Thanks so much for getting back to me.
I have been looking around more today and I may have found a pot that will work:
100k Log UK. Made Omeg Small Potentiometer, With Switch, 4mm D Shape Spindle | eBay
All of the dimensions seem to be ok even though the body is 20mm in diameter. The original pot is 16mm. The shaft is 4mm in diameter, D shaped and it's the correct length, 12mm. Surprising. I think I can take the switch on the back apart and remove the detent so you won't feel a "click". I might even be able to remove the whole switch completely.
Can you think of any reason why this pot wouldn't work? Am I missing anything?
Thanks
I have been looking around more today and I may have found a pot that will work:
100k Log UK. Made Omeg Small Potentiometer, With Switch, 4mm D Shape Spindle | eBay
All of the dimensions seem to be ok even though the body is 20mm in diameter. The original pot is 16mm. The shaft is 4mm in diameter, D shaped and it's the correct length, 12mm. Surprising. I think I can take the switch on the back apart and remove the detent so you won't feel a "click". I might even be able to remove the whole switch completely.
Can you think of any reason why this pot wouldn't work? Am I missing anything?
Thanks
[*** Shifted over here from another thread per Voltwide's request ***]
Hi there Voltwide and the rest of the the diyaudio forum,
Seth here from Boston, MA, USA as my Dynacord CLS-222 is dead and I could use some help.
First off, I'm blown away and honored that Voltwide is on here, as he created the original Dynacord CLS-22 (which preceded the CLS-222). (In fact, Voltwide suggested that I post this here to put it out to everyone.)
Long story short, I've had mine since about high school in the late '80s, and it has never let me down until now. As I haven't gigged out in years, it just sat unused in climate controlled storage for about 10 years along with my Hammond XB-2. Last year, I pulled them both out, cleaned them up, and they worked great. Sure enough, I put them back in storage until now. Turns out both are dead.
(FYI, per the XB-2, I'm guessing it's likely "bitrot" per the sound chip on the motherboard -- as almost no sound is coming out, and there are no replacements available. But that's another story, I guess!)
Per the CLS-222, to my dismay, once I realized it was dead, I opened it up and both internal T315mA fuses were blown. I bought some replacement fuses, plugged it in, the lights came on for a millisecond, and then it went out -- blowing another set of fuses. Darn.
I've taken the top and bottom covers off and everything looks brand-new and pristine inside the unit. One capacitor (at C083) was tilted and not flush to the board, so I unsoldered it, tested it (which seemed to test fine per my rudimentary multimeter), checked for any leaking that might have pushed it up (there was none), and put it back. Likely a red herring there.
Any idea why it's shorting out? Again, the unit did not see wear and tear...it largely sat in my home studio or in storage...and none of the capacitors look swollen. Is there a quick fix?
I'm certainly no electrical genius, but I guess I could order parts and solder and replace them if necessary - but that's about the limit of my skills.
I'd be super-grateful for whatever advice you might have - especially Voltwide. Thank you all in advance for your help! - Seth
PICTURES (I can post plenty more if necessary - particularly close-ups)
Hi there Voltwide and the rest of the the diyaudio forum,
Seth here from Boston, MA, USA as my Dynacord CLS-222 is dead and I could use some help.
First off, I'm blown away and honored that Voltwide is on here, as he created the original Dynacord CLS-22 (which preceded the CLS-222). (In fact, Voltwide suggested that I post this here to put it out to everyone.)
Long story short, I've had mine since about high school in the late '80s, and it has never let me down until now. As I haven't gigged out in years, it just sat unused in climate controlled storage for about 10 years along with my Hammond XB-2. Last year, I pulled them both out, cleaned them up, and they worked great. Sure enough, I put them back in storage until now. Turns out both are dead.
(FYI, per the XB-2, I'm guessing it's likely "bitrot" per the sound chip on the motherboard -- as almost no sound is coming out, and there are no replacements available. But that's another story, I guess!)
Per the CLS-222, to my dismay, once I realized it was dead, I opened it up and both internal T315mA fuses were blown. I bought some replacement fuses, plugged it in, the lights came on for a millisecond, and then it went out -- blowing another set of fuses. Darn.
I've taken the top and bottom covers off and everything looks brand-new and pristine inside the unit. One capacitor (at C083) was tilted and not flush to the board, so I unsoldered it, tested it (which seemed to test fine per my rudimentary multimeter), checked for any leaking that might have pushed it up (there was none), and put it back. Likely a red herring there.
Any idea why it's shorting out? Again, the unit did not see wear and tear...it largely sat in my home studio or in storage...and none of the capacitors look swollen. Is there a quick fix?
I'm certainly no electrical genius, but I guess I could order parts and solder and replace them if necessary - but that's about the limit of my skills.
I'd be super-grateful for whatever advice you might have - especially Voltwide. Thank you all in advance for your help! - Seth
PICTURES (I can post plenty more if necessary - particularly close-ups)
After 30yrs your CLS222 seems to be in an amazingly pristine condition.
Before starting you should print the circuit diagrams shown in this thread.
These 315mA fuses blown indicate some kind of short circuit on the secondary side, i.e. the transformer obviously works fine.
The first suspects are the bridge rectifier and both voltage regulators for +15V and -15V respectively.
With fuses removed you should check the bridge rectifier for shorts between any AC-in ("’~") and DC-out ("+", "-").
Furthermore Check +15V and -15V rails for shorts.
Luckily there seem to be no Tantals on the board, otherwise I would replace them by standard electrolytics.
Good luck!
Before starting you should print the circuit diagrams shown in this thread.
These 315mA fuses blown indicate some kind of short circuit on the secondary side, i.e. the transformer obviously works fine.
The first suspects are the bridge rectifier and both voltage regulators for +15V and -15V respectively.
With fuses removed you should check the bridge rectifier for shorts between any AC-in ("’~") and DC-out ("+", "-").
Furthermore Check +15V and -15V rails for shorts.
Luckily there seem to be no Tantals on the board, otherwise I would replace them by standard electrolytics.
Good luck!
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Thanks, @voltwide !
Yes - I got this unit in great shape years ago and it hardly left the house…and has sat for 10 years unused. I try to keep my gear in great shape.
Forgive me as I’m definitely no electrical expert and basic soldering...and am certainly up for testing for a short circuit (but may just need a little direction). Please forgive my newbie questions here (but better that I ask first before potentially frying things - or myself!)
1) What can I actually test with the power off? I know how to test for shorts per the resistors and diodes in a circuit. But what about capacitors? Can I test them for shorts without removing them from the board? If so, I’ll go buy a more advanced multimeter. What else can I do in this department?
2) When I need to test voltages, you’re saying…it's safe to remove fuses F001 and F002 (BUT NOT F003), and plug in the 110V AC power - and turn it on. From there, you want me to test this part of the diagram? (picture below) I’m assuming the voltage regulator is the big rectangular Tricoll(R) 170 unit…and I’d test the soldering points on the rear of the unit for voltages while it’s plugged in (picture below)?
3) I tested the bridge rectifier per it's four diodes, and I think it’s okay. Per my DVM in the diode setting, the four diodes tested 1V in one direction and 0.5V in the opposite direction. Correct?
4) I think I may have identified some Tantalum capacitors (ex: C107, C041, C047, C048, etc.)? (picture below) Could they be at fault?
Just figure I’d ask this first and do things methodically if possible - as this admittedly seems like a daunting task but hopefully well worth it - particularly as my unit is otherwise in great shape. So many thanks again for your help.
Yes - I got this unit in great shape years ago and it hardly left the house…and has sat for 10 years unused. I try to keep my gear in great shape.
Forgive me as I’m definitely no electrical expert and basic soldering...and am certainly up for testing for a short circuit (but may just need a little direction). Please forgive my newbie questions here (but better that I ask first before potentially frying things - or myself!)
1) What can I actually test with the power off? I know how to test for shorts per the resistors and diodes in a circuit. But what about capacitors? Can I test them for shorts without removing them from the board? If so, I’ll go buy a more advanced multimeter. What else can I do in this department?
2) When I need to test voltages, you’re saying…it's safe to remove fuses F001 and F002 (BUT NOT F003), and plug in the 110V AC power - and turn it on. From there, you want me to test this part of the diagram? (picture below) I’m assuming the voltage regulator is the big rectangular Tricoll(R) 170 unit…and I’d test the soldering points on the rear of the unit for voltages while it’s plugged in (picture below)?
3) I tested the bridge rectifier per it's four diodes, and I think it’s okay. Per my DVM in the diode setting, the four diodes tested 1V in one direction and 0.5V in the opposite direction. Correct?
4) I think I may have identified some Tantalum capacitors (ex: C107, C041, C047, C048, etc.)? (picture below) Could they be at fault?
Just figure I’d ask this first and do things methodically if possible - as this admittedly seems like a daunting task but hopefully well worth it - particularly as my unit is otherwise in great shape. So many thanks again for your help.
Testing with fuses removed separates the mains transformer - connecting its primary to mains at that time makes NO sense at all, but should not harm as well.
Testing for shorts should be do-able with any al-cheapo DVM from the hardware store etc - no need for more sophisticated ones at this time.
Caps go very seldom shorted.
And no, I do not see any tantals on your photograph.
The rectifier bridge seems to be ok. Fine.
Hence the short must be behind the rectifier.
With your DVM check +22,5V+15V -15V -22,5V rails against GND=0V=CenterTap of transformer secondary.
For your personnal safety all these and future measurements are carried out with mains definitivly disconnected!
Do you have some lab power supply (0..15V, 0..1A or similar)?
Testing for shorts should be do-able with any al-cheapo DVM from the hardware store etc - no need for more sophisticated ones at this time.
Caps go very seldom shorted.
And no, I do not see any tantals on your photograph.
The rectifier bridge seems to be ok. Fine.
Hence the short must be behind the rectifier.
With your DVM check +22,5V+15V -15V -22,5V rails against GND=0V=CenterTap of transformer secondary.
For your personnal safety all these and future measurements are carried out with mains definitivly disconnected!
Do you have some lab power supply (0..15V, 0..1A or similar)?
This black box made by Tricoll is the power transformer. Both voltage regulators are screwed to the right hand side (referring to your pic) of that U-shaped aluminium heatsink.
And - get that RFI suppression capacitor with the 0,1µF + 100Ω writing on top replaced IMMEDIATELY, as it will explode sooner or later or shunt the power switch, depending on it's actual position in the circuitry.
Best regards!
And - get that RFI suppression capacitor with the 0,1µF + 100Ω writing on top replaced IMMEDIATELY, as it will explode sooner or later or shunt the power switch, depending on it's actual position in the circuitry.
Best regards!
I had to reactive my account to chime in.
I wanted to say thank you to everyone for covering this circuit as well as voltwide (the creator of the CLS-22 and CLS-222, though account is disabled at the moment) for supporting and entertaining every question asked. This thread will be of great use to me.
I've been wanting to build a stand-alone rotary circuit using BBDs for a while. While something like the Uni-vibe was intended to simulate this effect, it is just a phase shifter after all and leaves much to be desired.
I would really like to clone the CLS-222. My ultimate goal would be to more-or-less recreate the iconic sound of the 222 but using modern parts.
Here's my thoughts on substitutions for what's available today in year 2022.
TDA1022 - replace with XVIVE MN3007 at double the frequency. This will produce the same time delay with twice the sampling. Alternatively I could use a pair of MN3010 (dual 512 stage BBD) but am limited to my personal stock.
CA3280 - replace with the new alfa AS3280
CA3080 - replace with new alfa AS3080
TDA1074A - no replacements at all for this. I found a small source on ebay but expect that to deplete fast. I must find a way to either develop a drop-in sub-board for this part or redesign that entire part of the circuit for a functional equivalent. I don't expect that to be an easy task - in fact the most complicated part of my attempt to clone this thing.
All opamps are still in production - minus the 4 comparators.
I'm curious to know why 4 CA3290 ICs were used - leaving one channel of each device not used? As far as I can tell the channels are isolated internally - minus the voltage supply rails. If someone can suggest the reasoning for this please let me know! I suppose I'll find out the hard way on breadboard.
Because I do not have an original unit I'm going to see about procuring all of the original parts and breadboard each section, substituting parts as I go to compare.
I'll come back to report my progress and check in on any activity. Just wanted to share my interested and ideas on bringing this circuit back with modern parts.
I wanted to say thank you to everyone for covering this circuit as well as voltwide (the creator of the CLS-22 and CLS-222, though account is disabled at the moment) for supporting and entertaining every question asked. This thread will be of great use to me.
I've been wanting to build a stand-alone rotary circuit using BBDs for a while. While something like the Uni-vibe was intended to simulate this effect, it is just a phase shifter after all and leaves much to be desired.
I would really like to clone the CLS-222. My ultimate goal would be to more-or-less recreate the iconic sound of the 222 but using modern parts.
Here's my thoughts on substitutions for what's available today in year 2022.
TDA1022 - replace with XVIVE MN3007 at double the frequency. This will produce the same time delay with twice the sampling. Alternatively I could use a pair of MN3010 (dual 512 stage BBD) but am limited to my personal stock.
CA3280 - replace with the new alfa AS3280
CA3080 - replace with new alfa AS3080
TDA1074A - no replacements at all for this. I found a small source on ebay but expect that to deplete fast. I must find a way to either develop a drop-in sub-board for this part or redesign that entire part of the circuit for a functional equivalent. I don't expect that to be an easy task - in fact the most complicated part of my attempt to clone this thing.
All opamps are still in production - minus the 4 comparators.
I'm curious to know why 4 CA3290 ICs were used - leaving one channel of each device not used? As far as I can tell the channels are isolated internally - minus the voltage supply rails. If someone can suggest the reasoning for this please let me know! I suppose I'll find out the hard way on breadboard.
Because I do not have an original unit I'm going to see about procuring all of the original parts and breadboard each section, substituting parts as I go to compare.
I'll come back to report my progress and check in on any activity. Just wanted to share my interested and ideas on bringing this circuit back with modern parts.
CA3290 may be replaced by LM393B from TI.
https://richelectronics.co.uk/produ...onic-potentiometer-integrated-circuit-oma027a
https://richelectronics.co.uk/produ...onic-potentiometer-integrated-circuit-oma027a
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Thanks! I was actually already planning on using that as a substitute. I was also considering using the LM339 which is a quad comparator which could replace all 4 in the circuit - but I'm still not sure why only half of each package was used in the CLS-222.
Edit: maybe the CA3290 comparators had cross-interference at those frequencies? Without knowing what the original routing looked like I can only assume using 4 packages was the safest workaround if that was indeed the situation.
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I do not think that a quad 3290 has been available ever. Dual packs where always preferred for easier pcb layout.
These strange decisions often where a matter of simple pcb-layout these days
I didn't say they 3290 in quads were ever available...
In the CLS-222 these 4 comparator ICS were placed in the same area though only half of each channel is being utilized. That's why I'm toying with the idea of just using two duals or one quad but figured there was a factual reason to why 4 separate packages were used in the original design - but I can only speculate (example in my edited reply above).
Maybe you are right suspecting some possible interference issues. Who knows after 40 yrs?
I aim to make it rack-mount like the original. I've always wanted a rack setup and this would be a great start. If all goes well I foresee this possibly fitting onto a reasonably sized euro-rack panel. But it wouldn't be worth it if not everyone can easy procure the parts to build it.
Again, the biggest implication seems to be obtaining the TDA1074A chips. That is the only part I can't easily replace or substitute. But I've yet to study up on "dual tandem electronic potentiometers" so we'll see what happens after I tinker with some real ones.