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TWO stacked 4" drivers, versus one 6" driver
TWO stacked 4" drivers, versus one 6" driver
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Old 6th September 2019, 07:13 AM   #31
norman bates is offline norman bates  United States
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Don't do it !

I had under / over tang band 4" with 5" frames (the bamboo ones).

I preferred both running wide open for less distortion.

But, i leveled it with pennies.

Slouch where you sit, and you lost highs.
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Old 7th September 2019, 02:00 PM   #32
Jim Griffin is offline Jim Griffin  United States
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I would never recommend that you don't do it when referencing a two driver configuration.

What I suggest is that you do it right. Planet10's one page wiring/loading sheet linked in Reply #5 of this thread covers most of the issues with the choices of configurations for the two drivers.

Running both drivers full range is not the correct answer for a two driver arrangement. That situation usually degrades the high frequency sound and likely does not account for BSC which would adjust the lower frequency SPL level.

For two 8 ohms drivers and provided your amplifier can deal with a 4 ohms load, the configuration that runs two drivers in parallel with a series coil on one driver for BSC provides excellent sound for me. Best deals with any low frequency distortion, adjusts the SPL flatness over the range, and
assures high frequency smoothness.

Last edited by Jim Griffin; 7th September 2019 at 02:06 PM.
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Old 13th September 2019, 03:47 PM   #33
jjasniew is offline jjasniew  United States
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I got the Daytons and got them installed; gosh they are the audio equivalent of staring directly into an LED flashlight - so bright they are painful, some recordings unlistenable... Immediate impression was like listening to just tweeters, kinda like the Fe103s (unaided by some eq and sub) are like listening to just midranges -

Maybe that's why the seller was getting rid of them.

I wonder if there's a reasonable way to shelf-down the whole decade from 1 - 10 kHz?
I'm 62 and top out at 10 kHz - I cant imagine what these would sound like to a teenager.

Back when the audio industry was transitioning from LPs to digital, I figured out that some engineers EQ'd the digital to sound like the LP, instead of the original mix. But they didnt have the cartridge loading capacitance correct, so the digital product ended up sounding like the LP with the high end EQ completely wrong! When these speakers encounter such a recording (Fleetwood Mac), the treble is just completely insane...

Maybe make nice tweeters in a FAST OB design. Now I wish I went with those Japanese EQ'd MA drivers. Live and learn.
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Old 13th September 2019, 04:30 PM   #34
GM is offline GM  United States
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Use a frequency contour filter [AKA CD horn EQ]: A, B, and C Contour Filters for Sound Measurement

Contour Network Designer / Calculator

GM
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Old 16th September 2019, 05:56 AM   #35
jjasniew is offline jjasniew  United States
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Well, we'd like it best if the transducer just had a flattish response without having to resort to putting extra stuff in the electrical signal path. I do appreciate you pointing out the Contour Network designer link!

What I've done instead is incorporate this Equalizer APO VST plug-in host into my system, as all my musical entertainment runs on Windows and all my music collection resides therein. I just use the EQ to shelf down that rising response and it sounds better - probably quite similar to inserting the electrical filter into the speaker wiring.

No soldering required. I've only recently learned about this Equalizer APO thing. It sounds to me that you can EQ with zero adverse effects - like you'd get from running an analog signal through a few dozen circuits comprised of capacitors in the signal path. As we had in the old days...

Yeah, I'm behind. But I'll probably never look back when it comes to using software based music production tools to listen to music.
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Last edited by jjasniew; 16th September 2019 at 05:59 AM.
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Old 16th September 2019, 06:03 AM   #36
planet10 is offline planet10  Canada
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TWO stacked 4" drivers, versus one 6" driver
Which plug-in did you get?

With plug-ins you can also create a curve that when convoled with the signal gives flat response (phase & magnitude).

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Old 16th September 2019, 08:05 AM   #37
GM is offline GM  United States
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jjasniew View Post
Well, we'd like it best if the transducer just had a flattish response without having to resort to putting extra stuff in the electrical signal path. I do appreciate you pointing out the Contour Network designer link!

No soldering required. I've only recently learned about this Equalizer APO thing. It sounds to me that you can EQ with zero adverse effects
You're welcome, but I'd like it best if you'd told us about your music system from the get-go and wouldn't have wasted my time.

Yes, today's digital signal processors [DSP] are so good, full featured, quiet that in general there's no need for passive components anymore or how flat the driver needs to be or even if its specs are any good for the available cab size, just digitally re-EQ it, trading efficiency for bandwidth [BW], so obviously won't play [nearly] as loud, but then relatively few folks play their systems loud, even if HTs and tolerate a lot more distortion than they might think.

GM
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Old 17th September 2019, 06:09 AM   #38
jjasniew is offline jjasniew  United States
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Dave, I've only tried a few free ones to see if the host works. One is a multi-band dynamic range compressor, that when you enter fractional compression values, it acts as an expander.

It's actually a dangerous plug-in, as it can become unwieldy in response to certain values entered for the compression ratios - I got it to cough up some real blasts of outright digital noise that could definitely be a speaker killer. However, after straightening out my approach to accommodate that aspect, I think I actually got it to do what I want this morning. Multiband dynamic range expansion.

I posted a topic over in the "PC" forum about using musical production tools to listen to music. Zero replies so far. They're as enamored with their raspberry PIs over there, as we are with a 6BQ5 in triode mode. So maybe no one's interested in some old guy's "Windows" on a "X86 PC based" music system. I'd like to learn more about what's available and what works in the realm of these VST plug-ins!
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Last edited by jjasniew; 17th September 2019 at 06:19 AM.
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Old 17th September 2019, 06:18 AM   #39
jjasniew is offline jjasniew  United States
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GM - it wasnt a waste of your time. I went to the links, ran some numbers, considered the results (If I have parts on hand that I could do this with...) I hadnt even got the software EQ program installed and setup yet - that happened after I went through the links you pointed me to.

So you inspired me into a solution. Isnt that a good part of what this is all about? It's just that I went off and found a different way of accomplishing the same thing - and your effort was a tooth in the cog that got me there. Thanks!
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Last edited by jjasniew; 17th September 2019 at 06:23 AM.
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