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Alpair 10.3 FAST / WAW guidance needed
Alpair 10.3 FAST / WAW guidance needed
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Old 25th August 2019, 06:12 PM   #11
planet10 is online now planet10  Canada
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Alpair 10.3 FAST / WAW guidance needed
Quote:
Originally Posted by chrisb View Post
...and the lower priced 2.1 units were, to be polite, not quite up to our standards
We did get one of those. It truly sucked. Daniel had a look at it and removed a compressor board out of the circuit and it became quite reasonable. I use it with a sealed SDX7 and have some sealed A10.2s as satelites.

dave
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Old 26th August 2019, 07:14 AM   #12
Lars Aalto is offline Lars Aalto  Finland
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Quote:
Originally Posted by planet10 View Post
Waxxís response makes me question my interpretation. Does this mean 2 woofers in 2 boxes with the woofers oriented to face each other or as Waxx seems to imply, are they being used in an isobarik configuration?

dave
Thanks, it's just one woofer per box, no isobarik setups yet.

I'll place them facing inside, keeps the little ones away from poking holes in them.
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Old 26th August 2019, 07:27 AM   #13
Lars Aalto is offline Lars Aalto  Finland
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chrisb View Post
Iíd still suggest that high passing the sealed Alpairs - whether by simple PLLXO or more flexible active XO methods - would yield benefits well worth the effort.
Dave and I have cumulatively played with quite a few brands and models of plate amps over the years, and while they do offer lots of convenience, I tended to avoid them for at least the last 5yrs of my active building. Very few units had decent HP functions - most none at all- and the lower priced 2.1 units were, to be polite, not quite up to our standards. Rhymes with trucking sad.

We had several builds with side mounted woofers; singles and multiples, mono- and bi-pole, and I canít recall ever having issues with bass performance in Daveís fairly spacious room that is very accommodating in that regard. Smaller rooms with asymmetrical boundary loading might be more problematic - your picture does show very tight on the right side.
At one time I had systems in three separate rooms - one was a long and skinny basement room that hardly improved much with rather a lot of DIY acoustic treatment, and I gave up on any more elaborate that near field computer micro sized boxes with a 3Ē FR driver. The large two rooms are approx 320sq ft and well over 600 if you account for the open floor plan. But for some of us furniture and WAF get in the way of what could compose an ideal system, and after over 30yrs of my wife putting up with some pretty awkward arrangements, it occurred to me that domestic peace in my impending and now present retirement years was far more valuable than any short term enjoyment .
Tranquility > ecstasy? Maybe- certainly more effortless for me to maintain.

So, you might want to consider the option of larger enclosures for the Alpairs to retain their LF extension capabilities, but still HP them - say circa 100-120- and implement mono bass, with multiple boxes located around the room. IINM, thatís something that minidsp and plug-in solutions can readily handle.
Of course, Iíve been a big fan of simple floor standers that meld into the roomís furnishings over chunky and visible multiple boxes for quite some time now (see above) . Small sealed woofers can be a lot easier to hide - or you could go the coffee table / cocktail shaker route.
Thank you Chris!

Yep, I have some WAF acceptance issues although she is quite flexible in the short-term with various cables, boxes and things lying around. In the current setup I actually have 1 subwoofer placed under the sofa, it was the only place available due to above issues but I'm not perfectly happy with how it performs.

I want to have floorstanders but with adjustable lower end so this was the best compromise I could think of, separate subs would be great but so far it's out of reach. The current Elac FS137 floorstanders actually go down to 30hz with room gain but it results in massive 10db drops/spikes between 30-100hz so I'm hoping that the small sealed boxes won't peak so badly and with 2 subs I can compensate & EQ them better. Audyssey seems to EQ subs better than main speakers and MiniDSP is on the shopping list for the future.

I'll keep the HP filter part in mind, I just received my measuring kit (ECM8000 mic with stand and USB soundcard) so I'll be able to test and add a crossover if it feels like it's needed.
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Old 28th August 2019, 06:36 AM   #14
Lars Aalto is offline Lars Aalto  Finland
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I managed to measure my current prototype sealed boxes and I'm quite happy with how it's looking.

This is from the main listening position per channel and then both channels with the current under the sofa sub in action.

Left side is opening into a large space and it shows, right side is getting a great boost from corner placement which results in quite a nice smooth response?

May need to bring down the high end >8khz a little?

Looks like the Alpairs are pretty smooth down to 30hz so definitely no additional low end stretch needed from larger enclosures. I'm hoping that my stereo subs will help sort out that big valley between 80-150hz, I'll need to experiment with different crossover points and sub levels.

Any other opinions?
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File Type: png right.PNG (61.4 KB, 304 views)
File Type: png audyssey.PNG (84.5 KB, 257 views)
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Old 29th August 2019, 03:39 PM   #15
Lars Aalto is offline Lars Aalto  Finland
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Building started, still some bracing to be added and I'm missing a router but so far so good. All parts are ready, will assemble when I find the router.

Really easy to build from 18mm birch ply and Titebond, earlier prototypes from 12mm were much trickier plus Titebond is the best glue I've ever tried!
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Old 30th August 2019, 07:27 AM   #16
TimbreAudio is online now TimbreAudio  United Kingdom
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Titebond 3 I hope!

If you need a cheapy router, check out the Katsu ones on Amazon. Makita clones, can't do much heavy lifting, but good for baffles.

I have some CNC jigs made for routing the rebate and internal cut-out (irregular shaped) if your interested, but they are only for the newer drivers pluvia7/7ms & pluvia 11/11ms. Idea was to sell them.
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Old 31st August 2019, 10:38 PM   #17
chrisb is offline chrisb
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Really only need the type 3 if “waterproof” is required- otherwise type 2 should be sufficient. It’s certainly more than adequate for the commercial mill work trade. Far more important is clean joint edges / surfaces.
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Old 3rd September 2019, 04:02 PM   #18
Lars Aalto is offline Lars Aalto  Finland
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I didn't know there were more than one Titebond, I used the "regular" red.

Build progressing, just need the router to finish the front plate.
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Old 4th September 2019, 11:39 AM   #19
TimbreAudio is online now TimbreAudio  United Kingdom
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Sorry, only playing. They are all good. I just prefer the 3.

Looking great!

Have you worked out how to route the baffle?
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Old 5th September 2019, 01:15 PM   #20
Lars Aalto is offline Lars Aalto  Finland
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Thanks, I will get a router next week and then it's time to practice routing after a long break.

Hopefully next week they're ready for a test run, will measure and adjust before final painting.
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