No, I meant - were you going to run the woofers in a sealed or vented cabinet?
As mentioned earlier, have a look at the Scan-Speak Discovery units. B&O use woofers from that range for their top-of-the-range multi-faceted loudspeaker.
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I really would not bother with a subwoofer if you can afford 2 Eikonas/channel. In an appropriate MLTL cabinet 2 Eikonas easily out-performs most 10" subs for extension and quality and you have the advantage of full integration/stereo. I have both single Eikona speakers crossed over with MJ Acoustics Sub and the twin MLTL's and the latter knocks spots off the former in every aspect! Everybody who has heard also agrees!
Hi Colin,
well, I was not "locked" on sealed vs vented cabinet. I guess I thought that I'd find a woofer first and then consider what would be best (sealed or vented) for that particular woofer. What should come first, the chicken or the egg?
Hi Kevin,
thanks for your comment.
To clarify, I was not going for a single subwoofer, but one woofer for each channel. If I understand you correctly, then I am not sacrificing anything in relation to "full integration/stereo", then?
However, your point about double Eikonas intrigue me. Can you shed some light on what you consider to be "appropriate MLTL" cabinet for this, please? How are the twin Eikonas for each speaker set up - serial or parallel with feeding on the same signal with no crossover, or?
Depending on style of music, volume level et cetera, do you not see any drawbacks to twin Eikonas compared to a single Eikona + woofer? Remember that I intend to use a DSP and a monoblock power amp for each driver. And I like to have superdeep bass and music at high volumes, mind you
Thanks for your input.
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Hi perceval,
I want to use some Audiovector 4 cabinets that I have. See post 15
http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/full...cs-f-s-t-jordan-eikona-2-a-2.html#post4843123
for link to a photo. They are about 125liters/4.5 cubic feet. Really nice hexagonal cabinets in some kind of supposedly "dead" composite material. I wanted to put on a new baffle (to cover the original 3 driver holes) and work with that.
Thanks for your comments.
Hi Elway,
The size of your listening space is a good question, most importantly the longest dimension, as this will govern the bass depth possible. When you say you like deep bass - are you sure you really like 25Hz bass because of the sound or the 'feel' don't forget this is the frequency most likely to resonate the gut so making you rush to the loo (yes its true).
So you do get better integration with just Eikonas? - yes, you bet, if the alternative is a crossover. You also get impeccable phase response.
In a modest sized floorstander cabinet you are looking at a -6db point of around 27 Hz (on paper), as long as your room will cater for this. Contrary to some advice I have found lossely stuffing the whole cabinet (but particular attention to behind the drivers) gives incredibly fast and insightful bass and enough volume to begin to shake the room. The cabinet should be tuned to around 27Hz (with stuffing), depending on dimensions.
Run the drivers in series or parallel, full range. I do also use baffle step compensation so parallel use still gives a sensible impedance.
I prsonally prefer an adjustable tweeter as well but some don't and if you can adjust it down to zero all the better. Of course you need a capacitor on the tweeter.
The size of your listening space is a good question, most importantly the longest dimension, as this will govern the bass depth possible. When you say you like deep bass - are you sure you really like 25Hz bass because of the sound or the 'feel' don't forget this is the frequency most likely to resonate the gut so making you rush to the loo (yes its true).
So you do get better integration with just Eikonas? - yes, you bet, if the alternative is a crossover. You also get impeccable phase response.
In a modest sized floorstander cabinet you are looking at a -6db point of around 27 Hz (on paper), as long as your room will cater for this. Contrary to some advice I have found lossely stuffing the whole cabinet (but particular attention to behind the drivers) gives incredibly fast and insightful bass and enough volume to begin to shake the room. The cabinet should be tuned to around 27Hz (with stuffing), depending on dimensions.
Run the drivers in series or parallel, full range. I do also use baffle step compensation so parallel use still gives a sensible impedance.
I prsonally prefer an adjustable tweeter as well but some don't and if you can adjust it down to zero all the better. Of course you need a capacitor on the tweeter.
Forgot so say using two drivers rather than one gives you 4 times the bass efficiency and double the power handling. You also get better imaging at distance but of course you need a bigger cabinet (twice the volume realistically). It also affords a lower tuning frequency. Stuffing the cabinet reduces the tuning frequency even more. (by as much as 6 Hz infact)
Hi Kevin, thanks for your input.
I confess that I have a hard time defining in Hz what bass I am looking for. I do not listen to dubstep, techno and such, but rather pop, rock, r&b, etc. All I can say is, that I want them to go deep. I recently auditioned a set of JBL L100 - that was not enough....
Thank for clarifying that you run Eikonas in parallel without XO. A passive XO is what I wanted to avoid in the first place. And also avoid DSP XO'ing in the mid range, but between woofer and mid.
Anybody else in this fine forum want to weigh in on twin fullrangers in one cabinet vs F.A.S.T (fullrange + woofer XO'ed low and active)?? Is the Eikona 2 the only fullranger that could be considered as twin as described by Kevin suggests, instead of F.A.S.T? Or could the same argument be made for TangBands (W8), Alpair (7 or 10), or other fullrange drivers?
Kevin, I'd love to see photos of your twin setup!
Many thanks - I appreciate the input.
EDIT - I forgot to mention that my listening space is around 28 sq meters/300 sq feet. Small living room with open kitchen layout. Unfortunately, sofas pretty close to the speakers - I can place the fullrangers to be above "sofa level", but probably not any woofers.
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Yes - I have considered one of the Scan-Speak Discovery units - se my post here: http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/full...pecs-f-s-t-jordan-eikona-2-a.html#post4842446 - it is the Scan-Speak Discovery 26W/4558T00
However, another forum member has expressed concern that the xmax/excursion of that particular Scan-Speack unit may be a bit on the short side, and recommended a longer excursion. The SB Acoustics woofer mentioned in post #18 by user Mayhem13 (http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/full...cs-f-s-t-jordan-eikona-2-a-2.html#post4843975) appear to have great specs including pretty long excursion. If you still think that Scan-Speak has better option, please elaborate further.
Thanks.
Hi - Both those drivers look pretty good. Regarding excursion, it depends on how low and loud you want to go. Most of the energy in music which we hear as bass is actually in the 80-120Hz range, unless you are listening to some of the other genres you mention. That would seem to fit in with what the JBL L100 covers, as far as I can see. I'm using a two Eikona system (Aurora 800) which goes down to 50Hz and most of the time don't use the attached sub but do engage it for movies and some classical works.
Kevin Warne's MLTL design is tuned lower than the speakers I'm using. There are MLTL designs on our site which also work well and doubling them up isn't difficult if you wish to use two drivers rather than a single unit plus separate bass driver.
If you're restricted on space, a single Eikona system with a separate powered sub gives a lot of flexibility and restricts the crossover to the sub, leaving the main speakers unfiltered.
Kevin Warne's MLTL design is tuned lower than the speakers I'm using. There are MLTL designs on our site which also work well and doubling them up isn't difficult if you wish to use two drivers rather than a single unit plus separate bass driver.
If you're restricted on space, a single Eikona system with a separate powered sub gives a lot of flexibility and restricts the crossover to the sub, leaving the main speakers unfiltered.
A cost efficient alternative might also be this one: Subwoofer
I've built two of them and they work really well. I drive them with a modified (new ventilation) Behringer iNuke 3000 DSP. I also used them with the EAD 100 speaker : https://zimmer64.wordpress.com/2013/10/16/cabinet-re-build-of-my-e100-vtl/
Michael
I've built two of them and they work really well. I drive them with a modified (new ventilation) Behringer iNuke 3000 DSP. I also used them with the EAD 100 speaker : https://zimmer64.wordpress.com/2013/10/16/cabinet-re-build-of-my-e100-vtl/
Michael
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