Frugel-Horn Lite for 3" drivers

Dave, I have some questions related to the build:
- I have 7mm cotton felt damping material, should I double up to bring it close to the specified 12mm, or 7mm is okay?
- I am planning to chamfer the driver cutout. Looking at the material, is it better to use supra baffle?
- What is the recommended starting point for stuffing under the driver for use with TC9FD?
Thank you so much - so excited to finish this.
 
frugal-phile™
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A good question. How close to the floor do the windows reach? The glass will certainly be more transparent to the bass than a solid wall.

We have gotten away with 42” high fake walls of our back deck, so with a bit less damping and closer to the wall you will likely be OK. Depends somewhat on the driver used.

dave
 
frugal-phile™
Joined 2001
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I haven’t heard it, but the FE88ex i have and it is. The FE85 is used as a midTweeter in some expensive commercail WAWs, so one would hope is closer to its sibling, than to the VIFA. The TG9 is another upgrade. I liked the Aura NS3 as well, those live on as Dayton branded product now. Not necessarily exactly the same: Dayton Audio ND90-4 3-1/2" Aluminum Cone Full-Range Neo Driver 4 Ohm

The best drivers we have heard are FF85wk and Alpair 5.2 (or FF85wKeN/A5.2eN), one i’d really like to hear is the Audience A3 (unobtainium). Haven’t heard them in FH-Lite but i fully expect Alpair 6.2m/p kick *** too.

There are tons of 3-3.5” drivers out there that i haven’t heard but i am leary of trumpeting others enthusiasm after our TC9 experience.

dave
 
Greetings all, well, this afternoon I finished sanding the curvy, Baltic birch sides of my current FHL project. The curly maple veneer is patiently waiting its turn in the build process.

I have a wee bit of a dilemma... After reading Musiklava's excellent experience (below) I am rethinking my driver choice. I had decided on the TB w3-2141 but am now leaning toward the MA 5.2 (or wait a few months for the soon available MA 5.3)

"Comparison between two excellent drivers is always difficult and it’s no different here. I don’t have any instruments for measuring the differences so I relied on my ears. The Frugel-Horn Lites were initially designed with the Fostex FF85WK drivers in mind and hence they will remain the yardstick for driver comparisons. Both the FF85WK and Alpair 5.2 drivers stand out with their own characteristics and features. They sound smooth and even through the frequency range. However, the Alpairs have better bass extension and over-all sound warm and laid-back, much like what I heard with the TB W3-2141 drivers, only the former sound better. The FF85WKs are more forward sounding which some may find irksome after listening for a while.

Let me re-cap like this –

Fostex FF85WK – Suitable for serious, detailed and critical listening but not for prolonged periods.
MA Alpair 5.2 – Put on some good music and relax with some refreshments and your favourite libation. Prepare for an enjoyable session of listening!" -Musiklava


I have the MA 7.3 in FH3's and know the alpairs are a solid choice. I have read many positive reviews of the TB W3 and wanted to give it a go... I still might... any thoughts are welcome. Musiklava, can you share any more comparisons between the TB and the Alpair?


Pete
 
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Greetings all, well, this afternoon I finished sanding the curvy, Baltic birch sides of my current FHL project. The curly maple veneer is patiently waiting its turn in the build process.

I have a wee bit of a dilemma... After reading Musiklava's excellent experience (below) I am rethinking my driver choice. I had decided on the TB w3-2141 but am now leaning toward the MA 5.2 (or wait a few months for the soon available MA 5.3)

.....

I have the MA 7.3 in FH3's and know the alpairs are a solid choice. I have read many positive reviews of the TB W3 and wanted to give it a go... I still might... any thoughts are welcome. Musiklava, can you share any more comparisons between the TB and the Alpair?

Pete

Hi Pete,

I'm glad that you're building the Frugel Horn Lites.

You'll have to create some room to accomodate the large TB W3 motor, perhaps by using a sub-baffle or removable baffle of appropriate thickness. I had a tough time finding the correct quantity of front dampening to get some low end that suited my taste. After several attempts I simply gave up as I felt it wasn't worth the time and effort and reverted to the Alpair 5.2s.

The TB W3s are good-sounding drivers in the right enclosures, in my opinion, but they're not suited to the FHLs.

ML
 
Musiklava, Thanks for sharing your experience here... I think I will follow your lead and go with Mark Audio. Madisound will hopefully have the gold/copper 5.3's in soon, giving me time to make some headway on the enclosures.

Maybe I will try the TB w3 2141 in a future build, in a different plan.

Pete
 
Member
Joined 2005
Paid Member
Long time member, first time posting!!

Thank you folks for making these plans available. I built a pair of FHLs this summer. My first speaker build ever. Using FF85WK drivers.

A very enjoyable build and lovely to hear. Not much to look at right now as we ran out of good weather, so finishing will have to wait until spring.

One of the fun aspects of this project was clamping the boxes together at each stage of the build and hearing the change in tone at each stage from basic box to damping felt to stuffing to glued and sealed up.

On a whim, rather than outriggers (which would be awkward in my current home office), I cut 4" x 15" x 1/4" steel "stands", which are affixed to the bases of the boxes with a layer of cork between the box and stand. There is no science to this. I just saw some parts lying around my shop and thought it seemed like an interesting idea not unlike the heavy shot-filled steel stands for my Spendors. Haven't decided whether it was a good idea yet, but playing lots of good music in the meantime.

Again, thank you. Cheers
 
Finally finished my FHLites. I followed Musiklava's experience-based suggestion and fitted them with the Mark Audio drivers... glad I did. These Alpair 5.3's sound wonderful!

FHL 5.3A.jpg


I don't have any measurement to offer, just my subjective comparisons and opinions, using my 62 year-old ears. My listening was in a 16x18 ft bedroom w/ 9 ft ceiling, using an unsophisticated Blu-ray player, feeding an old, but good, Pioneer integrated amp.

Several years ago I built a pair of "Baby Labyrinths" (loosely based on the "Red-eye" baby lab) and fitted them with the Peerless 830987. I really like this combination... the 830987 has good detail and the baby lab adds nice, balanced bass. It's not an apples-to apples comparison... a back-loaded FHL versus a small labyrinth, each stuffed/damped differently however, the 830987 and the Alpair 5.3 are the same size and both have metal cones and inverted surrounds. Relative to the baby lab 830987, the FHL5.3 had noticeably more clarity and detail. Guitar, violin, piano, snare-drum, and James Taylor's voice each sounded wonderful and clear, without sounding overly bright. For 3" drivers, both have a surprizing amount of bass. My FHL5.3 had slightly less bass than my baby lab. The Double bass instrument was audible but subdued. The FHL5.3 had enough volume to groove to but started distorting at a lower volume than the baby lab 830987.

Comparing my FHL5.3 to my FH3 7.3's, the 7.3's sound fuller/richer but they share the detailed signature.

Being a bit narrower than the FH3's, the FHL's are looking for an opportunity to get knocked over so I put some feet on mine.

Thank you Scott, Dave, and Chris for designing and sharing another great speaker... the FHL's are a keeper!

Pete
 

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