target low enough that it doesn't need to
REW warns you if much of the response is above the target. Not sure how that constitutes a complaint.
Quote:
REW lacks flexibility in target generation - its only aimed at room eq, not XO generation.
REW has a speaker driver target setting that allows selection of Bessel, Butterworth or Linkwitz-Riley lowpass and high pass filters up to 8th order. It also allows a "house curve" to be added to any of the targets that can be any shape you like and is defined by a simple text file.
Quote:
seems aimed at IIR filters rather than FIR
Yes it is.
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Old 4th August 2019, 09:13 PM   #2737
nc535 is online now nc535
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Even if none of my criticims of rew (one of my favorite tools) were unwarranted, I would still want a target line in rephase. But thanks for pointing out those target options (new?) that I had missed.
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Old 4th August 2019, 09:38 PM   #2738
BYRTT is offline BYRTT  Denmark
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rePhase, a loudspeaker phase linearization, EQ and FIR filtering tool
Quote:
Originally Posted by nc535 View Post
...I would still want a target line in rephase..
In meantime there is below trick for stop bands, a "COMPENSATE" HP filter LR 4th order at 100Hz is set and a "COMPENSATE" LP filter BW 2nd order at 25kHz is set which should be close to target for your new line arrays, now it should work import a measurement and EQ everything flat as a pancake, when that EQ work is done disable the two compensate filters and what stands back is the target curve.

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Old 4th August 2019, 10:39 PM   #2739
nc535 is online now nc535
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clever, perhaps too much so I'd almost rather draw my target by hand on an overlay for the screen.

Just posted latest results done the hard way in my line array thread
Full range line array for wall or corner placement

manual eq to get in the ballpark and implement crossover to subs in MiniDSP
rew-rephase auto-eq to refine and apply house curve and balance channels
rephase phase flattening

several times around that loop to get it as close to right as it is

I'm not sure there is an easy way; probably be a lot easier for me next time though.
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Old 10th August 2019, 01:36 PM   #2740
torgeirs is offline torgeirs  Norway
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Oabeieo View Post
On another note

I added a 2 speaker in my kick pod, playing it in reverse and sealed the basket with 100 layers of electrical tape and a 25w 47ohm resistor on the 2 to lower the power quite a bit

Put the mic in the pod took some measurements of the 8 and the 2

Got the 2 to cancel the ringing and horn loading fairly good now. I just tryed matching the difference of the 8 in and out of the pod. And reversed it in polarity , all done in rephase! Worked so good. I cant believe. Had to make a few filters till I felt it was nailed down

The 8 measurements are soooooo much better now.

The 8 is a tiny bit quieter but it should be , the ringing is gone. Lot better

Better depth , its working. Now to prefect this.
This is a very good idea. I am so surprised how well it works
That hollow sound is gone the echoing at 800 is reduced so much.


Extremely pleased. Thank you guys for the help



You can see the 2 at the bottom inside the kick pod

Click the image to open in full size.
This is very interesting:-)
Can you draw a picture of this setup with responces and corrections?
signal - rew - amp - 2"
- rew - amp - 8"

As I understand it the 2" is cancelling the reflections at about 800Hz?

Maybe in an own thread. I know it is a lot of work, but the solution is fantastic!
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