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Is this a good idea?
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Old 23rd June 2018, 02:34 AM   #31
RXV is offline RXV  Philippines
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Moreover; For purely movie watching,

What would be the better driver used for surround/Atmos duties? (In terms of extended HF, DDR, details/clarity). Considering that these speakers will be set to SMALL and HPF cut-off at 80-100hz:

Markaudio Pluvia 7 (metal)
Markaudio Alpair 6 (metal)
Markaudio Alpair 5 (metal)

All three drivers are very near in terms of price.
note: I have an Alpair 7, but it is out of the question since it is in a different price point
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Old 23rd June 2018, 02:53 AM   #32
chrisb is offline chrisb
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Andy if I may -and at the risk of puffery - while Dave & Scott have between them almost innumerable designs, and Iíve built at least scores of them for proof of concept and bespoke sales, I also have well over a decade of attempting the art of compromise in a multi-channel surround HT system using enclosures from their catalogs. Even though he has a much better acoustic space than either of mine, Dave is still only running a 2.1 system - sometimes even absent the .1 section IINM?

So my point would be that, to reiterate what GM and others have probably stated here and elsewhere, if implementing a discrete front row 3, the center is the most significant channel in terms of resolution - although not necessarily requiring the same full bandwidth as the L&R mains if the system is also used for music only, and in a direct/bypass mode - i.e. a situation in which it would almost certainly be mute. If youíre fortunate enough to not be constrained on size/ footprint across the front row, Iíd definitely suggest the same drivers and enclosures for all three, and as any modern surround AVR worthy of the designation would provide bass management control to tailor the surround effects channels - up to, what 9 these days? - to filter whatever LF content might exist to the mono-summed LFE channel, the surround enclosures can be as small as practical for the chosen drivers.
Iím pretty sure I already posted a link to the ďMicro-tower home theatre appendixĒ plans, which while dated now in terms of the CHR70 intended, show the flexibility available with small sealed designs.

RXV - in short, if budget permits, Iíd go for the Pluvias.

It is of course way too easy to overthink all of this and get stuck in analysis paralysis.

As always, caveat emptor, YMMV, free advice is worth what you paid for.
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Old 23rd June 2018, 05:16 AM   #33
RXV is offline RXV  Philippines
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@chrisb

Thanks for the reply. The Alpairs 5 ($53) and Alpair 6 ($56) are actually a little more expensive than the Pluvia 7 ($45)
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Old 23rd June 2018, 06:06 AM   #34
planet10 is online now planet10  Canada
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Is this a good idea?
Just to mix things up...

The Pluvia 7 has a big edge in bass and volume levels it can attain. Technically both Alpairs the would have the greatest DDR, A6.2m to get low enuff to get as low as you want. But my personal pick would be A6.2p.

dave
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Old 23rd June 2018, 06:20 AM   #35
Andy Gamble is offline Andy Gamble  United States
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Chris, it goes up to at least 15 channels these days: center, left, right, side surrounds, rear surrounds, front wides, and front, middle and rear heights. I think I've heard of a rear center, too. With Atmos and DTSx you can theoretically add speakers of dubious benefit ad infinitum. I'm sticking with seven or nine.

I certainly intend to use the same driver and enclosure for the front three channels. If anything I have more space for the center than for the l&r, so I can do three reasonably sized towers. The tall skinny MLTLs are physically a good size and shape for the surrounds so I don't see a down side to using them there. I'll use the same driver for all channels.

So for the front three, Pensil, Derwent or Windmere? I like the idea of the deeper bass extension of the Windmere, but I'm not sure what I'd be giving up (other than size). I have no idea how an MLTL would compare to a BVR.
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Old 23rd June 2018, 07:13 AM   #36
Andy Gamble is offline Andy Gamble  United States
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Upon further thought, it would probably be a bit daft to try to get a 4" full range to extend below 50hz when I have a subwoofer, so let's count the Windermere out. What should I expect the difference to be between the Pensil MLTL and the Derwent BVR when placed up against a wall? I've never heard either type of enclosure, and I've seen both described as improvements on bass reflex enclosures, but I haven't found any clues regarding how they compare to each other.
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Old 24th June 2018, 12:09 AM   #37
chrisb is offline chrisb
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Andy - daft never stopped many a DIYer.
Itís been so long since I listened to a BVR other than the Vampyr - if that qualifies, so itíd be supposition on my part to opine as to the likely differences. FWIW, while Iíve flirted with other designs - that sound great but donít suit the room decor as well- Iíve been pretty happy with the Pensil design for both A7, and now the A10.3 in my home theatre system for well over 5 years now. If youíve got the floor space, thatíd be my suggestion. But of course, Iím at the twilight of my building ďcareerĒ
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Old 24th June 2018, 12:17 AM   #38
planet10 is online now planet10  Canada
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Is this a good idea?
I’m just guessing but i’d suspect the TL goes lower. Althou not the lowest possible tuning.

Note: Vampir-V is an ML-Voigt with horn loaded vents.

dave
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Old 30th July 2018, 10:32 PM   #39
Andy Gamble is offline Andy Gamble  United States
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Well, so far I've built two of the small MLTL's that Scott Lindgren designed for the EL70 (the Arro-inspired EL-rro, I guess it's called? It's on the Frugal-phile site), modified with a slot port in the side instead of the round port in the back, with the Pluvia 7 driver. I made the backs removable and have settled on roughly 4oz of fiberglass per speaker in the top 20" of the box. I'm using just the two of them and a small sub with an old integrated amplifier and a cheap DAC at the moment.

I'm extremely impressed with the sound. I'm currently watching Star Wars The Force Awakens; never have I heard a John Williams soundtrack sound this good. Some of the sounds in the movie seem to be somehow coming from a few feet to the left of the left speaker. These are among the best speakers I've heard.

I am definitely going to make at least five more of these. I'm getting a really remarkable deal on a Marantz SR8012 11.2 receiver, so I'll probably also end up making four small sealed boxes for the same driver to put on the ceiling for the Atmos channels.

Thanks for all of your help getting my game plan straight, it's certainly paying off.
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