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cab options for coral beta 10
cab options for coral beta 10
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Old 20th July 2019, 06:19 PM   #1
jamie123 is offline jamie123  United Kingdom
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Default cab options for coral beta 10

hi,
ive just bought some lovely coral beta 10s in the orignal coral cabinets with abr units.
they sound rather good but id like to explore other cabinet options,at the moment they sound great except for the bass,whats there is tight but they dont really have a lot of it.
any help is appreciated.


heres what they are in now.
Click the image to open in full size.



Click the image to open in full size.






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Old 25th July 2019, 11:55 AM   #2
Mattes is offline Mattes  Germany
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Hi Jamie,


this is a very good find of what is, even after several decades, a veeery good fullrange unit. I had the Beta 8 30 years ago, and still bite myself in the a..., as I sold them some day...

To optimize itīs sound, I would work with:
- careful filtering of the FR unit, no FR is linear by itself.
- having a bass driver below, letīs say 200 Hz. That makes it easier for the FR.
- changing the enclosure to OB (together with a bass driver of course) will give you better results than any box, IF youīre able to maintain proper positioning of OB in your room.
- note that the Beta 10 seems to have a quite severe resonance at 2,1 kHz (look here, even if itīs in German: Hifi-Selbstbau - Coral Beta 10B) which should be filtered. This article also says that a proper BR enclosure will have several hundreds of liters...


Looking forward to hear from your project, I remain
with best regards


Mattes
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Old 25th July 2019, 04:21 PM   #3
jamie123 is offline jamie123  United Kingdom
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hello Mattes.
thanks for your reply,i was begining to think no one would comment!
ive not seen that website before,it makes interesting reading.
coral themselves made a few cabinet designs for the beta 10.


for the sealed cab they state 2 sizes.
width= 660 depth=470 height=900=279 lires
and smaller one,
width=550 depth=380 height=750=143 litres

the bass reflex design is,
width=500 depth=400 height=670 = 134 litres
all in mm


the sealed cabs they are in now are,
width=375 depth=285 height=660
the bass in the original cabinets is very poor as you would expect when comparing the other size cabinets above.
im not looking for earth shattering bass just reasonble good accurate bass.
different cabinets and what they do is all new to me but iam an ex cabinet maker so the woodwork is not a problem,its the theory behind the designs and measurments etc that i find confusing.

regards.
jamie

Last edited by jamie123; 25th July 2019 at 04:23 PM.
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Old 26th July 2019, 06:04 AM   #4
sumotan is offline sumotan  Indonesia
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Your a very very lucky man Jamie. Just look at the condition of the Beta 10 wow.
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Old 26th July 2019, 10:48 AM   #5
Mattes is offline Mattes  Germany
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Hi,


yes, Jamie is a lucky man... some years ago, Betalust caught my mind again and I was searching for a good pair of Beta 8. Those are already rare and expensive, a Beta 10 in the state shown by Jamie will be worth serious money...
I have a Fertin 21M8EX now and Iīm not looking back anymore.
The ABRs are also very rare, just saw them once in an ad, but never in reality.


In my humble opinion, Jamie has a few choices to make. All will mean to spend a little money on measurement equipment and such, a bit more financial effort will be needed to get all out of his find. He claims to be good at woodworking, thatīs fine, because these drivers deserve the best of cabinets (and they derserve as well all efforts with measurements, filtering, adjustment, or better balancing of the FR unit).


The community could possibly help with ideas and input, but measurements and woodworking have to be done personally.
In the moment, I could imagine two main directions:


1. Keep the original set of drivers, but design and build a proper and acoustically correct enclosure. Therefore, TSP measurements of the actual drivers are needed (I have a DATS vers. 2, a most valuable tool for maybe 120 pounds). I need to search my archives if I find any info on the ABR... for a start of ideas, one could work with the set of TSPs given by Hifi-Selbstbau.

I would suggest mild filtering of the unit, for which REW with a decent mike (maybe another 100 pounds) would be my suggestion.



2. Have the Beta 10 in OB, together with a good 18-inch bass driver (like an AD 1830, cheap and good. Filter parts will be a lot more expensive, if done passive and with good quality. A miniDSP will be cheaper, but I feel that the Beta 10 deserves a better quality... YMMV)


Jamie, could you please provide, in order to of any help, some further infos:
- room size and placement possibilities?
- what electronics?
- what are you willing to invest in a rare, historic masterpiece?
- and last but not least, what music is preferred and how loud?


best regards


Mattes
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Old 26th July 2019, 04:11 PM   #6
jamie123 is offline jamie123  United Kingdom
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hi Mattes,
i must admit to struggling with those improvements you mention,ive heard of rew but the other technical stuff ive not heard of at all,please bear in mind im a novice and have never done any measurements of drivers etc.


i normally use yamaha ns1000's in the nearfield postion. my room is 4580 x 3400 and i have the speakers against the long wall. i sit 1800 from them. as you can imagine i dont need to have the volume turned up very loud.


my musical tastes are norah jones,kate bush,pink floyd,paul weller,john william so a broad mix but mainly female vocal,acoustic guitar type of music.
i use a kt88 valve amp (approx 110 watts) with a paradise phono stage and sony tts-8000 tt,cdp is sony x555es.


i dont mind investing in the beta 10's as i very much like their sound but as i mentioned before id like the bass to go lower,if it can match the ns1000's id be happy.


may i ask why you mention an ob instead od the coral speaker cabinet designs already on the web? my only concern is i dont have much space to bring them away from the wall,do the ob's need a lot of room behind them?
iam tempted to just make the bass reflex cabinets from coral's measurements and take it from there,do you think thats a good idea?



looking forward to your reply.
j.

Last edited by jamie123; 26th July 2019 at 04:14 PM.
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Old 26th July 2019, 07:03 PM   #7
GM is offline GM  United States
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Definitely will need measured TS specs of each B10 driver; but FWIW​ in the meantime​, using these B10B specs, a classic reflex alignment [Vb = ~136 L net/Fb = actual Fs] damped to 'taste' is the best trade-off between size, LF extension, max power handling with a > 105 dB/40 Hz-up/2pi [half space], so near THX screen channel reference from a single driver, though how much more will depend on the driver's low distortion excursion capability and room acoustics.

Not all that many folks do HIFI this loud, so pretty impressive even by today's generally higher standards, though for modern levels of deep bass [< ~80 Hz​, i.e. Pink Floyd, etc.​] a separate sub system is mandatory​ for max [sub] bass satisfaction​.

GM
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File Type: txt Coral10BclassBR.txt (1.0 KB, 14 views)
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Old 26th July 2019, 08:07 PM   #8
sq225917 is offline sq225917  United Kingdom
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Jamie, they really are minters. I'd not zoomed the images before.
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Old 26th July 2019, 09:40 PM   #9
jamie123 is offline jamie123  United Kingdom
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sq225917 View Post
Jamie, they really are minters. I'd not zoomed the images before.

cheers si,
do you think its worth taking them to paul at rfc to get some measurments done,the post and the file posted above yours might as well be in japamese to me.
please fella's remember im a novice,when replying,trust me it frustrates the hell out of me that i dont know what all thise figures mean or relate too
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Old 27th July 2019, 04:38 AM   #10
GM is offline GM  United States
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........and it 'frustrates the hell out of' at least some of us that bother to respond that without measured specs, especially older drivers, that any design we do is likely to be far from optimum, though with EQ, internal damping can usually be made to work well enough in room if the OP doesn't have too strict a size limitation.

As for my post, 'we' regulars are well aware that what we post often means little, if anything to the casual poster, so was just something for me, others to 'talk' from as time permitted.

GM
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