Hi,
almost half a year I`m enjoying CHR70 in pencil boxes. Now I`m thinking to upgrade it to Alpair 7.
Is it a big step from CHR70 or just small details?
Also how could you compare these small drivers to Alpair 10p with paper cone?
I had Fostex 206en with paper cones, I think I miss that paper midrange purity..
Please give me advices
almost half a year I`m enjoying CHR70 in pencil boxes. Now I`m thinking to upgrade it to Alpair 7.
Is it a big step from CHR70 or just small details?
Also how could you compare these small drivers to Alpair 10p with paper cone?
I had Fostex 206en with paper cones, I think I miss that paper midrange purity..
Please give me advices
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A7.3 is quite a bit better than CHR (assuming adequate support equipment), and i would say better value for the dollar.
A10p vrs A7.3 is very close. They have a different balance of strengths. A10p is not quite as extended, or as detailed (less DDR) but has greater bass impact & dyanamics, and is significantly more efficient. A10p needs a bigger box. I could be happy with either, but given my taste i still give the A7.3 the edge
dave
A10p vrs A7.3 is very close. They have a different balance of strengths. A10p is not quite as extended, or as detailed (less DDR) but has greater bass impact & dyanamics, and is significantly more efficient. A10p needs a bigger box. I could be happy with either, but given my taste i still give the A7.3 the edge
dave
Dave and others have literally dozens of designs for A7.3 - it might be better to turn the question around and ask you - "do you have a particular physical size in mind?"
And with all due respect to engineering it took Mark to achieve the performance value represented by the CHR, the Alpair7 is "cut from a much finer cloth",
now, the differences between the 10P and 7.3 is much trickier to describe - I've been living with 7s in my 5.1 system for a couple of years now, and have recently played around with 10P and 10.3 metals in the FHXL enclosure. I liked what I heard enough to get Dave to extrapolate on an earlier floorstander design for the EL70 (pictures of a couple of builds of this "trapezoid" floorstander exist somewhere hereabouts) Basically, it's a short (32") vented enclosure with 5dg slanted baffle. I brought the finished enclosures (and "matching" centre channel ) home from the shop this weekend, but won't have an opportunity to populate them with drivers until after returning from our yearly sojourn to Bermuda, in approx 2 weeks time
- so it's early to opine if they'll supplant the Pensil 7s
And with all due respect to engineering it took Mark to achieve the performance value represented by the CHR, the Alpair7 is "cut from a much finer cloth",
now, the differences between the 10P and 7.3 is much trickier to describe - I've been living with 7s in my 5.1 system for a couple of years now, and have recently played around with 10P and 10.3 metals in the FHXL enclosure. I liked what I heard enough to get Dave to extrapolate on an earlier floorstander design for the EL70 (pictures of a couple of builds of this "trapezoid" floorstander exist somewhere hereabouts) Basically, it's a short (32") vented enclosure with 5dg slanted baffle. I brought the finished enclosures (and "matching" centre channel ) home from the shop this weekend, but won't have an opportunity to populate them with drivers until after returning from our yearly sojourn to Bermuda, in approx 2 weeks time
- so it's early to opine if they'll supplant the Pensil 7s
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Great now it is clear that A7 and 10p is in the same league...
Regarding the size, you could see my listening room in pics, I have no strict requirements, I have lived with pencils for a while, it sounded good with a deep bass..Sometimes too more and slow bass..So I am considering to try something different, easy to built and nice to look. And golden ratio boxes looks very nice and unusual, they are wide with small depth, also unusual for modern speakers..I would like box design which could represent quick and accurate bass..
Any ideas?
Regarding the size, you could see my listening room in pics, I have no strict requirements, I have lived with pencils for a while, it sounded good with a deep bass..Sometimes too more and slow bass..So I am considering to try something different, easy to built and nice to look. And golden ratio boxes looks very nice and unusual, they are wide with small depth, also unusual for modern speakers..I would like box design which could represent quick and accurate bass..
Any ideas?
Let's presume that the little floorstander I mentioned in above post could be "rationalized" for the A7, that's another option as well.
As Dave noted, the "mini-onken" line was developed to deliver articulation and finesse as compared to an MLTL, or in the case of FH3 / XL, with a much smaller enclosure size. But then again, stand mounted speakers need stands, which can often cost more than the extra material required for a floorstanding enclosure, and occupy at least as much floorspace.
Did you mention how large the room is? If as small as many of the bedrooms I've occupied, the dMarKen7.3s (or whatever is the official title these days - I just build the damned things) might well suffice. Be warned that they or the 10Ps will not sugarcoat any shortcomings of upstream system or program material.
Do you use the i20's built-in DAC? Too bad about the switch to Lightning connector - does anyone know if it still passes digital audio out as did the old 30pin?
As Dave noted, the "mini-onken" line was developed to deliver articulation and finesse as compared to an MLTL, or in the case of FH3 / XL, with a much smaller enclosure size. But then again, stand mounted speakers need stands, which can often cost more than the extra material required for a floorstanding enclosure, and occupy at least as much floorspace.
Did you mention how large the room is? If as small as many of the bedrooms I've occupied, the dMarKen7.3s (or whatever is the official title these days - I just build the damned things
) might well suffice. Be warned that they or the 10Ps will not sugarcoat any shortcomings of upstream system or program material.Do you use the i20's built-in DAC? Too bad about the switch to Lightning connector - does anyone know if it still passes digital audio out as did the old 30pin?
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The lighting connector is simply a reconfiguartion required to fit the connector on slimmer iPhones/iPod Touch. There are adaptors. The unfortunate thing is the difference in licencing for the new connector.
dave
The room is about 18 m2 (squere meters). There is opinion that floorstanders is always better then bookshelf speakers? What do you think?
Space is not a problem for me here..As Chris said, small speakers with stands takes the same place as floorstanders..
Re Pure-i20, now I`m using it`s internal Dac, which is not so bad comparing to expensive Cyrus 6XPd internal dac..
Space is not a problem for me here..As Chris said, small speakers with stands takes the same place as floorstanders..
Re Pure-i20, now I`m using it`s internal Dac, which is not so bad comparing to expensive Cyrus 6XPd internal dac..
Yes, Apple does have a way of pi$$ing some folks off that way- sometimes even unintentionally, but to the question does it pass digital audio through the adapter plug or cable? Our home now has a total of 5 i-devices with a combination of old and new connectors, and 2 i20 docks, as well I'm as contemplating a measurement mic kit for one of the iPad Airs.
I generally prefer floorstanders myself, if even just for the aesthetics, although too many are optimized for maximum bass extension / weight, and lack the finesse which Dave describes as a design goal of his high aspect ratio slot port loaded enclosures, and to which I can attest. So short answer is - yes, maybe.
I was curious as to whether the Cyrus integrated in photo had a DAC . While it's not that important for me to know, I'm not sure if the i20's internal chipset has been identified anywhere - but is certainly sounds miles better than using either the headphone jack or 30 pin's analog audio line out with other docks I've tried with my 4S phone or iPod Classic.
Yes, that Cyrus had a Dac. And I could say that pure Dac is very close to it. Having the Pure price in mind it is really good
I think I will make new pencils for A7..It should be good and time proved design..
I've enjoyed mine quite a bit over the past couple of years, during which time a lot of other speakers have passed through this system for evaluation, and they don't suffer from size and placement constraints that can make for a very hard sell with "higher performing" systems such as the wide baffle Ellipse, or Facet 2-ways, or even the larger FHXL in this room -
"dear, you can do what ever you like down there, but just don't disturb the Zen minimalism, please"
FWIW, I actually think the CHR represents by far the better value. While I can certainly hear a difference between the two drivers, I first of all don't think it is that pronounced and secondly a matter of taste which one you might prefer in a certain application.
The A7 does have a bit more detail while the CHR is a bit more forgiving, but I think the latter also goes a bit lower and has better off axis behavior.
And for the same price of one A7 you could get two CHR's which will certainly be better value in all departments (lower extension, higher SPL, potentially better dispersion and less excursion of the drivers etc. all giving you even better detail than the A7).
The A7 does have a bit more detail while the CHR is a bit more forgiving, but I think the latter also goes a bit lower and has better off axis behavior.
And for the same price of one A7 you could get two CHR's which will certainly be better value in all departments (lower extension, higher SPL, potentially better dispersion and less excursion of the drivers etc. all giving you even better detail than the A7).
I personally think that the A7 is worth the price over the CHR70, but in Squeak's defense, it depends on what you are listening to, where, when and what your expectations are. It is the music, not the equipment that is important. I much prefer a piece of music well played but poorly reproduced to one well reproduced but poorly played. So, depending on your expectations, the CHR70 may well be the better value. YMMV.
Bob
Bob
Thanks for Your thoughts Bob..In general I like the feeling in music, wide and deep sound, which feels special...I was enjoying it in Fostex 206 for couple of years, after that I had several 2 - 3 way speakers, which had better bass, treble, dynamics...but they could not fill the room with music, which you feel all around you...if you know what I mean..that is why I am still searching for fullrange speakers
I enjoy playing well recorded tracks, but its nice then poorly recorded track you like plays really surprising..
Sent from my Nexus 4 using Tapatalk
I enjoy playing well recorded tracks, but its nice then poorly recorded track you like plays really surprising..
Sent from my Nexus 4 using Tapatalk
Sheesh....
The price of a pair of A7s compared to CHR70 is small compared to any competitive multiway systems. Why not just pop for the small extra price and get the A7s. Then you won't look back and second guess not getting the better drivers.
The difference in investment is mush smaller when you spread it over years of listening.
The price of a pair of A7s compared to CHR70 is small compared to any competitive multiway systems. Why not just pop for the small extra price and get the A7s. Then you won't look back and second guess not getting the better drivers.
The difference in investment is mush smaller when you spread it over years of listening.
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