Need help with enclosure for Supravox 165-2000EXC

[Lowrideris]

thanks planet10, very good info. what enclosure was next that was good ?

 

[planet10]

We never went further with that driver. For the SupraVox i’d have to look at it specifically. If it didn’t fit in my miniOnken alignment, i’d have to pass off to Scott, and that might take a while, we have lots already on our plate.

dave

 

[GM]

Chris built that enclosure… it sucked.

Yeah, from the 'bad old days' of the first 'full range' forum when these were being experimented with, a typical simmed response using MJK's early WS: http://techtalk.parts-express.com/filedata/fetch?id=1124382

Unfolded pipe with properly designed pipe vent still not as smooth as a MLTL: Voigt Pipe

Damping schemes:

GM

 

[Staudio]

Hello. Is there anybody, who tried or listened to 165GMF?

 

[Lowrideris]

I had. Gmf + supravox tweeter. Dont liked. Bass is good but sound was not phase clrected and sounded verh bad. Better buy 165lb alone. Very good bass mids amd highs . No need help ftom tweeter!

 

[Staudio]

I had. Gmf + supravox tweeter. Dont liked. Bass is good but sound was not phase clrected and sounded verh bad. Better buy 165lb alone. Very good bass mids amd highs . No need help ftom tweeter!

It's suprising. 165 GMF has one of the best whaterfalls and it is one of the most speedy (bl/mms) from all Supravox drivers.
What filtering did you have with 165 GMF?

 

[Lowrideris]

It's suprising. 165 GMF has one of the best whaterfalls and it is one of the most speedy (bl/mms) from all Supravox drivers.
What filtering did you have with 165 GMF?

i listened to orginal supravox Melodia speaker. so with original filter. and as i said sound was not good.then listened to supravox kelia, and that was very good sounding speaker very recommending.Supravox Kelia

 

[Staudio]

i listened to orginal supravox Melodia speaker. so with original filter. and as i said sound was not good.then listened to supravox kelia, and that was very good sounding speaker very recommending.Supravox Kelia

Oh, I see.
And what about 215 rtf64 or 215S, have you compared it to 165? What is the difference in sound?

 

[Lowrideris]

Oh, I see.
And what about 215 rtf64 or 215S, have you compared it to 165? What is the difference in sound?

RTF i did not listenet. but i had in my apartmends supravox BAHIA with 215 S bic.
very soft romantic sound...internal cabling was terrible,and cheap. instaled jupirter copper in cotton 1.5mm. sound was more precize not so soft and wooly. jupiter cable mod was ideal. also improved 10+ khz region
overal very good speaker fot movies. same league as Tannoy Kensington GR, or even better. in emotional perspective.
so all supravoxes are good, but i now will try TQWT enclosure with 215-200EXC field coils

 

[Staudio]

RTF i did not listenet. but i had in my apartmends supravox BAHIA with 215 S bic.
very soft romantic sound...internal cabling was terrible,and cheap. instaled jupirter copper in cotton 1.5mm. sound was more precize not so soft and wooly. jupiter cable mod was ideal. also improved 10+ khz region
overal very good speaker fot movies. same league as Tannoy Kensington GR, or even better. in emotional perspective.
so all supravoxes are good, but i now will try TQWT enclosure with 215-200EXC field coils

I had an idea to to build 2 or 3-way speaker system and to use 165 GMF with ribbon twitter for this purpose (4-6 kHz crossower).
What amplification do you use with supravoxes?

 

[Lowrideris]

I had an idea to to build 2 or 3-way speaker system and to use 165 GMF with ribbon twitter for this purpose (4-6 kHz crossower).
What amplification do you use with supravoxes?

tube amp with 300b .Single endet.

 

[Lowrideris]

You're welcome!

I used the 10 V specs.

Hmm, 26 m^2 is a plenty big enough room acoustically, but its bass output is way too much for an apartment unless extremely well soundproofed as a stereo pair are theoretically capable of up to nearly 120 dB/m/40 Hz/10 W depending on where they are positioned in the room.

I am not set up to do drawings, just quick sims in Hornresp.

Re smallest cab size; the pioneers didn't need to reproduce anything below ~80 Hz and from long experience designing/building for apartment or similar attached homes, neither do you, though you still need a tuning to at least the mid 40s in room same as they did, though for different reasons.

Anyway, they came to the conclusion that the driver's compliance [Vas] will dictate, determining that a sealed box should raise the driver's Fs by 1.56x, which BTW is the historically correct way to measure the Vas spec, so based on published specs, this equates to Vas/1.44 = 32.36 L net.

Unfortunately, this is too small to make a decent height MLTL, so looking at Scott's 80 L and converting it to a shortened MLTL to be more like Supravox's new Kelia, then rounding down to even numbers gives us a ~77.84 L net.

H = 122 cm
W = 29 cm
D = 22 cm
driver down 25.4 cm, putting the driver/floor distance = 98.5 cm
driver down 42.6 cm, putting the driver/floor distance = 81.3 cm
driver down 51.2 cm, putting the driver/floor distance = 72.7 cm
vent down = 103.7 cm
vent = 300 cm^2 x baffle thickness [19 mm]

Choose the driver/floor height you think will work best for you at the listening position, though with the top most driver location theoretically producing a ~5 dB peak centered at ~100 Hz with a ~40 Hz F10 and ~ 22 Hz F25 where you can't hear/feel it though these numbers theoretically drop ~ a dB or two with each lower driver location and may need extra internal damping if corner loaded.

The small TQWT will perform similar to top most driver location, but with a lot of added 'ripple' [deep notches in the response] unless heavily damped, so from mine and some other forum members experiences, the shorter MLTL is much preferred and no doubt in my mind why Supravox is now offering them.

GM

hi GM, can you clarify for me, what is inside this enclosure? emty like bass reflex, just with port. or inside is sometging like TQWT ? example picture would be nice. thanks.

 

[GM]

Greets!

Correct, it is a high aspect ratio version of a reflex, which due to 1/4 WL pipe horn resonances damps the vent enough to either make it larger and/or shorter for a given reflex tuning or one can use this extra vent efficiency to lower tuning some. As such, we want any bracing to allow maximum vertical airflow.

GM

 

[GM]

tube amp with 300b .Single endet.

Hmm, is this going to be used? If so, then all of the posted cab designs will technically be way too small, which my recent one already is, though by how much will depend on its output impedance [damping factor/DF].

GM

 

[Lowrideris]

Hmm, is this going to be used? If so, then all of the posted cab designs will technically be way too small, which my recent one already is, though by how much will depend on its output impedance [damping factor/DF].

GM

what do you mean by "too small" and what enclosure size has to do with amplifier damping factor??
my amp has feedback on/off switch, so damping factor can by changed,but i prefer no feedback.

 

[GM]

Net volume [Vb] will increase since any added series resistance 'weakens' the motor [raises Qts], which also ideally requires a lower tuning, though with a high output impedance, max bass efficiency requires tuning to the driver's actual Fs: Qts' = Qts + any added series resistance: mh-audio.nl - Home

GM

 

[Lowrideris]

ok. so this speaker no more fits to calculated enclosure ? new qts is about 0.67

 

[GM]

With no FB? I mean just adding the typical 1/2 ohm for wiring increases it to 0.684, which I automatically account for in all my sims.

GM