Need help to choose a new driver

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Hi !

I listen to fostex for 20 years and I shall like trying an other brand .I have never had the opportunity to listen to something else except for two or three disappointing tries with Monacor .
I have difficulty in choosing between Markaudio, TangBand, ScansPeak etc .The choice is enormous !
I look for a FR between 10 and 13 cm size. I shall like that it is usable in one of the following enclosure (actual driver) : Bib (fe108ez/ff125), Suzy Chang (fe103sol), 13 L BassReflex tuned at 55 HZ (ff125wk).
My budget is limited to approximately 150 dollars for the pair.

Thank you in advance for your invaluable advice !

Guillaume
 
Depends on what results you're hoping to achieve. My automatic recommendation in the 4in driver bracket is the Alpair 7.3. Slightly more expensive, but (to a point) you get what you pay for. They aren't designed in the same way as, say, one of Scan's wideband mids, nor do they behave in the same way, but the results are generally good and they're fairly flexible in alignment terms. It's been a little while since I heard Tang Band's W4-2142 but as I recall, they're a decent unit also, so worth considering.
 
Thanks !
The CHR70, PLUVIA and 7.3 are drivers that I looked.
I find that they have interesting characteristics especially for their low FS, High Xmax but the issue for me is their low efficiency who exclude the use of a low power SE amp.
Is there some big differences in quality between pluvia and chr70 ? I've read somewhere that they are close.

Guillaume
 
I don't think you mentioned the SE amp - that could alter the calculus a bit. Exactly how much power are you talking about, and how large is the room?

FWIW, when Dave & I first started playing with various MA drivers a few years ago, the sensitivity of the 70mm class did cause us some concern compared to say Fostex FE126E or FE127 which were are main go-to drivers. But I personally found the MA - especially the A7.3 generally delivered deeper extension and - to use audiotweak speak - more finely resolved low level detail, and were less fatiguing over extended listening. I've used the A7.3 with amps ranging from 2A3, EL84 & 34s configured as SET, and the wonderful ACA, to various class T /D amps up to 60 W, and am currently running them as mid-tweets in a big MTM in my home theater rig. Onkyo receiver with something like 100-ish - it's a game in itself trying to figure out exactly how much to derate the power specs for the actual operating conditions. I mean who buys a 7.1 receiver to only use it in 2-channel mode? .

It's been a while since I've heard the CHR70.3, but from my recollection, there was something a bit too brittle / strident - something I didn't feel with the Pluvia 7 ( in FH3)
 

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Thank you for your post !

I have several amplifiers which go from 3 watts to 50 watts, thus a low efficiency is not redhibitory, i have several possibilities.
I listen to music mainly in my living room at low or medium volume.
My room is L-shaped and measures 65 m2. The room is very reverberating. I listen to fe108ez bibs in corner (living room = width 5.5m) and klipsch RF82 with a 15 watt tube amp (sipp el34) or with an FX-AUDIO FDA .
I use the tubes less often for reasons of energy saving and especially to preserve my EL34 Mullard of the good times (70's)!
My second listen room is my home studio. The main amp is a full tweaked TPA3116 between 15 and 30 watts (8/4 ohms).
The FR's are FF125wk in 13L BR (with a notch to eliminate the 7khz peak) as monitor and suzy chang with fe103 sol to listen to music on CD.
I listen to music much stronger in the home studio. The room is very little reverberant (22 m2) and there is an acoustic treatment and a lot of furniture.
I need more power so.
I have two projets of SE amp, one 300B (reassembly) and one loftin and white 2a3. I have all the components and soon the time to mount all this.
So I can choose an alpair 7.3 and I will see later which place it will take.You are several to advise me this speaker, I will not think about it any longer !
I am French and I do not speak English fluently. I confess I'm not sure I understood your post entire well...
Could you explain simply what's you mean with:
"fostex FE126E or FE127 which were are main go-to drivers" --> you mean natural or principle choice ?
"the wonderful ACA " --> ?
"something like 100-ish" --> 100 watts ?

Guillaume

edit : "more finely resolved low level detail, and were less fatiguing over extended listening" is my principle concern .
 
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Does your driver need to be that small. The Beyma full range speakers 8,10,12 inch sound quite good in my opinion in sealed enclosures but the 12 inch, 12ga50 needs some lpad attenuation/eq in the mid and treble to reduce the harshness.

I have been meaning to order the new 3 inch Beyma full range to see what that sounds like. I will post when I have some delivered and put them through their paces.
 
Oh goody I can plug two of my favorite drivers! Faital Pro 4fe is a great driver and inexpensive. And at 5" the Tang Band w5-1611 fits the bill and does everything well (the w5-2143 does also, it has a paper cone, I have a preference for the 1611's PP cone). The w5 gets a lot of good press and like all drivers some bad as well. Some say it is shouty, others too smooth, not detailed and shy at the top end. I don't think so. The top end is just about spot on, the mid range very lushious and it's never been shouty in a bad way. I will agree with one reviewer that said it really shines when turned up a little. I've heard sounds come out of this thing and gone running into the room thinking the speaker was going to be laying on the floor in parts the sound was so lifelike, maybe 3 dimensional, rowdy, (insert your favorite adjective here) only to find it humming along just fine. Whatever it was it was very cool.
 
killmister:

looks like I may have picked up more of the habit of obscurity from long term exposure to Planet10 than I thought :D

-Fostex FE126 and 127 ; before the CSS FR125 and Mark Audio drivers -starting with the EL70 which was an OEM for Bob Reimer, those two Fostex, and the Realistic 40-1197 ( FE103) were our most commonly used full-range drivers.
- The "wonderful ACA" - refers to the Nelson Pass designed Amp-Camp Amp design - for which DIY Audio store has a very easy to build kit . A very nice sounding 5 watts of Class A

Amp Camp Amp Kit – diyAudio Store

An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.


-"Something like 100ish " - yes, that's watts per channel. The sorta joke being that with surround sound receivers, the power ratings are "interesting" to translate into actual real word application. My Onkyo is either:
1) North American:
135W minimum continuous per channel, 8 ohms 2 channels driven from 20Hz-20kHz at .08% THD, ( FTC)
or
2) Others
7x180W at 6 ohms , 1kHz, 1 channel driven 1% ( IEC)
or
3) Asian
7 x 230W at ohms, 1kHz, 1 channel (JEITA)

but wait, there's more!:
4) Dynamic Power. IEC 60268 Short term maximum output power:
300W (3 ohms, Front)
250W (4 ohms, Front)
150W (8 ohms, Front)

$hit like that drives me crazy - pick the most conservative measurement standard that applies to how it is most likely to be used :soapbox:

rant over


We're all likely to have a short list of favorite drivers, and as far as full-range models go, mine is certainly populated mostly with Mark Audio models - the A7.3 and MAOP at the top . Of the several TangBands I've heard, the 1611 has excellent bass for its size and was perhaps a bit bland in the upper mids to top, but certainly did nothing untoward. I can't say that for all models of Fostex.
 
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IF you go for a Firstwatt Amp Diy..Any of them.
Which in the erm.. more advanced than ACA versions (which is Great, but mostly a Taste tester) .. are truly excellent gizmos by Any yardstick.
Note tho that then one's drivers are The bottleneck ;)
Plan accordingly.
 
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@CHRISB : Ok, i understand better ! Thanks for precisions !.
I did not know this Nelson Pass's amplifier.

The TB 1611 interests me :

Power 28W
Sensitivity : 90dB
FS : 60 hz
QTS : 0.44
Xmax : 3mm
Price 65 € /each
Phase plug

It seems to be a very good candidate for my needs and my budget !
 
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The 1611 is a good unit of its type. While it's lacking a bit in outright resolution (not uncommon for polypropylene cones due to the high level of self-damping many have) it doesn't do anything annoying either, which is no bad thing at all. It does tend to need a little power to 'wake up', although the ACA kit should do fine if you're not expecting live 'Motorhead' SPLs. ;)

Hmm. An (unrelated) evil idea is now brewing in my mind...
 
I know there'll be others who've already posted in this thread that will disagree with my assessment of the 1611, but having heard both the Fostex models, I'd suggest that the A10P would be closer to the tonality and resolution of the 108Ez, and that for even more detail that the 10.3 should be on anyone's short list.

However, depending on just how loud your loud is compared to mine (90dB in 340ft^2 moderately damped room) , it could be a stretch for many FR units smaller than 8" to attain levels matching what the Klipschs can deliver with an amp such as the ACA.

Something like Pi Speakers - three Pi loudspeaker performance data might be a better fit?
 
Perhaps you might have a look/listen to the emspeakers made down in Beziers (southern France) - they make a 5" driver but the pick of them, IMO, for FR is the 8" (LB8exII) for small diameter drivers

The Audio Nirvana 8" is also a quite remarkably low distortion driver too - quite a surprising bass response considering their low Qt. I understand their 6" driver has similar characteristics but doesn't go as far down in the bass

You really need to have a listen for yourself as one man's magic sound will be atrocious for another, especially if the room acoustics are 'challenging'
 
I find the tone a bit unbalanced on the 108ez as is. At first on the bibs, I did'nt put much stuff to get more mediums at the mouth. I turned around for a moment before taking the problem in the opposite direction. I ended up by putting a notch that attenuated about 3/4 dB from 2.5 khz to 10 khz, added stuff, and I finally found a satisfactory balance and I appreciate much more the good definition of this little driver. Even if I find that they go honorably low, the bass are sometimes very confused if i push too hard the volume. It depends on the style of music and instruments.
I'm not looking to get a high efficiency and spl's like klipsch but just a comfortable listening level. That's the case with my bibs and i'm surprised by their capacity of sound level. but....

I looked at the alpair 10.3 and the lb80 EMS. They are too wide for my speakers (max 13cm) and they are too expensive: alpair 10.3 149 € and LB80: 360 € ! Ouch.!! :eek:

I have already tried a wider speaker: fostex fe167e in mltl à la B.Brines FT1600 : Not bad but poor power handling because the membrane stirred too much with bass and the whizzer cone is too noticeable from a certain level.

Compared to all your advices and remarks, it would be better that I wait to have a bigger budget and offer me two alpair 10 or EMS LB80 or FE168EZ (oh no, it's still and always Fostex :D)?
But it will also be necessary that I rebuild a new pair of enclosure.

Edit : Audio Nirvana's are still in production ?
 
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