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Old 21st September 2003, 06:04 PM   #101
Rudolf is offline Rudolf  Germany
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Quote:
Vibrating of the baffle isn't always a bad thing. If you can keep it under control it can also help the performance of the driver. Audio Note for instance uses this principle for years in their speakers and I can't say that they are bad sounding. Also mr. Salabert, the founder of Phy-HP has experimented a lot with controlled resonances of enclosures for his speakers.
Regarding the value of resonating baffles I would like to go back in time - to my first OB test. The driver (Fostex FF85K) was mounted on a single baffle (1m x 1,20m particle board) and especially solo cello music was sounding magnificent - because the whole baffle was resonating beautifully with the instrument. There was more "body" than the little Fostex could have produced by itself. Large orchestral music on the contrary sounded mushy, because the big resonating baffle area blurred the imaging of instruments.

Making the baffle resonance part of the musical reproduction certainly is an interesting option, but I for myself have decided to go for less resonant baffles and make the speaker the only soundproducing element.

Erik wrote:
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PHY-HP publishes recommended plan for a large folding baffle. The plan specifies the use of (difficult to find and expensive) piano hinges. This is to seal the folds.
My actual baffle wings are with piano hinges. I´ve done a picture of it, showing the gaps in the hinge, that don´t seal much. I have even taped the hinge with duct tape, but couldn´t hear any difference.

In a previous attempt of isolating the wings I used hooks and eyes with a rubberprofile in between (see second picture). This was rather efficient in terms of isolating, but mechanically rather feeble.
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Old 21st September 2003, 06:11 PM   #102
Rudolf is offline Rudolf  Germany
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Default second picture

Mounting wings with hook and eye:
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Old 21st September 2003, 07:24 PM   #103
Variac is offline Variac  Costa Rica
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Are you (open) baffled yet?
My personal opinion is that I want a well-damped baffle, and one ridgid also. Just trying to stay open minded. The cello vs. orquestra example seems to make a lot of sense to me. A resonant baffle is going to sound better on some things than others. Now, if you could tune it to correspond to a dip in the driver response- maybe.

Frank , I may be wrong, too lazy to check, but I don't remember a damped mounting to the baffle mentioned, BUT what interested me was the idea of having the driver rigidly mounted on a stand but not touching the baffle, or rigidly mounted on a stand and having resiliant gasket at the baffle. So the driver is firmly mounted and it isn't linked to the baffle , thus producing less resonant coloration in the baffle.

Hey, remember when you and I defended Supravox as not being necessarily totally defective? Maybe we were on the right side in that one!
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Old 21st September 2003, 07:37 PM   #104
fdegrove is offline fdegrove  Europe
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Hi,

Hello Marc,

Quote:
BUT what interested me was the idea of having the driver rigidly mounted on a stand but not touching the baffle, or rigidly mounted on a stand and having resiliant gasket at the baffle. So the driver is firmly mounted and it isn't linked to the baffle , thus producing less resonant coloration in the baffle.
Now that could be a very good idea.
Well executed it would make the baffle much less prone to self-excitation.

Quote:
Frank , I may be wrong, too lazy to check, but I don't remember a damped mounting to the baffle mentioned,
I didn't say it was you mentioning it...don't think it was.
Probably someone else prior to your post.

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Hey, remember when you and I defended Supravox as not being necessarily totally defective? Maybe we were on the right side in that one!
Yeah...how could I ever forget...
With the Fertin being so expensive AND hard to come by I feel the Supravox is an excellent alternative.

Oh, BTW, the plan of the open baffle is on the PHY-HP site, not the Supravoxs' as I wrongly put it.

I hear feedback from people having listened to the PHY range that was rather underwelming.
Has anyone else experience with these speakers?

Cheers and greetings,
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Old 21st September 2003, 08:01 PM   #105
Steve Eddy is offline Steve Eddy  United States
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Quote:
Originally posted by Variac
Hey, remember when you and I defended Supravox as not being necessarily totally defective? Maybe we were on the right side in that one!
Which thread was that in? I've been eyeballing the Fertins, Supraxvoxes and PHYs for a while.

se
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Old 21st September 2003, 08:06 PM   #106
fdegrove is offline fdegrove  Europe
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Hi,

Quote:
Which thread was that in? I've been eyeballing the Fertins, Supraxvoxes and PHYs for a while.
I think it was this one,Steve:

FERTIN

Cheers,
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Old 21st September 2003, 08:06 PM   #107
Variac is offline Variac  Costa Rica
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Are you (open) baffled yet?
The thread was regarding a possible group Fertin buy.
The other drivers weren't discussed much. Search on "fertin" and I'm sure you'll find it
Mark
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Old 21st September 2003, 08:33 PM   #108
Peter Daniel is offline Peter Daniel  Canada
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If you do search on Fertin and Dice45 you'll find even more info.
http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/searc...der=descending
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Old 21st September 2003, 08:33 PM   #109
Steve Eddy is offline Steve Eddy  United States
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Quote:
Originally posted by fdegrove
I think it was this one,Steve:

FERTIN
That's it. Thanks, Frank.

I kind of had a feeling it'd be in that big thread with the 199 posts. So I thought I'd ask first before plowing through it at 28.8.

se
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Old 21st September 2003, 08:51 PM   #110
Sjef is offline Sjef  Netherlands
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Quote:
Originally posted by fdegrove
I hear feedback from people having listened to the PHY range that was rather underwelming.
Has anyone else experience with these speakers?
I can understand the underwelming reactions to the Phy's. I really don't understand that people can listen to them without a tweeter. They stop radically at 9 kHz, output at 20kHz is allready about 35 db down. Also the Phy isn't very fast in the higher frequency and has got some nasty colouration up there. That's why I use them only till 5 or 6 kHz. Yes filtered fullrange, I know that's against the single driver relegion, but I don't care as long as it sounds good to me.

I've tried a lot of different tweeters and ended up with a Cabasse DOM20 dome tweeter. There where better tweeters but they didn't integrate as well as the Cabasse does.

Also the Phy can sound really bad with transistor amps, you really should use a good SET amp with them otherwise it's gonna be disapointing.

No speaker is perfect but the Phy has the lovely live and dynamic midrange I happen to like.

I would like to hear more from people who have tried "resonating" baffles. I'm still considering. The comment on the blur with big orchestral works was some of the things I didn't like about the Phy enclosures with 4mm walls.

I was hoping that the sitca spruce would have better acoustic properties so that the baffle wouldn't blur as much as a thin multiplex baffle.
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