Hi Ho.
I’m about to splash out on the drivers for my first serious speaker build – a slim 90dB/1w floor standing 3.5-way WWMT tower.
My driver selection is as follows:
Tweeter (91dB)
http://www.soundlabsgroup.com.au/p/V-1080-MHT12/MHT+12+-+8+Ohm
Midrange (90dB)
http://www.soundlabsgroup.com.au/p/V-1176-G50FFL/G+50+FFL+-+8+Ohm
Bass (90dB)
http://www.soundlabsgroup.com.au/p/V-9035-W250S/W+250+S+-+8+Ohm
Bass reflex box for the woofers (rear port) and crossover frequencies of 800Hz and ~5kHz.
I intend to implement a full 6dB of baffle step compensation by rolling of the bottom woofer.
As far as I can tell this driver selection will work well in the intended configuration, but I though I’d float the combination here in case I’ve missed something important.
As for the cabinet I can build it in MDF, ply or solid pine. My current preference is for MDF because it is cheap and very easy to work with.
However if there is a convincing case to be made for either Plywood or pine I could be persuaded.
I’m also looking for an affordable measurement microphone / frequency compensated preamp. Any suggestions?
Cheers,
Glen
I’m about to splash out on the drivers for my first serious speaker build – a slim 90dB/1w floor standing 3.5-way WWMT tower.
My driver selection is as follows:
Tweeter (91dB)
http://www.soundlabsgroup.com.au/p/V-1080-MHT12/MHT+12+-+8+Ohm
Midrange (90dB)
http://www.soundlabsgroup.com.au/p/V-1176-G50FFL/G+50+FFL+-+8+Ohm
Bass (90dB)
http://www.soundlabsgroup.com.au/p/V-9035-W250S/W+250+S+-+8+Ohm
Bass reflex box for the woofers (rear port) and crossover frequencies of 800Hz and ~5kHz.
I intend to implement a full 6dB of baffle step compensation by rolling of the bottom woofer.
As far as I can tell this driver selection will work well in the intended configuration, but I though I’d float the combination here in case I’ve missed something important.
As for the cabinet I can build it in MDF, ply or solid pine. My current preference is for MDF because it is cheap and very easy to work with.
However if there is a convincing case to be made for either Plywood or pine I could be persuaded.
I’m also looking for an affordable measurement microphone / frequency compensated preamp. Any suggestions?
Cheers,
Glen
Hi Glen,
You know you are making a big mistake and you really should go with an established design...
Those look like nice drivers. Higher price doesn't always equate with better sound though.
I see you want to cross higher than you should on the woofer. It's published response looks pretty ragged up there.
The plan is for a 2.5 way?
For box material I'd stay well clear of solid pine or any solid wood for that matter. Unless you have the skill to construct it to accommodate seasonal expansion, it's just asking for trouble.
IMO there is WAY too much emphasis put on material differences. Superior construction techniques will always negate any real or supposed differences. MDF would be fine.
You know you are making a big mistake and you really should go with an established design...
Those look like nice drivers. Higher price doesn't always equate with better sound though.
I see you want to cross higher than you should on the woofer. It's published response looks pretty ragged up there.
The plan is for a 2.5 way?
For box material I'd stay well clear of solid pine or any solid wood for that matter. Unless you have the skill to construct it to accommodate seasonal expansion, it's just asking for trouble.
IMO there is WAY too much emphasis put on material differences. Superior construction techniques will always negate any real or supposed differences. MDF would be fine.
MJL21193 said:Hi Glen,
You know you are making a big mistake and you really should go with an established design...
Those look like nice drivers. Higher price doesn't always equate with better sound though.
I see you want to cross higher than you should on the woofer. It's published response looks pretty ragged up there.
The plan is for a 2.5 way?
For box material I'd stay well clear of solid pine or any solid wood for that matter. Unless you have the skill to construct it to accommodate seasonal expansion, it's just asking for trouble.
IMO there is WAY too much emphasis put on material differences. Superior construction techniques will always negate any real or supposed differences. MDF would be fine.
You're joking or did you not really read the post? It's a 3.5 way, both woofers will be rolling off at 800 Hz - should not be a problem. I did not take a close look so I won't comment further. He won't learn anything going with a proven design.
Pete B.
Hi Glen, just my 2 cents worth; it's a good driver but I tried a clone of it and just doesn't work with a woofer that big.
Soundlabs have some efficient 5 and 6 inch mid-bassfrom Visaton that IMO would work better.
That said I'm glad to see that you are going to do your own thing, it's the only way some of us learn anything
Soundlabs have some efficient 5 and 6 inch mid-bassfrom Visaton that IMO would work better.
That said I'm glad to see that you are going to do your own thing, it's the only way some of us learn anything
MJL21193 said:
I'm Andy G on every other forum.. Thought a bit of consistency was in order
not brother of Kenny, cannot play sax
I love s.x, too.
Earl is using PA drivers, and as far as I can see, is crossing to use the directivity of them.
The drivers he uses are more like a PA mid, and still do vocals quite well.. Normal HiFi bass drivers on the other hand ....
MJL21193 said:
Hmm.... to me, from the published graphs, the frequency response of the W250S-8 looks reasonably smooth out past 1kHz.
Visaton themselves make a speaker that uses a pair of the 10" W250S-8 woofers crossed at 600Hz:
http://www.visaton.com/en/bauvorschlaege/3_wege/fiesta25/index.html
I figured 800Hz isn't that much higher. The Visaton G50FFL dome midrange is best with a 800Hz crossover. I selected this midrange because it works well out past 5kHz and allows a simple 12db crossover to the ribbon tweeter.
I guess the design I've planned is not too disimilar in concept to Zaphs ZDT3.5 which uses 7" woofers crossed at 850Hz:
http://www.zaphaudio.com/ZDT3.5.html
I could compromise with the crossover to the midrange, but the lowest I could likely go is ~700Hz.
Cool on the MDF.
Microphone?
Cheers,
Glen
Glen perhaps you should take a second look at this one, although I have been told it needs a notch filter, it does 300 -> 3000 very well.
http://www.soundlabsgroup.com.au/p/V-1307-AL170A/AL+170+A+-+8+Ohm
As I said just my$00.02
http://www.soundlabsgroup.com.au/p/V-1307-AL170A/AL+170+A+-+8+Ohm
As I said just my$00.02
Moondog55 said:
Hey, I'm open to suggestions on a better woofer :0
With that dome midrange and ribbon tweeter combo I'm pretty much stuck with a bass-mid XO of 800Hz.
My Sonus Faber inspired Stradivari-like speaker build will use a sealed bass, an al-cone midrange and a 1" dome tweeter.
I want this speaker to be the complete opposite as a basis for comparison.
I guess the hardest part of this design is finding a decent bass driver to go with it.
At first I did consider the W200S, the 8" version of the W250S:
http://www.soundlabsgroup.com.au/p/V-9030-W200S/W+200+S+-+8+Ohm
This driver would still provide reasonably well extended bass without an overy large vented enclosure (I prefer an alignment with good transient response over the ultimately low f3).
However the smaller cone comes with a slight compromise in sensitivity. I would really like to achieve the full 6dB of baffle step correction in the speaker while retaining a speaker sensitivity of 90dB/2.83V.
This requires a 90dB/2.83V bass driver (the second parallel 0.5 way bass driver in the design is just there for the baffle step).
I think I'll search a bit more for 8" bass drivers.
Cheers,
Glen
Andy G said:Earl is using PA drivers, and as far as I can see, is crossing to use the directivity of them.
The drivers he uses are more like a PA mid, and still do vocals quite well.. Normal HiFi bass drivers on the other hand ....
I actually did look at the PHL bass drivers for this design, with the idea of mounting a single 98dB/2.83V 12" or 15" driver on the side of the tower.
The only problem is you really need the $1200 18" to make any decent bass with these units without an EBP alignment
Cheers,
Glen
G.Kleinschmidt said:
They have used 1/6 or maybe 1/4 octave smoothing for the chart. It would be interesting to see it unsmoothed. Just my opinion that the best of the driver is below 500Hz.
G.Kleinschmidt said:
A 7" midbass is not a 10"woofer.
The solution, and I know you may not like it, is to pick another mid. It's my view, for what that's worth, that the midband should be free of crossover points. 300, 400, even 500hz fine but 800 is too high. It's in a very sensitive area.
I saw a 5" that looks like a good mid - AL-130M. This has 90db sensitivity and you could push it to 4K crossover. More important it will cross low to the woofers. That tweeter you selected looks good to cross as low as 3K.
I would change the mid and cross the upper woofer to the mid at ~500hz. The lower would cross at your baffle step frequency. The mid would cross with the tweeter at 3.5k-4K.
C
G.Kleinschmidt said:
I use a Panasonic capsule stuck on the end of a wooden wand. I made a mike preamp based on Eric Wallen's design.
The mic:
Looks are deceiving. It performs beautifully.
Howdy Glen,
I haven't done it yet, but I'm thinking of buying the mic preamp kit and a few Panasonic electret capsules from Vikash, here:
http://www.madaboutsound.com/
Thought this might suit you. The calibration file and instructions are downloadable off the site.
Cheers
Stuey
I haven't done it yet, but I'm thinking of buying the mic preamp kit and a few Panasonic electret capsules from Vikash, here:
http://www.madaboutsound.com/
Thought this might suit you. The calibration file and instructions are downloadable off the site.
Cheers
Stuey
MJL21193 said:
If Zaph can cross over to his dome midrange at 850Hz then I can crossover to mine at 800Hz.
I'm not budging on the midrange and tweeter selection and I'd like to crossover to the ribbon with the recommended 12dB crossover a little higher than 4k minimum. This is where the dome comes in handy.
Does that Panasonic capsule come with a calibration certificate and individual FR plot?
Cheers,
Glen
Moondog55 said:
Hi
That driver looks nice, but the bass response is perhaps a bit limited.
I just looked up what Visaton mate with the GF50 dome crossed over at 800Hz in one of their commercial speakers:
http://www.visaton.com/en/bauvorschlaege/3_wege/casablanca_iii/index.html
The 8” GF200:
http://www.soundlabsgroup.com.au/p/V-1330-GF200/GF+200+-+2+x+4+Ohm
With the dual 4-ohm coils in series the sensitivity is 88dB/2.83V. I guess I could pad the midrange down a few dB and live with that.
Cheers,
Glen
Moondog55 said:
That little AL170 does perform rather well! I just put it up against 3 of the larger Visaton 8” bass drivers in WinISD (SBB4 alignment) and it has a comparable frequency response.
AL200-8
W200S-8
GF200-8
All drivers are 8 ohms with a sensitivity of 88dB/2.83V.
Stuey said:
Thanks! I'll give it a look.
Cheers,
Glen
Attachments
Behringer:
http://www.realtraps.com/art_microphones.htm
See "Microphone":
http://www.linkwitzlab.com/sys_test.htm
Also:
http://www.libinst.com/ordering.htm
http://www.realtraps.com/art_microphones.htm
See "Microphone":
http://www.linkwitzlab.com/sys_test.htm
Also:
http://www.libinst.com/ordering.htm
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