12" Full Range Speaker Recomendation Help

[c208driver]

I would like to add some fidelity to the pictured cabinet (circa 1960ish) with a more modern 12" full ranch quality speaker. The speaker will be powered by a restored Heathkit integrated TUBE amp & separate tuner. The cabinet internal dimensions are 23x16x16.

My questions are:

1. Can any improvement be made to the cabinet internals?

2. Suggestions on a good full range speaker in the $400-$800/pair range? I'm looking at Audio Nirvana 12" as one option, but would like additional thoughts.

Thanks.

 

[Godzilla]

You might want to consider using a coaxial driver. Here's a link from parts express.

Coaxial Full-Range Speakers in the Speaker Components Department at Parts Express | 32 - 497|3924

You would have to add a tweeter to the back of the driver as well as a crossover that could be mounted inside the box.

The reason I suggest this is because it looks like it would be difficult to cut out a tweeter hole since you must want to preserve the fabric front.

Another option that would allow you to retain the original fabric front would be a top mounted tweeter. See the link for an example:

http://www.positive-feedback.com/Issue49/images/madisound.jpg

or

http://lonestaraudiofest.com/2007/Photos/DSCN2937.JPG

The AN driver might be a good option too but you would have to see if it would provide satisfying bass in that cabinet. The dimensions you posted result in just over 3 cubic feet. Perhaps the AN works well in this cabinet volume and is the best option?

Curious, is this going to be a mono setup or stereo?

Zilla

 

[Rev. Billy Bob]

The box looks like it has a cut out for a horn on the top of the baffle. If it were me, I'd just pick a woofer that worked well in that volume and make an econowave-type speaker.

 

[Scottmoose]

I wouldn't bet on a modern driver necessarily improving on it. Maybe, maybe not. There aren't all that many good ones out there. The ANs might be, but I've seen a pair of the 12s measure a long way off advertised spec. so YMMV. The automatic recommendation would be the Great Planes Audio built Altec Model 212-8A, but I suspect you'd need to save up a while longer. And ideally, build a box that would do proper justice to them.

As Jeff says, you might want to consider the pro-market; either a good coax or something like a big Eminence widebander with tweeter support.

Some damping in the box wouldn't go amiss.

 

[el`Ol]

A suggestion:
If you add a T35 supertweeter the sound is still in the style of the time. Maybe it's better to use EV drivers for the fullrange section, too. AFAIK they have a much higher reputation than the Lafayette drivers. 12" drivers usually need a supertweeter even with whizzer.

 

[gafhenderson]

The only good 12" full range driver is the EMS lb12 ands its very expensive.

Coax's are a good idea but you have to get a good one, so expensive again.

 

[kevinr]

The AN cast frame 12's are great , big soundstage and good sound.
But in a tall 2.8 cu. ft. at my house the bass was fairly lean . I didn't have the room for a 6 ft. cabinet for them nor the space or inclination for adding subwoofers.

 

[el`Ol]

One could also think about the Isophon Orchester, but putting a German classic into an American vintage enclosure seem a bit weird.
http://www.ebay.de/sch/i.html?_trks...ter&_nkw=isophon+orchester&_sacat=0&_from=R40

 

[norman bates]

having never heard one, I'll 4th the an12.

I think the 12" audio nirvana would be sweet with a 10 band equalizer ($300 pair + $30 10 band eq from pawn shop).

That Nirvana driver wants a big ported or open baffle, but if you seal it, it might be ok.

That box you have is 16" wide and 24" deep ?
If you surround the back of the driver with foam, you may like it as an "open backed box", but you may want a subwoofer with it also, and placement will be tricky.

Bigun had luck with an open backed box 2' wide x 2' deep x 4' tall.

I'm more into hinged wings, but you already have a box completed, and it looks retro cool also.

Norman

 

[murphythecat8]

I wouldn't bet on a modern driver necessarily improving on it. Maybe, maybe not. There aren't all that many good ones out there. The ANs might be, but I've seen a pair of the 12s measure a long way off advertised spec. so YMMV. The automatic recommendation would be the Great Planes Audio built Altec Model 212-8A, but I suspect you'd need to save up a while longer. And ideally, build a box that would do proper justice to them.

As Jeff says, you might want to consider the pro-market; either a good coax or something like a big Eminence widebander with tweeter support.

Some damping in the box wouldn't go amiss.

that pretty much
I would go with a BC coaxial, or the great plains audio.
then add sub

 

[IG81]

The fact that this enclosure is vented is not especially forgiving to blind driver swaps. You've got your internal volume figured out to just a bit under 3.5cu.f, (~95L) and the vent's diameter + length would let you know the helmholtz resonance (tuning). I'll also suggest looking at 12" pro coaxials and believe you've given yourself a budget that can get you a decent pair. Simulate them in WinISD (or similar) with the 3.5cu.f volume, see if either a sealed box, or a vented box of the same tuning or higher is suitable, as it'd be easy to trim the long vent if it tunes too low. You can also often buy crossovers from the same manufacturer.

IG

 

[Godzilla]

http://www.parts-express.com/pedocs/more-info/290-504-eminence-beta-12cx-more-info.pdf

Scroll down to see the 3.5cf box. F3 is 51Hz with a 4" x 5.5" long port. The spec sheet even says "Great for use with small tube amps."

Perhaps you can call Eminence and tell them what you want to do so they can recommend a tweeter and crossover.

 

[Godzilla]

Oh, I see there's a cutout for a tweeter already. Maybe you can unscrew it, measure and find something that screws right into place. Then you can go with a pro 12" that doesn't have to be wideband. You can also do the Eminence Beta12lta if you decide to go the tweeter route. 3.4cf box will work without a subwoofer.

Whatever you do, this project has the potential to sound incredible!

Zilla

 

[sreten]

Hi,

The 12" driver you have doesn't look too shabby in the slightest.

Improvements IMO would be using that driver with a x/o and a
suitable topend horn that the cabinet seems to have provision for.

However I'm suspecting the current driver is coaxial from the wiring.

rgds, sreten.

 

[grindstone]

Exactly. Those are sweet old coaxes w/ little horns and might warrant a bit of run-time. Total guess is that they simply run out of steam 12kHz or something and might need some air on top. Is that remotely close to the fidelity you seek to add?

 

[freddi]

I believe those are Goodmans coaxials made in England ( a picture of their front would help) - hopefully they're as good or better than Eminence. I've never had the opportunity to hear Goodmans and they can fetch high money. A helper tweeter fed with a small capacitor should make them sound more lively and improve subjective bass. Selenium's phenolic slot tweeters were nice but discontinued.