I just finished one Ultra speaker last night.
I'm not complaining
How important is it to have a perfect seal between drivers and the baffle?
Right now I'm not using any caulking under the woofer.
Also, regarding baffle shape, would there be any drawbacks in having the front baffle bend say 10-15 degrees at a 8cm distance from the woofer? And having the wings at a proportional angle as to still give the 90 degree from the front.
I'm not complaining
How important is it to have a perfect seal between drivers and the baffle?
Right now I'm not using any caulking under the woofer.
Also, regarding baffle shape, would there be any drawbacks in having the front baffle bend say 10-15 degrees at a 8cm distance from the woofer? And having the wings at a proportional angle as to still give the 90 degree from the front.
Questions
brixvold: Good to hear you are making progress! A perfect seal is not essential, but still a good idea. With some leakage (bypass) you will lose some efficiency and possibly generate some unwanted wind noise.
As for modifying the baffle shape, I am not sure I understand exactly what you want to do. Or why you want to do it? Any change like what I think you are describing will require crossover tweaks...
Can you explain what and why you wish to do this mod? J
brixvold: Good to hear you are making progress! A perfect seal is not essential, but still a good idea. With some leakage (bypass) you will lose some efficiency and possibly generate some unwanted wind noise.
As for modifying the baffle shape, I am not sure I understand exactly what you want to do. Or why you want to do it? Any change like what I think you are describing will require crossover tweaks...
Can you explain what and why you wish to do this mod? J
Thanks John.
I was just curious if it was possible for aesthetic reason to change the front baffle so it appeared smaller by chamfering the corners while retaining the distance to the edge.
Sadly it didn't work out to be less intimidating than the original.
Is there any way to estimate of how a given shape will fare softwarewise? I seem to run my head against a wall in this regard.
The post you made with the modified wings, I cannot match the size of the speaker with the given dimensions for the Ultra. Did something change?
I was just curious if it was possible for aesthetic reason to change the front baffle so it appeared smaller by chamfering the corners while retaining the distance to the edge.
Sadly it didn't work out to be less intimidating than the original.
Is there any way to estimate of how a given shape will fare softwarewise? I seem to run my head against a wall in this regard.
The post you made with the modified wings, I cannot match the size of the speaker with the given dimensions for the Ultra. Did something change?
I am not aware of software dedicated to OB shape and dimension optimizing. I do recall reading a few posts about use of traditional enclosure baffle shape software to explore baffle diffraction effects. If I remember correctly, the software works at the outer extremes program wise in an attempt to simulate OB baffle performance. I wish I would have paid more attention... suspect others here have and may be able to provide some info for you.
As far as modified wings go, with this project approaching, what, 10 years? And there have been various modifications that have come and gone. And honestly never thought it would be as popular as it has been. And I have not done the best of a job at staying on top of the project. If you can guide me to wing mod post you are referencing, I can take a look .... and may be able to provide useful comment. J
As far as modified wings go, with this project approaching, what, 10 years? And there have been various modifications that have come and gone. And honestly never thought it would be as popular as it has been. And I have not done the best of a job at staying on top of the project. If you can guide me to wing mod post you are referencing, I can take a look .... and may be able to provide useful comment. J
What I thought :/ I will!
Basta! seems like a great tool but it only incorporates the baffle not the wings.
Sure, these many pages later I can't blame you. Here it is:
https://www.diyaudio.com/forums/mul...n-inexpensive-ob-project-178.html#post5388601
And I just now noticed that it is the manzanita proper that has received extra wings,. I didn't follow the development to use the GRS for that model.
No wonder I couldn't match the measurements with the photos.
I was reading up on open baffle theory and suddenly your modified wings made more sense. I'm trying to see if I can make a more organic and elegant shape out of the speaker and not destroy SQ but maybe better it. Excuse the hybris
Basta! seems like a great tool but it only incorporates the baffle not the wings.
Sure, these many pages later I can't blame you. Here it is:
https://www.diyaudio.com/forums/mul...n-inexpensive-ob-project-178.html#post5388601
And I just now noticed that it is the manzanita proper that has received extra wings,. I didn't follow the development to use the GRS for that model.
No wonder I couldn't match the measurements with the photos.
I was reading up on open baffle theory and suddenly your modified wings made more sense. I'm trying to see if I can make a more organic and elegant shape out of the speaker and not destroy SQ but maybe better it. Excuse the hybris
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Excellent. My first image was a little too small it seems.
Does this look like a good place to start?
The double woofers response is set with L1:4mH R1:2Ohm and reverse polarity.
I was thinking of getting a planar tweeter for the top, crossed at 6k.
HiVi RT1C-A Planar Isodynamic Tweeter
A ribbon would surely be better but I'm trying to do some budget learning.
Does this look like a good place to start?
The double woofers response is set with L1:4mH R1:2Ohm and reverse polarity.
I was thinking of getting a planar tweeter for the top, crossed at 6k.
HiVi RT1C-A Planar Isodynamic Tweeter
A ribbon would surely be better but I'm trying to do some budget learning.
Yes Open Baffle is selected. I can't tell why it looks so good, maybe there's a bug? If you have other suggestions for simulation software that can do open baffle I'm all ears.
Basta has been discontinued and gone freeware, you can download your own copy at leisure.
Tolvan Data
OK I had a look at BASTA last night and to me it looks like the "Baffle" selection on the box type tab isn't open baffle. It plots the same way as the Large Closed Box. In Tolvan's Edge software there is a selection button for open or closed baffle, but I can't find that in BASTA.
Didn't get time to simulate in other software, still need to dig up the T/S parameters for the GRS driver.
Didn't get time to simulate in other software, still need to dig up the T/S parameters for the GRS driver.
Are you using the new version? Just changing to baffle should give one the open baffle according to the manual.
It's buggy! changing through the different box types/baffle, sometimes it doesn't change the response, like hanging on to the last one. Also changing the number of drivers sometimes doesn't update the baffle designer. Darn!
GRS 15PF-8 - 15" Woofer
I've used these parameters.
I just realized I may have ordered the wrong crossover parts. I ordered the parts for the Ultra (20mH coils, 2.5mH coils, 5.6uF caps, and 8 and 15 Ohm resistors). I would like to build the Manzanita from post #1776. I know John answered my earlier question about the crossover tweaks it would take to make the new wings work in post #1787. My question is, would those tweaks be applied to the standard Manzanita XO in post #1601 or would the tweaks start with the Ultra XO? Just want to know I'm not starting with the wrong XO as I have seen people build the standard Manzanita with the Ultra XO as well.
John should chime in soon, but those values will certainly get you started. You'll want to tweak the 8 ohm series resistor and maybe the 5.6uF high pass cap for that baffle. The 8 ohm value might need to be reduced to get the Vifa a little louder.
Having a cap value of around 4uF that you can add to a little at a time (in parallel) is an easy way to tweak. A fistful of 1uF and 0.5 that you can add and subtract to find a final value works.
Having a cap value of around 4uF that you can add to a little at a time (in parallel) is an easy way to tweak. A fistful of 1uF and 0.5 that you can add and subtract to find a final value works.
new build after many years - impressed
hi all,
I'm late to the party by a few years, but I have just completed one of these ob speakers. Im very happy, impressed and taken by open baffle!
I built these using the tc9 and a 12" GRS speaker with the xo from the 10 year post ( #160-62). everything bought from parts express and I hacked up a baffle from some 1/2 inch particle board before I go and build a nice hard wood baffle and make everything pretty. The one speaker has been playing for 3 or so hours and is getting better by the minute. Doris Day, Diana Krall and Mark Isham's Blue Sun all sound great. I love the live open sound, works in our 50;s hardwood floor living room very well. Sound thru out house sounds balanced and even. really nice to have some deeper bass than the folcal bookshelves I have listened too for years. I just love the open sound.
Big thank you to John B and Pano for all their work and support of this project over the years. Its a very rewarding project !
excited to continue of the OB journey. And thanks again for such a great thread...and these forums are the best...I have a JE labd 2a3 and pass BOZ preamp thanks to the folks here...the 2a3 is not up to driving these speaker...right now a TDA something d-amp is working well...might have to go look for NAD amp, cuz I love those things too.
all take care,
Jeff Foster ( Oakland CA)
hi all,
I'm late to the party by a few years, but I have just completed one of these ob speakers. Im very happy, impressed and taken by open baffle!
I built these using the tc9 and a 12" GRS speaker with the xo from the 10 year post ( #160-62). everything bought from parts express and I hacked up a baffle from some 1/2 inch particle board before I go and build a nice hard wood baffle and make everything pretty. The one speaker has been playing for 3 or so hours and is getting better by the minute. Doris Day, Diana Krall and Mark Isham's Blue Sun all sound great. I love the live open sound, works in our 50;s hardwood floor living room very well. Sound thru out house sounds balanced and even. really nice to have some deeper bass than the folcal bookshelves I have listened too for years. I just love the open sound.
Big thank you to John B and Pano for all their work and support of this project over the years. Its a very rewarding project !
excited to continue of the OB journey. And thanks again for such a great thread...and these forums are the best...I have a JE labd 2a3 and pass BOZ preamp thanks to the folks here...the 2a3 is not up to driving these speaker...right now a TDA something d-amp is working well...might have to go look for NAD amp, cuz I love those things too.
all take care,
Jeff Foster ( Oakland CA)
