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Grundig is better than PassLabs, there's no matter!
Grundig is better than PassLabs, there's no matter!
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Old 12th March 2021, 09:25 AM   #41
bitsandbobs is offline bitsandbobs  United Kingdom
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Well I now have a Grundig V1700 (actually two by chance - at least this gives me a choice in case one is a little under par).


It's funny how low key this amp is - and I can certainly understand the regular snobby audiophile wanting something far better looking and tactile than this!



But the proof is in the pudding so to speak. After all we are listening to music not looking at it.



I remain open minded - and now looking into their recommended speaker cables and interconnects - you won't believe their choices! Super cheap bits of string and no audiophile mooring ropes here.
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Old 12th March 2021, 09:38 AM   #42
Lampie519 is offline Lampie519  Netherlands
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Grundig V1700 | GRUNDIG love

Grundig V1700 | Goldfich-mod

Sanyo JA-220: tweakage léger

Stereoverstarker V-1700 Ampl/Mixer Grundig Radio-Vertrieb, R

Looks like some people are really into this thing.

Last edited by Lampie519; 12th March 2021 at 09:45 AM.
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Old 12th March 2021, 11:54 AM   #43
bitsandbobs is offline bitsandbobs  United Kingdom
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Well yes - some people are. But rather than read their experiences and wonder (because most of use here to be honest would not believe half of that stuff) - I am actively seeking out the kit (which is cheap enough) and trying this out for myself.


The proof is with me not anything online. Then I can sell it on if it does not live up to those heady expectations.


However wouldn't it be funny if they really are that good!


Luckily I already own a pair of one of their recommended speakers that work with Grundig amps - so I am more than halfway there now.
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Old 12th March 2021, 11:59 AM   #44
analog_sa is online now analog_sa  Europe
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Grundig is better than PassLabs, there's no matter!
Why is the V-1700 even remotely interesting? A most generic topology, apart from that freaky NFB tone control, but the Japanese were doing the same at the time. Perhaps the sixties stuff, which at least had Ge semis, may deserve some attention, but this is just too bland.
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Old 12th March 2021, 12:05 PM   #45
bucks bunny is online now bucks bunny  Germany
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Some derogative slogans from the german service people were
"Ist die Rückwand fort bei Grundig - wird die Sch***e offenkundig"
"Innen Schrott und außen pfundig - das ist Grundig"
personnally I do not share this. Grundig was neither bad nor exceptionnally good imho, just solid consumer range.
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Old 12th March 2021, 12:17 PM   #46
anatech is offline anatech  Canada
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Grundig is better than PassLabs, there's no matter!
Hi bitsandbobs,
By all means - build it! This is DIY after all.

The circuit will probably sound good, and if you use good components it will sound better than the original. Hint: Use great care matching the diff pairs (Q701-702, 801-802) and couple them together thermally. That will give you low and stable DC offset and also reduce distortion to the minimum for that circuit.

If you use modern semi's, the outputs are greatly improved, you will build a good amp. The new PCB should be miles better too. There isn't anything wrong with the schematic. The original was a cheap, crappy build. Even the PCB was cheap. Using modern glass epoxy PCB material with a better layout will generate a good amplifier. It will not be a Grundig because you build quality will be much higher (you can't help it).

I think you will be happy with it. Just understand that you will have eliminated all things Grundig (cheap, poor construction). That schematic is fairly typical as was pointed out, and it is a good performer. Really, the quality is now determined by the PCB layout and your ability to closely match the input pair.

If you want a great amplifier, buy a pair of Linear Systems matched PNP transistors in a TO-71 or TO-78 case. IT130 or IT130A would work fine. Digikey is apparently in the process of setting Linear Systems up as a product line.

-Chris
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Old 12th March 2021, 12:20 PM   #47
Lampie519 is offline Lampie519  Netherlands
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bucks bunny View Post
Grundig was neither bad nor exceptionnally good imho, just solid consumer range.
They made great Short Wave radio's !
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Old 12th March 2021, 12:32 PM   #48
bitsandbobs is offline bitsandbobs  United Kingdom
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Quote:
Originally Posted by analog_sa View Post
Why is the V-1700 even remotely interesting? A most generic topology, apart from that freaky NFB tone control, but the Japanese were doing the same at the time. Perhaps the sixties stuff, which at least had Ge semis, may deserve some attention, but this is just too bland.

Well it's only interesting to me because of the hype it's getting on one of the forums. Anyone, however, can stir up some sort of hype - but - this one seems to have a following.



No idea about the topology and the influence it has - plus yes this is really bland - but you know what, how does it "sound" against all the odds? That's why I'm putting together a system from Grundig and finding out for myself. No harm in that. In fact it could be enlightening.
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Old 12th March 2021, 12:39 PM   #49
bucks bunny is online now bucks bunny  Germany
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lampie519 View Post
They made great Short Wave radio's !
I don't know these - had the tape machines like TK14 or TK23 in mind. Which tells us that general statements about one brand are most of the time meaningless.
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Old 12th March 2021, 01:25 PM   #50
analog_sa is online now analog_sa  Europe
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Grundig is better than PassLabs, there's no matter!
I've grown up surrounded with Grundig and Philips stuff. All my friends and schoolmates had the same: Grundig, Tele, Saba. Japanese stuff arrived a bit later. And yes, of course, at some stage we had a Sattelit 2000 at home too.

None of these ever sounded bad. In stark contrast to the long Sony/Technics sequence that followed. Not quite spectacular, but very musical and easy going. I think i finally got rid of the last of that ilk, a Grundig Studio 1600, before my last big move. Perfect stuff for anyone not ready do dive into audiophile madness

No way to be certain, but perhaps the old Philips/Roe/Frako caps were at least partially responsible for the pleasant, musical sound of that equipment.
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