)
If the hole is atready cut, a big rasp with a curved surface is the quick & nasty way to relieve the back, but Chris always releaved the back of outr cutouts with a routher and a 45° bit.
If you don’t do it, you could well suffer some of the midrange cuppiness with voices in particular.
dave
If you don’t do it, you could well suffer some of the midrange cuppiness with voices in particular.
dave
Thanks Dave. We haven't noticed any "cuppiness" so far (the boxes are already built and I've been listening in my office for a couple months now).
But this is good to know for future tweaking. I'm not above building another, better set having learned from the first-time-around process. I'd incorporate a removable speaker baffle next time, too.
These are really lovely speakers. I'd be totally satisfied stopping here, but now I've caught the speaker building bug, so... more building I guess. lol
But this is good to know for future tweaking. I'm not above building another, better set having learned from the first-time-around process. I'd incorporate a removable speaker baffle next time, too.
These are really lovely speakers. I'd be totally satisfied stopping here, but now I've caught the speaker building bug, so... more building I guess. lol
Previous speakers were Spendor SP2/2. They're still wired up as the B speakers for occasional comparison, but I've been listening to them less and less. About to go down into the basement to make room in my office.
Rest of the kit is:
VPI HW-19 Mk III > Morch UP4 > Benz Glider
Magnavox CDB 460 recapped with Nichicon Muse KZ
Magnavox CDB 460 recapped with Elna Silimic II + OPA2132
Nakamichi SR-2A Stasis reciever
It's not the most neutral or revealing setup I've owned, but it's revealing enough to hear what's going on as I restore and modify these old CD players.
What I'm hearing I really like. Compared to the Spendors, the mid frequencies on the FHL are more detailed and I definitely think the FHL goes higher. The Spendors don't go any lower (I measured), but the FHL has better detail in, say, kick drums and electric bass.
They really are far more revealing than the Spendors. I think the Nak deserves more respect than I would have given it a few months ago. I can hear pretty minute details between the two otherwise identical CD players I'm futzing with.
If I had a complaint, it's that they can go a bit bright and relentless on certain recordings. Not in a shouty way, but in a just a bit too much way if you follow my meaning. However, I'm still moving things about in my office and experimenting with placement, and the office itself could use some acoustic softening. A future project.
The bottom line is that it's fun to listen to music with these speakers. That's the most important thing really.
I hope this is useful, as I really never developed a vocabulary to discuss what I'm hearing.
Rest of the kit is:
VPI HW-19 Mk III > Morch UP4 > Benz Glider
Magnavox CDB 460 recapped with Nichicon Muse KZ
Magnavox CDB 460 recapped with Elna Silimic II + OPA2132
Nakamichi SR-2A Stasis reciever
It's not the most neutral or revealing setup I've owned, but it's revealing enough to hear what's going on as I restore and modify these old CD players.
What I'm hearing I really like. Compared to the Spendors, the mid frequencies on the FHL are more detailed and I definitely think the FHL goes higher. The Spendors don't go any lower (I measured), but the FHL has better detail in, say, kick drums and electric bass.
They really are far more revealing than the Spendors. I think the Nak deserves more respect than I would have given it a few months ago. I can hear pretty minute details between the two otherwise identical CD players I'm futzing with.
If I had a complaint, it's that they can go a bit bright and relentless on certain recordings. Not in a shouty way, but in a just a bit too much way if you follow my meaning. However, I'm still moving things about in my office and experimenting with placement, and the office itself could use some acoustic softening. A future project.
The bottom line is that it's fun to listen to music with these speakers. That's the most important thing really.
I hope this is useful, as I really never developed a vocabulary to discuss what I'm hearing.
Music that's been in heavy rotation lately as I mess around with these speakers and the CD players...
King Crimson - Beat (Requiem is one of my benchmark tracks)
Emmylou Harris - Wrecking Ball and Spyboy
American Jazz Orchestra + Benny Carter - Central City Sketches
Brahms - Geistliche Chormusik (RIAS-Kammerchor + Marcus Creed, Harmonia Mundi France)
De La Soul - Stakes is High (particularly the title track, produced by Dilla)
Everything but the Girl - Walking Wounded
Tony Rice Unit - Acoustics
Admittedly have been focused so much on the CDPs that I haven't played a lot of LPs lately. Should probably get on that.
King Crimson - Beat (Requiem is one of my benchmark tracks)
Emmylou Harris - Wrecking Ball and Spyboy
American Jazz Orchestra + Benny Carter - Central City Sketches
Brahms - Geistliche Chormusik (RIAS-Kammerchor + Marcus Creed, Harmonia Mundi France)
De La Soul - Stakes is High (particularly the title track, produced by Dilla)
Everything but the Girl - Walking Wounded
Tony Rice Unit - Acoustics
Admittedly have been focused so much on the CDPs that I haven't played a lot of LPs lately. Should probably get on that.
I have a friend with 3 of those — 1 just a power amp (& phono pre — something inbetween blew up bad).
Haven’t gotten a chance to borrow one yet (he has just recapped one, that is the one i want to listen to).
dave
I'd definitely buy another SR-XA (or TR version) if I came across one. Bought this one as a temporary system when I had to return a British Fidelity amp and NYAL phono pre lent by a friend, but hadn't finished my next amp project.... well it's been more than 10 years of DIY audio on hiatus and the Nak is still going strong.
With a little luck I'll have a LM1875 chipamp running in a few weeks, and maybe we'll be able to mix things up a little.
Back to speakers...
As a next project, if I don't take another whack at a FHL, I'd been reading through the thread on the BabyLabs/Lance TL design can considering building one. I do like the FF85wk and it looks like a straightforward build. Open to suggestions.
With a little luck I'll have a LM1875 chipamp running in a few weeks, and maybe we'll be able to mix things up a little.
Back to speakers...
As a next project, if I don't take another whack at a FHL, I'd been reading through the thread on the BabyLabs/Lance TL design can considering building one. I do like the FF85wk and it looks like a straightforward build. Open to suggestions.
So I am in the process of building a pair of FH Lites, intended for a pair of FaitalPro 3FE25's I have. Just wondering about damping/stuffing. I have some pillow stuffing I can stuff with, but for lining the walls around the back of the driver I have some fibreglass acoustic ceiling tiles. These things are 15mm thick, and very absorbent. Should I cut them a bit thinner? Maybe even less than 12mm because they are so absorbent? Are they too absorbent? Basically you put your ear up next to them and you can hear them sucking sound out of the air...
For the stuffing, is 24g the amount to use for this driver? I am hoping to squeeze a bunch of bass out of the 3FE25, but not make it too boomy...
Any advice appreciated.
For the stuffing, is 24g the amount to use for this driver? I am hoping to squeeze a bunch of bass out of the 3FE25, but not make it too boomy...
Any advice appreciated.
I don’t know how many FHL have been done with the small Faitals but i expect damping will be simialr to the FF85/A5.2. But that still does not take into consideration your room, placement, the specific properties of the damping material being used, and what you like to hear. You will still have to play. Usually half of what is specified in the plans is a good place to start.
Do tease it very well.
Do tease it very well.
Thanks David. Here are some pics of the finished articles. Hope everyone is nice about them, because I am inordinately proud of the veneer finish I managed to achieve with what was actually a scrap piece of ply panelling from a friend that had obviously been used for protecting something from wet concrete...
I built these because I am a big fan of the FaitalPro 3FE22/3FE25, and I saw a comment from David somewhere on the forum that if you want the most bass out of these drivers, put them in a Frugel Horn Lite. I have to say that they do give more bass than my other enclosures (TABAQs) which is to be expected from a horn, I guess, but they also seem to do a better job of taming the rising high end response of the FaitalPros, which surprised me. I have a sub running with them, but I often turn it off, because for a lot of my music the bass from the FHLs is enough. The overall response is so smooth, even without a BSC. In the TABAQs, the Faitals are still a little shrill, even against the wall. This is just listening impressions, I haven't done any measuring or simulating...but I am really enjoying these speakers.
Attachments
Hmm, I had to look again at the pictures, and then I realised they are taken from some funny angles, because the speakers are actually are the standard design with the 5° backwards tilt. It is hard to tell. It's another reason I like them, because they are shooting right at you at the listening position.
Hello everyone,
I have a spare pair of the TB W3-2141 and a spare pair of the Fountek FR88EX. Both of these drivers are very good in certain enclosures, but I am unsure which one would be better in the Frugal Horn Lite. I have heard that the W3 has some issues (especially with clearance) but I have heard nothing about the FR88EX. I've seen that the FE85 does work very well with the Frugal Lite, but I do not know how different the FR88EX will behave.
Also, I am not too interested in bass under 800 Hz, as this will be handled by a woofer, but I am very interested in the sound frequencies above this.
Can anyone shed any light on this?
Thanks in advance.
I have a spare pair of the TB W3-2141 and a spare pair of the Fountek FR88EX. Both of these drivers are very good in certain enclosures, but I am unsure which one would be better in the Frugal Horn Lite. I have heard that the W3 has some issues (especially with clearance) but I have heard nothing about the FR88EX. I've seen that the FE85 does work very well with the Frugal Lite, but I do not know how different the FR88EX will behave.
Also, I am not too interested in bass under 800 Hz, as this will be handled by a woofer, but I am very interested in the sound frequencies above this.
Can anyone shed any light on this?
Thanks in advance.
http://www.tb-speaker.com/uploads/files/3f6d8454c5797c9abef00c12c6cf5a0d.pdf
Should work fine. A bit lower Fs and Qt are quite different than the typical FF85wk or A5.2/3 so damping requirements will have to be played with.
I have only heard the slihghly larger version of your TB, it is somewhat coloured. The FR88ex is perhaps a bit better in that respect. The FOuntek will alos work. Why not do a removeable supraBaffle and try both?
dave
Should work fine. A bit lower Fs and Qt are quite different than the typical FF85wk or A5.2/3 so damping requirements will have to be played with.
I have only heard the slihghly larger version of your TB, it is somewhat coloured. The FR88ex is perhaps a bit better in that respect. The FOuntek will alos work. Why not do a removeable supraBaffle and try both?
dave
