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Build a Sunn Model T clone. Some questions. (EU)
Build a Sunn Model T clone. Some questions. (EU)
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Old 27th January 2015, 07:09 AM   #1
served is offline served
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Default Build a Sunn Model T clone. Some questions. (EU)

Hi.

I am starting a build for Sunn Model T clone.
I want the preamp and the poweramp to be as similar as possible.
So:
Preamp 3x12AX7
PA: 4x6550 Ultralinear

The first step as always, the transformers.

Yesterday I thought that I will give up on this one, as its damn expensive to get the original OT and PT.
But I don't really need the mercury transformers (I am also in EU) if there is another way.

So I am looking at Marshall Major 200W schematic at the moment.
To me it looks like I could use its Ultralinear transformer.

Here is the Major
http://elektrotanya.com/PREVIEWS/634..._sch.pdf_1.png
Here is the Sunn Model T Super (second gen)
http://music-electronics-forum.com/a...2nd-gen_ed.gif
Here is the Sunn Model T (the first gen)
http://www.prowessamplifiers.com/sch...nn_model_t.pdf


TAD has the Major OT in stock for 170€ and this is not bad price at all.

What do you think about this OT?
Output transf. for Marshall Major 200 W Ultralinear - Output Transf.
It has all the needed outputs. It uses different tubes, but 6550 and KT88 should be very similar as far as the transformer requirements go.

Still looking for the PT.

Last edited by served; 28th January 2015 at 03:02 PM.
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Old 27th January 2015, 09:41 AM   #2
JonSnell Electronic is offline JonSnell Electronic  United Kingdom
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The Marshall Major was designed and produced in 1967 as a Lead Head. Loads of distortion and a heavy sound.
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Old 27th January 2015, 10:32 AM   #3
served is offline served
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So you think that this OT will not suit?
I will use only the Output transformer.
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Old 27th January 2015, 11:05 AM   #4
JonSnell Electronic is offline JonSnell Electronic  United Kingdom
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The reason Marshall have the sound they have is due to the bias setting. The transformer you have chosen, I think will be as good as any. Could you not have one made for less cost at a transformer winding company nearer your home? The specification is good and can be readily manufactured. Just a thought.
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Old 27th January 2015, 04:16 PM   #5
bradberry00 is offline bradberry00  United States
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I'm planning the same project. I plan on using the Hammond 1650TA OT and the ClassicTone 100W Project PT with a slightly reworked power supply to get similar voltages to the original model t.
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Old 28th January 2015, 02:28 AM   #6
colorcat is offline colorcat  United States
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Default Dynaco- The way to go?

My understanding is: The Sunn amps used Dynaco transformers. In fact, as far as I know Dynaco built the amps for Sunn at first.. Tubedepot, I think that's the name, sells Dynaco kits.

Could be wrong but that is what I recall from my studies. I also simply built the Non UL PP circuit and very pleased with the outcome.

Regards,

Ccat.
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Old 28th January 2015, 02:54 AM   #7
bradberry00 is offline bradberry00  United States
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The early sunn amps did use dynaco transformers...I believe assembled from dynakits. but not the model t. If you could find the Dynaco Mark VI transformers, however, those would work.

Last edited by bradberry00; 28th January 2015 at 02:56 AM.
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Old 28th January 2015, 06:16 AM   #8
served is offline served
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Thanks guys!
I will now scratch that Major transformer plan!

I will build the Model T, like it was on the old schematic.
Too many colnes out there that only has the name but not the guts.

I will gather some information about the Mark VI and Dynaco.

Here is the link for MercuryMagnetics transformer page
Mercury Magnetics - Sunn amp transformers
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Old 28th January 2015, 02:52 PM   #9
teemuk is offline teemuk  Finland
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Quote:
Originally Posted by colorcat View Post
My understanding is: The Sunn amps used Dynaco transformers. In fact, as far as I know Dynaco built the amps for Sunn at first...

Sunn actually started out by making well designed and efficient speaker cabinets, not amps.

Since hardly any Sunn designer at the time knew how to design and amp the solution for making an amp product was simple: They bought Dynakit Mark III and Mark IV power amps and PAS-1 / PAM-1 preamps in bulk and mounted them to selfmade cabinets. Naturally, when all internal electronics were built from Dynaco's products the transformers were from Dynaco too. ;-)

Later on they modified these designs a little bit to suit instrument amplification better. Dynakits were eventually ditched when Sunn started making their own chassis from sheet metal. A bit later they went straight to ordering transformers from the same supplier that Dynaco used. So they no longer needed Dynakits to make a product.

Model T appeared almost ten years later than any of this. By the time Sundholmn brothers had already sold the company to Hartzell Corp.

Be aware that there are at least three different model T's: The very first one, revision A, is practically a Fender 5F6 preamp married to a 150W ultralinear power amp. Revision C, known as Model T Super, is almost identical looking unit, except for a variable mid-range switch (a feature adopted from Model A's). However, internally it's almost nothing like the original design and has "James"-style tone control instead of that Fender circuit and quite different "gain staging". Rev A is preferred by guitarists, Rev C by bassists. Guitarist didn't really love rev C. By the way, schematic in the very first post is for Model T Super, not for the Model T revision A. Fender's reissue is a totally different and very modern design and I don't even know why they named it Model T. It's not even vaguely similar to originals.

Schematic for revision A model T:
http://elektrotanya.com/PREVIEWS/634...el-t.pdf_1.png

I have no idea about what kind of an amp revision B was.

Last edited by teemuk; 28th January 2015 at 03:07 PM.
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Old 28th January 2015, 03:01 PM   #10
served is offline served
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Thanks teemuk!

That new Fender reissue is not worth the name.
But good points on the Super vs the first gen.
I actually posted the second Gen Super schematic in the first post.

Here is the First Gen. Obvious differences in the Preamp section.
Great input!
http://www.prowessamplifiers.com/sch...nn_model_t.pdf
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