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Multi-Way Conventional loudspeakers with crossovers

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Old 14th February 2009, 01:07 AM   #11
Moondog55 is offline Moondog55  Australia
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Yep!!
That link shows the IMF that was highly regarded at the time, and IMO worth cloning.
Or try and get another pair of B110s and do the top box as MTM.
But whichever way you go Bi-amping would be best and why not use a chip-amp??

Personal preference is for stereo woofers, the proposed XO of 200Hz is too high for Mono subs IMO
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Old 14th February 2009, 01:46 AM   #12
tsnell is offline tsnell  Australia
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They do look very cool. What are the tweeter and super tweeter being used? They don’t look like the T27.

Here are some others that look similar:
http://cgi.ebay.com.au/Kef-105-2-105...rkparms=66%3A2|65%3A1|39%3A1|240%3A1318

You are right, the chip amp will probably be perfect, I just meant it seemed weird mating such old and new gear together.

The MTM idea up top sounds interesting but I just had a quick look on eBay, these drivers do go for silly money don’t they, a pair of B110s that have been pulled out of another set of speakers and repaired are A$150+. http://cgi.ebay.com.au/Pr-Kef-B110-S...rkparms=66%3A2|65%3A1|39%3A1|240%3A1318

If I can find some cheap(ish) I would love to go down that route but otherwise I think I will just stick with the drivers I have.

I agree with the dual woofers vs combined sub, would like to keep them separate. So it looks like the way to go is:
• A TL for the B139 like Planet10 suggested (or like the 3rd link I put above)
• The B110 and T27 on top in a separate enclosure (passive XO, plus another B110 for MTM if I can find one)
• Bi-amped with the Amp 9B

Alright, looks like I am starting to get a plan together. Can anybody recommend some good (free) TL modelling software?
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Old 14th February 2009, 01:59 AM   #13
Moondog55 is offline Moondog55  Australia
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Not free software but you won't need it.
Dave ( Planet 10 ) has done most of the important work already.

B110s are good but not that good, however an equivalent modern driver is about the same cost ( Vifa P-13 for example $95- each )
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Old 14th February 2009, 04:36 AM   #14
planet10 is online now planet10  Canada
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Quote:
Originally posted by tsnell \
I also have a failed 41 Hz Amp 9 Basic attempt, from a recent Boominator project, that I could fix up for bi-amping these (It wouldn’t feel quite right using a chip amp with such retro speakers though). With the three drivers would bi-amping be the way to go, or would it be worth considering tri-amping?
I'm definitely in favour of triamping,,,

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Old 14th February 2009, 04:42 AM   #15
planet10 is online now planet10  Canada
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Quote:
Originally posted by Moondog55
Or try and get another pair of B110s and do the top box as MTM
Personally i'm not a big fan of an MTM unless you can keep the XO <400 hz.

Quote:
Personal preference is for stereo woofers, the proposed XO of 200Hz is too high for Mono subs IMO
Not mono, but a coffin-style stereo woofer like the Fried H.

Click the image to open in full size.

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Old 14th February 2009, 04:49 AM   #16
planet10 is online now planet10  Canada
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Quote:
Originally posted by tsnell
They do look very cool. What are the tweeter and super tweeter being used? They don’t look like the T27.
A Celestion HF1300 + HF2000. If you want to better that pairing or the T27, there are any number of modern tweeters that would do a better job. But part of the effort is to use what you have IMHO.

Quote:
Here are some others that look similar: Kef-105
Similar in concept... the B110s are similar, the tweeter is a T52 IIRC

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Old 14th February 2009, 04:53 AM   #17
planet10 is online now planet10  Canada
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Quote:
Originally posted by tsnell
Here are two other TLs I have found:
The 1st is the one is the one i posted above... you would rejig the 2nd to use the same line as in the triangulated one... bascally you start wth a closed end area, a terminus area, a legth and a driver position... that can then be bent up (or not) in many ways.

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Old 14th February 2009, 05:30 AM   #18
tsnell is offline tsnell  Australia
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Thanks Moondog and Planet 10
Planet10, I have a few quick questions (please excuse my lack of knowledge).
1. To keep the stereo imaging/sound with a coffin style box you would need the driver and TL mouth both at the left end for the left channel and the right end for the right channel, correct?
2. What are the benefits of the “triangulated” design? Is it the same as the “avoid the square box” concept, standing waves etc?
3. The design you posted has quite a large volume before the driver in the TL. What is gained by this? I ask because it would be difficult to achieve if keeping with point 1.
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Old 14th February 2009, 05:42 AM   #19
planet10 is online now planet10  Canada
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Quote:
Originally posted by tsnell
(please excuse my lack of knowledge).
You have to ask the questions to gain the knowledge.

Quote:
1. To keep the stereo imaging/sound with a coffin style box you would need the driver and TL mouth both at the left end for the left channel and the right end for the right channel, correct?
Yes

Click the image to open in full size.

http://t-linespeakers.org/classics/coffin/index.html

Quote:
2. What are the benefits of the “triangulated” design? Is it the same as the “avoid the square box” concept, standing waves etc?
Yes... but not really a concern if you XO low enuff... and getting adequate bracing on a TTL is a serious construction nightmare,

Quote:
3. The design you posted has quite a large volume before the driver in the TL. What is gained by this? I ask because it would be difficult to achieve if keeping with point 1.
It has to be looked at as the driver offset from the end of the line. Proper driver position (taper dependent) will kill the firwst undesirable harmonic, allowing the use of less dampig allowing for more bass reinforcement & less ripple.

dave
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Old 14th February 2009, 05:54 AM   #20
timbarnes is offline timbarnes  United States
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Default Have a look at Wireless World

I remember this KEF-based design...I believe it was originally published in Wireless World, and was a transmission line design with two diagonal partitions inside a rectangular box, resulting in a triangular transmission line that reduced as it progressed towards the port.

I built a variant using the KEF B200 and the T27. I don't have the speakers any more, unfortunately, but they were my first foray into speaker-building.

I built them from the second article shown above: "The Transmission-Line Loudspeaker Enclosure." The triangular internal structure is shown on the second page of the article, which can be found here:

http://www.hifiloudspeakers.info/Ana...ges/ww72b2.htm

tim
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